Three Lions In The Dirt

[Gwylan]

Sven's England sides invariably went backwards after half-time. He had his moments and we haven't drubbed a top side since we murdered Germany 5-1 in Munich 9 years ago.

Top sides are very rarely drubbed though so it's not really a fair comparison. How many four or five goal victories against top class opposition have Italy or Spain had?

Under Sven we beat Argentina (twice), Croatia (something that eluded his successor - twice) and the afore-mentioned Germany. More to the point, we only lost three competitive matches in six years - and two of those were to France and Brazil.

I personally believe that England will never again reach three successive QFs in major tournaments in my lifetime - not without a major structural overhaul.

 

[Brovion]

...I personally believe that England will never again reach three successive QFs in major tournaments in my lifetime - not without a major structural overhaul.

The usual argument against SGE is that "he should have done better with the players he had", which as Pav has pointed out by listing previous England players is an argument that doesn't hold water. He had three successful qualifying campaigns (one of which he had to rescue after Keegan had screwed it up) and three QFs. Even if we accept the 'Golden Generation were the best since 1970' view they weren't that much better than previous England squads (certainly not from 1988 onwards) and thus SGE deserves the plaudits. Those who still can't admit he was one of Engand's best managers are just being stupid. Proof being that the next manager with the same group of players couldn't even qualify for the next tournament - and yet McClaren's subsequent achievements show he was no mug.

And for those who think discussing SGE is simply going over old ground you're right - but some England fans never seem to learn.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

I'm not saying that at all. Things were clearly shit under McLaren - he didn't beat a "big" nation and failed to qualify for Euro 2008. But nobody pretended that McLaren was a big-name manager as they did with Cappello.

McLaren was sacked and, I'd argue, so should Cappello be. In 1994 we turned to Venables and it worked. There are many things Redknapp has in common with Venables, so I'd argue he needs to be the next permanent manager.

Some people are beginning to talk about Sven in whistful tones. That says it all.

Was Venables all that good. In his only competitive games he drew with Switzerland, beat the scots and Holland, drew with Spain and drew with Germany.

Biggest shame IMO is that the FA forced Hoddle to resign.

 

[Gwylan]

Was Venables all that good. In his only competitive games he drew with Switzerland, beat the scots and Holland, drew with Spain and drew with Germany.

Biggest shame IMO is that the FA forced Hoddle to resign.

If Sven is underrated as a manager then El Tel is the most overrated. That little synopsis doesn't give the whole picture: if Scotland had scored with a penalty, that match would probably have been drawn. The Holland match was against a team that was virtually at war with each other and we were battered by Spain - and benefited from some dodgy reffing decisions. And we had home advantage in all of those games, something no England manager has had for nearly 50 years.

I also thought Hoddle was a decent manager and were beginning to make some progress. The trouble is that he was a cock of the first order.

 

[Icy Gull]

If Sven is underrated as a manager then El Tel is the most overrated. .

I know how you champion Sven but apart from a bit of success at Man City (more due to a big influx of cash than his abilities imo) he really has done f*** all since he had the England job. Why do you think that is?

Sven may have a cv that reads well as an England manager but it was his negative tactics that turned me off watching England. He proved to be a frightened rabbit in the headlines when we had the chance to really prove something - Those Brazil and France defeats were totally down to his lack of a plan B. Negative should have been his middle name.

Please stop building him up as some sort of example of the kind of manager we'd all like, because I don't want anyone like him again thanks.

 

[the right footed denilson]

Look what he's done with Gareth Bale, Huddlestone, Dawson.

He inherited 3 of the best young players in Britain and they turned out to be good. Genius. It took him a year to work out GB couldn't defend FFS! He isn't the answer.

 

[Gwylan]

I know how you champion Sven but apart from a bit of success at Man City (more due to a big influx of cash than his abilities imo) he really has done f*** all since he had the England job. Why do you think that is?

Sven may have a cv that reads well as an England manager but it was his negative tactics that turned me off watching England. He proved to be a frightened rabbit in the headlines when we had the chance to really prove something - Those Brazil and France defeats were totally down to his lack of a plan B. Negative should have been his middle name.

Please stop building him up as some sort of example of the kind of manager we'd all like, because I don't want anyone like him again thanks.

I don't really see myself as a champion of Sven - i just think that he was treated like some sort of clown because he looked like Mr Burns and seemed to think more about shagging women than managing football teams.

He was appointed by England because he had a pretty good record as a manager across Europe, so he didn't get the job as a newbie. Since then, he did well at City (and the big bucks came later), made a mess of Mexico, but did well for Ivory Coast in the WC, He's got off to a decent start at Leicester too, winning four out of eight for a club near bottom.

His overall win percentage is 52% - pretty high for a manager. And he has the second best record of any England manager. I don't understand why that isn't good enough.

And yes, his teams aren't exactly inspiring but neither are Mourinho's and he's done Ok for himself too.

 

[Icy Gull]

. Since then, he did well at City (and the big bucks came later), .

Really? 40 million in the close season alone sounds like big bucks to me for a team who'd had very little to spend the previous season and you would expect an improvement.

SVEN Goran Eriksson spent nearly [pounds sterling]40million at Manchester | Daily Mail (London, England), The Newspaper | Find Articles at BNET

Anyway we'll have to continue begging to differ on Sven.

 

[e77]

Maybe the new training centre is the start of the long term recovery?

 

[Pavilionaire]

Top sides are very rarely drubbed though so it's not really a fair comparison. How many four or five goal victories against top class opposition have Italy or Spain had?

Interesting you say that in the week Portugal beat a full-strength Spain 4-0 and not long after Germany cuffed us 4-1 in the World Cup.

 

[Gwylan]

Interesting you say that in the week Portugal beat a full-strength Spain 4-0 and not long after Germany cuffed us 4-1 in the World Cup.

And Germany beat Argentina 4-0. They're still rare though. I can't be arsed to look but I bet if you looked at the games for the top 15 teams, say, in the last five or six years, there'd be very few that conceded four or five goals.