Using disability labels to extract the michael – what is acceptable on NSC?

[hans kraay fan club]

ha ha, reminds of the time I had to sit in the family stand at Withdean with my two boys and one family were singing 'the referee's a dunker'

I paused and wondered if he was a hobnob or a rich tea kind of ref

We had "The referee's a GANGSTER"

and

"oooooOOOOOOOOOOOOH, More chips Aaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh!"

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

I suppose calling somebody a "Nigel" is also non PC as you could be referring to their disability.

 

[HAILSHAM SEAGULL]

Its all gonna kick off when Matt Sparrow scores again............SPAZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

 

[rool]

The words spastic and mong I find the most offensive on here, there is never any need to use them.

I think the kind of posters that would use those words are usually just fishing for a reaction.
The thing I didn't like, and it's probably personal to me, is the picture of the downs syndrome kiddy winning a race which is usually used to call someone 'special'. I do believe that one of our favourite mods even had it as an avatar with a Glen Murray face superimposed but I could be wrong on that.

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

I always thought the term "muppet" was relativey safe and inoffensive, but a while ago I said it someone, really in quite a jokey way (I thought), and he really took offence and I thought he was going to hit me - the Muppet.

Was it Miss Piggy

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

Interesting how some cronic disabilities are targgetted for derogortory use.
I'm an insulin depenant diabetic [a disability in its own right] - people who know that I am don't call me a "diabetic" and if they did, I wouldn't care, because I am one.
Maybe. its the difference between a disability that is evident to one that is transparrent - I hated being called "four-eyes" before I wore contacts ....

 

[Carrot Cruncher]

Double post

 

[rool]

Going on from what Simster says, anyone with a modicum of common sense and a basic vocabulary should be able to modify their behaviour and vernacular appropriately. Whilst I may have used words like the above with my mates, I know that words l

Well controlled, you were going to say something there you would have regretted

 

[Carrot Cruncher]

Going on from what Simster says, anyone with a modicum of common sense and a basic vocabulary should be able to modify their behaviour and vernacular appropriately. Whilst I may have used words like the above with my mates, I know that words like those are likely to offend someone so I wouldn't do it. Same as you may go to the football and every other word could be dropping the 'c' bomb, but you wouldn't go to a coffee morning with your Grandmother and do the same (unless it was on the Isle of Dogs I suppose...).

Shouldn't really be that difficult, especially as you have to think about what you're typing rather than just blurting it out.

 

[rool]

I suppose calling somebody a "Nigel" is also non PC as you could be referring to their disability.

Only El Presidente gets offended by that

 

[Carrot Cruncher]

Well controlled, you were going to say something there you would have regretted

Bloody iPhone!

 

[Storer 68]

I am intensley offended by such terms. No one needs to use these words. We are all people. Some are different, some are not. If I won't use a word to describe a member of my family, why should I use it for someone else's

 

[WATFORD zero]

Calling someone 'a person who has done something which has an outcome which they did not expect and which they would not normally do, but not to infer any mental disability either temporary or permanent' doesn't roll off the tongue like idiot, cretin, moron etc all of which have historically come from classification of disability.

Trouble is that the person who is giving the insult defines it's true meaning, but it is the receiver or third party then normally interprets the meaning and gets offended, rightly or wrongly

 

[hitony]

Title of the thread changed slightly at the thread starters request.

 

[Triggaaar]

Blimey.

NO but you will doubtless face the usual "grow a pair" "nanny state" and similar jibes for daring to suggest that the world has moved on

No problem, I certainly appreciate that most of us feel there are examples of political correctness gone mad in our country. Hopefully most won't feel this is, but I think it's worthy of discussion.

'Spastic' used a derogatory way, is a banned term on NSC and will always be removed.

I didn't know there were banned terms. I guess I think we should all be on the same page, and understand what is and isn't acceptable. That way we can self moderate a little more, instead of always needing a mod to edit a post after people have been offended.

Maybe it's simply that as a society we're knocking off discrimination one 'flavour' at a time - race has been targeted for some time, homophobia is in focus currently and maybe disability will be next.

Yes that may be the case. Disability discrimination is being tackled in relation to access (buses, shops, workplace etc), but it's not always as in your face in language as racism and homophobia (eg, not in many footy chants).

It is an interesting one, that the word "idiot" originally did mean someone with learning difficulties.

A good point and why it's handy to talk about it. I'm 40 and never heard someone use 'idiot' to describe someone who is disabled, which makes a difference. I have of course heard 'spastic' (complete with facial impressions) in such a way. Maybe in 100 years it'll have a different meaning and be less offensive.

Fascinating reading:
Disability...

Yes good point, thanks.

I'm struggling to see where we draw the line on this, it's a massive grey area and a lot of these words mean different things depending on when you grew up.

Agreed.

Personally I think it should be all or nothing, people are only offended if that particular term is close to home as in triggaar's case. Unless It's a direct insult directed at someone with learning difficulties, it shouldn't be taken personally. Definitely a "man up" situation, and I'm allowed to say that because my mum spent the last 10 years of her life in a wheelchair unable to do much at all for herself.

You're allowed to say it's a 'man up' situation because that's your opinion, but I don't think any of us can say that's it's more than our opinion regardless of our circumstances.

I agree that it's mostly particular people (like me) that are offended, but we obviously have a decent number of disabled fans here, and if they're not fully mobile there's a good chance they'll spend time on NSC. Supporting BHA is an example of something a lot of them can join in just as much as anyone else, and putting myself in the position of my children I imagine it would be awful to not be able to join in here because of constant reminders that you're different and a point of ridicule.

 

[rool]

Title of the thread changed slightly at the thread starters request.

I have an uncle named michael

 

[hitony]

I have an uncle named michael

I have a grandson named Michael as well........but fair play when i read your post it did make me laugh

 

[tezz79]

The users and moderators of NSC are in agreement that homophobia and racism aren’t acceptable here, and I’d like to know how everyone feels about language that’s offensive to the disabled.

My two children have cerebral palsy (ie, they would have been described as spastics, but that’s not PC anymore). I find posts that use spastic as a derogatory term annoying, but more than that I imagine my kids using this board, sharing their love of the Albion, and wondering why others think their disability is something to ridicule. Consequently I report posts that use that term in a derogatory manor. Other terms like ‘retard’ are used quite frequently here, which some users will find offensive.

So, do you think it’s unacceptable for people to use these words in a derogatory manor on NSC?

I know what you mean mate, as I think you've read some of debate I had with rosa on the moon landing thread I also have a son with very severe cerebral palsy (among other things)
I do find the term spastic VERY offensive but you'll find it's usually people as thick as shit that throw that term around, they obviously don't know much about the condition which varies massively from case to case so I tend to not let it wind me up (unless it was aimed directly at my son of course)
Retard is a strange one as it is also very offensive but it seems to be acceptable for people to say .... You'll often hear people use the term without giving it a 2nd thought, people who wouldn't dream of intentually mocking a disability so I'm not sure people know exactly what they are saying when they call somebody a retard..... Anyway mate f*** em !!! They know little of the day to day struggles of such illnesses & wouldn't have the brain power, heart or commitment to deal with it so just think yourself & your kids far superior to anybody who throws those terms around.

Like somebody said earlier everybody will be offended by something on NSC at one time or another so I usually ignore it as most people using these terms do not do it with disabled people in mind.... I don't report posters that use such terms as again I'm not sure they know what they're actually saying, I've only ever reported 1 post & that was because it was a post with remarks aimed directly at me (as a father) & my son..... If I could have met this person face to face then there would have been no need to report it

 

[Cadiz Seagull]

Clearly using a descriptive word in derogatary sense is wrong, but there is also the question of the abuse to consider.

If I describe Lua-Lua as a black b*****d then most people would think that was racist abuse and unacceptable. Including me.

But what if I call him a black George Best? Is that unacceptable and if so why? It's far from derogatory, in fact it's the very opposite.

As Bozza said, a can of worms.

 

[Triggaaar]

In school, kids use a lot of terms they don't actually realise mean anything other than a jibe.

I don't think it's just kids, I think it's all of us. I honestly have no idea of the meaning of half the words we're discussing.

I'm saying that poeple get offended by different different things and that you can't stop someone from saying something because it may offend someone.
If I call you a mong you may be offended, but if I call someone else a mong they might not mind. Do we have to ban sayings like 'you are mental' or 'you are an alky' because someone with ansane or alcoholic relative might be offended? Where do we stop?

Of course where we stop is a grey area and open to debate, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

When calling someone a <insert non-pc word> it's not normally the person your trying to insult that is the most offended. It's the person + family members/friends of the person with a disability that is offended, which is why it would be better to use a different word.

Words like mong etc are not offensive to me if written on a forum board...it's the way of expression of your feelings ,as someone else says on here as you cannot put a tone down in words. But if it is said directly to a disabled person then that is very offensive.

As above, it doesn't need to be said to a disabled person for it to offend them. When reading chat between others, and the way they insult each other is by suggesting they're like the disabled person, that's pretty bloody offensive.

I think the kind of posters that would use those words are usually just fishing for a reaction.

Maybe sometimes, but most of the examples I've seen will be from people totally unaware that their comment will offend people other than the person they're trying to insult.