So In 20 years time when the oil runs out ..

[ditchy]

Its Nuke time and a lot of wind turbines hydoelectric dams and tidal power schemes coupled with your electric powered car

 

[Brovion]

Everyone goes on about when the oil 'runs out' but the trouble will actually start much earlier than that when supply reduces to the point where it can no longer match the demand. In other words there will still be oil but we'll be fighting the Chinese for it.

Hopefully global warming will help. Apparently with increased drought etc fresh water is going to be the 'new oil' in which case Scotland's going to be the new Saudi Arabia. If they become independant I'm playing my 'Scottish Granny' card and emigrating there!

 

[desprateseagull]

i guess the petrol price will start creeping up until the government steps in to fix prices, or they may be nasty scenes- fighting at the pumps, car jacking etc (think 'Mad Max').

either that, or people will have realised we are in the smekky stuff, and start mass producing wind turbines etc.

dunno how it works, but how about some kind of generator that is fed by people walking sensors in the pavement? as there will be no cars..

 

[Trufflehound]

Personally I thinking about buying a beach side villa in Hawaii what are your plans for the next millennium !!

Bad move, since the the rise in sea levels will see you wiped out in no time.

A small retreat in the mountains for me.

 

[Trufflehound]

Everyone goes on about when the oil 'runs out' but the trouble will actually start much earlier than that when supply reduces to the point where it can no longer match the demand. In other words there will still be oil but we'll be fighting the Chinese for it.

Ah yes, the fabled "peak oil". Many observers say we have already reached this point. Aren't we already fighting the Iraqis over oil?

 

[Brovion]

Ah yes, the fabled "peak oil". Many observers say we have already reached this point. Aren't we already fighting the Iraqis over oil?

I don't think we've reached it. I'm not an oil industry expert but I believe that world oil production still outstrips world oil demand and any shortages are artificially created by the producers/suppliers to keep prices high.

 

[ditchy]

Oil production does outstrip supply and indeed is "fixed" controlled or what ever you want to call it, by the suppliers and government. Look at our price howmuch of that is fixed by Greedy Gordon ?

 

[Lammy]

One word;

Biodiesel.

Carbon Neutral and it doesn't involve the Middle East

Available here. No need to modify your diesel engine.


Shabitat
Saunder's Park
Lewes Road
Brighton
East Sussex
BN2 4AY
tel: 01273 677577

 

[swissseagull]

Biodiesel is not the answer. Rain forests are being destroyed to make way for palm trees that produce biodiesel (so co2 rises). Agricultural land that we're going to need to feed an ever increasing population is being used to produce biodiesel.
Check out the facts: http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/#more-964
As to peak oil, once we reach peak, the price will rocket because demand outstrips supply. There is no cheap alternative or technological fix.
Electricity is also going to be a major problem in the next 10 to 15 years. The climate is also going to cause major migration, starvation and land loss. Our system was built on and requires cheap non renewable resources that will run out in our lifetimes. It doesn't have or want an alternative as it's controlled by those who wont be affected (the rich) and those who control these resources. Basically, we're being lead up the garden path into oblivion.
But you know all this right? Surely you all read your local Brighton newspaper http://www.schnews.org.uk/

 

[Brovion]

Schnews! Great paper. Supported them financially in the past.

 

[Lammy]

Biodiesel is not the answer. Rain forests are being destroyed to make way for palm trees that produce biodiesel (so co2 rises). Agricultural land that we're going to need to feed an ever increasing population is being used to produce biodiesel.
Check out the facts: http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2005/12/06/worse-than-fossil-fuel/#more-964
As to peak oil, once we reach peak, the price will rocket because demand outstrips supply. There is no cheap alternative or technological fix.
Electricity is also going to be a major problem in the next 10 to 15 years. The climate is also going to cause major migration, starvation and land loss. Our system was built on and requires cheap non renewable resources that will run out in our lifetimes. It doesn't have or want an alternative as it's controlled by those who wont be affected (the rich) and those who control these resources. Basically, we're being lead up the garden path into oblivion.
But you know all this right? Surely you all read your local Brighton newspaper http://www.schnews.org.uk/

I don't buy into that way of thinking at all!

biofuel can be produced from USED chip fat. This is already being created and farmed. We also don't need to import biofuel as we can create it here. Rain forests are being distroyed because or weak governments in the countries that have the rainforests. They are being distrupyed for a number of reasons. Biofuel is only one of them. Not using biofuel will not save the rainforests.

 

[Man of Harveys]

I don't think we've reached it. I'm not an oil industry expert but I believe that world oil production still outstrips world oil demand and any shortages are artificially created by the producers/suppliers to keep prices high.

Well...to a point. I think it's probably a bit strong to say that shortages are artificially created to keep prices high - it's more likely that Opec don't want to open the taps completely amongst the sort of insane recent rises in demand from China, India and Brazil so that their reserves don't run out too fast. And the Saudis don't want people to know that, hence Gordon Brown's asking for "transparency" about reserves recently, i.e. "let us know if the desert's running out of oil and we're about to enter the stone age please".

Watch out for non-Opec countries - there is a theory that undiscovered oil in places like the west coast of Africa (obviously NOT around the already-massive production area centred on Nigeria) could solve everything but these fields keep turning up with smaller reserves than expected.

(I feel WEIRD talking about work on NSC. It's like talking about SEX with your PARENTS.)

 

[Lammy]

Another point worth mentioning is that there is NO ONE ANSWER. It's going to be a combination of solutions;

nuclear will no doubt pick up the bulk of the immediate power needs in the short term at least. I can homes being responisible for their own power generating to a certain extent, with the use of solar roofs and wind turbines. More efficient appliances. Tax breaks for energy efficient light bulbs etc to make them more affordable.

Rain water from the roof can be filtered and used for flushing toilets, watering the garden and washing the car.

More people will be able to work from home due to much better communication links. Forign business travel will also be less of a necessity.

public transport will get better as cars become less of a realistice option for getting from a to b.

 

[swissseagull]

I don't buy into that way of thinking at all!

biofuel can be produced from USED chip fat. This is already being created and farmed. We also don't need to import biofuel as we can create it here. Rain forests are being distroyed because or weak governments in the countries that have the rainforests. They are being distrupyed for a number of reasons. Biofuel is only one of them. Not using biofuel will not save the rainforests.

Sure biofuel can be produced by used chip fat
but there's hardly enough chip fat to go around. Once peak oil hit's, all imported food will either cease or be too expensive so we will have to produce more food locally. There's just not enough land to sustain (feed) ourselves AND produce biofuel crops.
What would save the rainforests is if we stopped eating so much meat (rainforests destroyed to make way for soya crops to feed our cattle), and stopped purchasing wood products from non sustainable sources.

 

[CHAPPERS]

I'll use electric!

 

[Man of Harveys]

As to peak oil, once we reach peak, the price will rocket because demand outstrips supply. There is no cheap alternative or technological fix.

Not sure about the dismissal of biodiesel (although I don't know as much about it as I should) but this is spot on - of course, if you look at crude prices, it's already happened. The fact that the industry gets excited when crude drops below $60 per barrel in London gives you an idea of just how used to high prices we've become. There's no ready-made large-scale alternative to oil. It's all going to be about cutting demand, and cutting expectations of demand, forcibly if needed.

 

[bhaexpress]

Beach Hut is more worried when the KY or vaseline runs out , the filthy depraved BEAST

He's okay with KY, its water based, didn't you read your AIDS leaflet ?

 

[Lammy]

Sure biofuel can be produced by used chip fat
but there's hardly enough chip fat to go around. Once peak oil hit's, all imported food will either cease or be too expensive so we will have to produce more food locally. There's just not enough land to sustain (feed) ourselves AND produce biofuel crops.
What would save the rainforests is if we stopped eating so much meat (rainforests destroyed to make way for soya crops to feed our cattle), and stopped purchasing wood products from non sustainable sources.

You're right, we could just stop eating and life in mud huts. More realistically, we can use biofuel with the resources we have coupled with more traditional sources like oil. We're not going to be able to flick a switch and make the problem go away overnight. It will be a gradual one. It's better switch to biofuel now rather than not because of what would happen if everyone did it IMHO.

There is also rather a LOT of land on the planet capable of growing crops for fuel. Not enough maybe to completely replace oil but to take a fair bit of the burden. Other options include Hydrogen powered cars. Hydrogen can be produced cleanly by renewable power, but this will be expensive and it's production needs to be more efficient. Biofuel is a good stop gap.

 

[Lammy]

He's okay with KY, its water based, didn't you read your AIDS leaflet ?

*phones Mother*

 

[Man of Harveys]

*phones Mother*

Everything OK?