[Misc] Will the Unions bring everyone to their knees?

[Icy Gull]

Ok, so you deserve some kind of reward for working hard but these people don't?

"Grown men" stand up for others and show solidarity with the common man, they don't expect people to be doing slave work so they can go on a holiday. imo.

I feel no envy for people who can afford a stunning big house, a luxury car and 5 star holidays flying First class. Good luck to them I say. Doesn't mean I don't have sympathy for people who are struggling around the poverty line and can't afford a holiday, but thinking it's OK for those that can afford it to have the best two weeks of their year ****ed up by staff striking is just bloody weird, again just imo.

 

[Icy Gull]

This is certainly a case for "be careful what you wish for".

Just as the rail unions risk support moving back to the government after a couple of months of disruption, this could signal the end of check in staff as we know it. Already you mostly check in online and do a bag drop at any major airport with perhaps the odd one or two staff to do business and first class. The non-reinstatement of the 10% each year looks to me like a way to make the removal of the role permanent.

I may have misread it but the airline have agreed to reinstate the 10% this year but not thereafter? Given what has happened would it not be politic to let this ride for a few months if this is the case?

 

[Chicken Run]

I tell you what's getting restless, my banning finger as you continue to use disparaging epithets for people for no apparent reason as if you were still chucking your own poo round the bear pit. Please try and be a bit more respectful on the main board,

No apparent reason [emoji2357] All she does all day is re quote shit on the main board from “Twitter”


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[Springal]

The automatic bag drop is already in place at LHR/LGW/MAN

Yeah - but any kind of issue or document check and you have to see a human. Which happens a lot. Even more so post covid.

Flew business on BA from LHR last month - had to queue for 15mins for whatever needed to be sorted to be sorted. Economy queues were even worse.

Taking away 10% and not giving it back is scum bag behaviour. Especially given the wages they are already on - expecting to be in commuting distance from Heathrow (seen the cost of living in Berkshire, Surrey or London)

IAG gave out €4.1Bn in shareholder dividends 2015-2019. Maybe they should have kept a little bit back to look after their staff just as well?

 

[Triggaaar]

https://news.sky.com/story/rail-str...als-compare-to-what-train-staff-want-12638506

some good info on what the sectors earn here. Rail wise aside from drivers and higher paid roles the average is 33k. Guess its then down to whether the roles are worth more. Isnt the UK average now 36k ?

IMO -
Teachers 30k seems low
Police 24k - very very low IMO

Must admit , comparatively speking - 33k for a ticket office and train guard seems an ok wage for a fairly easy job

All opinions on that

Yeah it's not easy to judge what is fair and isn't between different sectors. £59k for a train driver certainly seems pretty good, and £33k for a job that doesn't sound like it needs a lot of qualifications (compared to say teaching or nursing) also seems reasonable.

What would damage the country the most:
3 years with no teachers
3 years with no rail service
3 years with no nurses

The issue I have is that while each service is absolutely necessary, the effect of a short term strike is worse for some industries than others. Railways could get away with shutting the entire service, causing huge problems for the country. Nurses simply wouldn't be allowed to do that, because too many people would die. Teachers could do it and it would just piss off some parents, but there'd be little damage to the country from their strike.

So does that mean we should pay teachers less than those in the other industries, because their strikes aren't as damaging? And pay railway workers more than the rest, because they're able to cause huge problems?

 

[Triggaaar]

It doesn't really matter who is paid the most or least across industries - the whole point of a fair taxation system is to even up some of the inequalities that the free market brings. If teachers or firefighters feel they are under appreciated then they need to go on strike too.

As above, the effect of a short term teacher strike is not as bad as a railway strike, so it doesn't work as well for them.

And yes, it does need proving that the rail service is key.

I disagree. I'd have thought it was obvious to everyone that it's a key industry.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Yeah - but any kind of issue or document check and you have to see a human. Which happens a lot. Even more so post covid.

Flew business on BA from LHR last month - had to queue for 15mins for whatever needed to be sorted to be sorted. Economy queues were even worse.

Taking away 10% and not giving it back is scum bag behaviour. Especially given the wages they are already on - expecting to be in commuting distance from Heathrow (seen the cost of living in Berkshire, Surrey or London)

IAG gave out €4.1Bn in shareholder dividends 2015-2019. Maybe they should have kept a little bit back to look after their staff just as well?

Doc checking is returning back to normal, I’m sure there is a system on its way as well for doc checking, QR codes for Covid passes is already in use.

The technology is almost here, it won’t be long till it’s like a automatic check out with a handful of staff.

 

[Triggaaar]

The vast majority of train drivers aren’t on strike.

Then swap 'train drivers' for those who are on strike. Are they the worst paid (for the hours, conditions, skills required etc) when compared to the NHS, police, firefighters, teachers, and armed forces?

 

[Lever]

Then swap 'train drivers' for those who are on strike. Are they the worst paid (for the hours, conditions, skills required etc) when compared to the NHS, police, firefighters, teachers, and armed forces?

Maybe read this?

https://www.dazeddigital.com/politi...eal-reasons-young-rmt-workers-are-striking-uk

 

[A1X]

[tweet]1539176468630077440[/tweet]

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[Guinness Boy]

I may have misread it but the airline have agreed to reinstate the 10% this year but not thereafter? Given what has happened would it not be politic to let this ride for a few months if this is the case?

That's what the unions claim, yes. As for the second point, it really depends on how much disruption you want to cause.

 

[Icy Gull]

That's what the unions claim, yes. As for the second point, it really depends on how much disruption you want to cause.

Well exactly and not a good look imo

 

[Guinness Boy]

No apparent reason [emoji2357] All she does all day is re quote shit on the main board from “Twitter”


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It really isn't.

However, my point was more around the fact that, only on Sunday, there had to be mod intervention on the Tory Meltdown thread, which was temporarily at Bear Pit levels, with the highlight being you calling [MENTION=11928]vegster[/MENTION] "Vegetable" for no apparent reason. I said not to do it on that thread, yet here you are doing it on another thread and lucky that it's only that technicality saving you from yet another infraction, something I'm sure you're acutely aware of.

And, yes, I've noticed [MENTION=35196]Is it PotG?[/MENTION] doing it with "GAP" and no doubt sniggering to himself at his cleverness.

Pack it in the pair of you. I assume you do want right of centre voices on these threads? If your case is strong enough you can do it without the name calling, one sentence ad hominem, shit stirring and deflections.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Well exactly and not a good look imo

I agree. However, strike with minimum effect = not an effective strike. Strike with maximum disruption = not a popular strike (and quite selfish too). I guess the unions have gone for option 2 to pile more pressure on the government.

However, holidays ARE a luxury, If teachers go on strike when most school age kids are up to 2 years behind on their normal education thanks to Covid, they will be exhibiting a level of moral bankruptcy not far off the government they're seeking to protest against. Of all three sectors, rail workers, check in staff and teachers, it's teachers who I believe should be looked after the most after the last few years and I fully back them getting a decent, cost of living based wage rise, but I hope they find other forms of industrial action and the harnessing of parent power, rather than using children who are the furthest behind as political footballs.

 

[Triggaaar]

Maybe read this?

https://www.dazeddigital.com/politi...eal-reasons-young-rmt-workers-are-striking-uk

That suggests that working hours need to be improved for some staff. And maybe pay for cleaners too. That doesn't require an 11% pay rise for all staff though.

 

[Triggaaar]

I wonder how many employees on NSC will be getting a pay rise in line with inflation. We won't be getting much if anything in our household.

 

[The Clamp]

I agree. However, strike with minimum effect = not an effective strike. Strike with maximum disruption = not a popular strike (and quite selfish too). I guess the unions have gone for option 2 to pile more pressure on the government.

However, holidays ARE a luxury, If teachers go on strike when most school age kids are up to 2 years behind on their normal education thanks to Covid, they will be exhibiting a level of moral bankruptcy not far off the government they're seeking to protest against. Of all three sectors, rail workers, check in staff and teachers, it's teachers who I believe should be looked after the most after the last few years and I fully back them getting a decent, cost of living based wage rise, but I hope they find other forms of industrial action and the harnessing of parent power, rather than using children who are the furthest behind as political footballs.

While I agree with the main thrust, I think it’s arguable that holidays are a luxury in a sense.
I think they are vital for maintaining good mental health and family bonding.

Maybe instead of striking, teachers could just start teaching kids absolute gibberish only returning to teaching facts when they get a pay rise

 

[The Clamp]

I wonder how many employees on NSC will be getting a pay rise in line with inflation. We won't be getting much if anything in our household.

Same. However, I’m not in a position to demand the government act honourably. If I was, I most certainly would.

If I demanded similar of my boss, he’d simply replace me. Something I hope in vain that the government does something about, as they have been promising to do since 2014.

 

[Chicken Run]

Same. However, I’m not in a position to demand the government act honourably. If I was, I most certainly would.

If I demanded similar of my boss, he’d simply replace me. Something I hope in vain that the government does something about, as they have been promising to do since 2014.

Are you easy to replace?


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[Neville's Breakfast]

I agree. However, strike with minimum effect = not an effective strike. Strike with maximum disruption = not a popular strike (and quite selfish too). I guess the unions have gone for option 2 to pile more pressure on the government.

However, holidays ARE a luxury, If teachers go on strike when most school age kids are up to 2 years behind on their normal education thanks to Covid, they will be exhibiting a level of moral bankruptcy not far off the government they're seeking to protest against. Of all three sectors, rail workers, check in staff and teachers, it's teachers who I believe should be looked after the most after the last few years and I fully back them getting a decent, cost of living based wage rise, but I hope they find other forms of industrial action and the harnessing of parent power, rather than using children who are the furthest behind as political footballs.

I honestly can’t see teachers going on strike. Every one I know cares more about those two lost years of learning and it’s behavioural consequences than they do about money. Nothing scientific, just a gut feel. A low pay award won’t help with much needed recruitment though.