Sky Challenge over TV rights

[Questions]

Well, why did we?

Right you`re banned from the bar now Peanut.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Like : Well why did you sell you`re old ground then ?

This MORE than any other question makes me want to punch them in the face. Unfortunately I have to take a deep breath and say "once upon a time there were three very bad men..."

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

As far as I see, the point of the ruling (if upheld) is that there will be no "grey market" - isn't that the whole idea?

Yes , an official card being used on commercial premises will cost more unless the landlord takes a gamble and says its for personal use.

 

[Southern Toon]

In theory it would open the door for people at home to not only get their football from Greece or wherever sells it cheap but also all their channels, movies and what not. Strong implications for Sky and all media organisations throughout Europe.

Subscribing to a foreign tv station for cheaper football i can see, But if you wanted the rest of the channels aswell (movies,documentries,etc) you would still have to subscribe to Sky.If you went down this route you would have to buy a new satellite receiver/decoder/dish (1 metre) + installation costs + card costs. In the short term its not very cheap.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Subscribing to a foreign tv station for cheaper football i can see, But if you wanted the rest of the channels aswell (movies,documentries,etc) you would still have to subscribe to Sky.If you went down this route you would have to buy a new satellite receiver/decoder/dish (1 metre) + installation costs + card costs. In the short term its not very cheap.

You wouldn't have to subscribe to Sky for the rest of the channels as movies shown in mainland Europe normally have an option for original version audio. Satellite receivers have inbuilt cams to put the card in , you only need a slightly larger dish than the Sky one to pick up most of the European channels and still use the same cabling. A 1.05 or 1.2 metre would only be needed to pick up the signal from the Albanian channels because of the footprint from a weaker satellite (actually 3 nearly knackered satellites at the same position , one to be replaced later this year).

 

[clapham_gull]

You know that's a brilliant idea, and I can actually see this as the way forward. Think about the extra money Brighton would make from it instead on relying on the premiership scraps. How much does it actually cost to stick a few cameras around the ground and bring harty and hawsey back? What about advertising for local companies on the Brighton channel, the list goes on and on.

No it's a rubbish idea. The income gap between the big and small clubs will become exponentially greater very quickly.

At the moment the gap is somewhat limited by stadium capacity and a collective TV deal although you do get the odd mad billionaire.

Manchester United could get a global audience in it's millions. Fulham will not.

 

[clapham_gull]

yeah, but Wigan for example wouldnt. I think there will always be some form of collective leauge deal as the majority of clubs just wouldnt get the revenue on per club deals, so wont support that change. unless the current top4 + Spurs&Liverpool form a breakaway... (a whole different discussion).

Quite obviously, which was the point of the post. But it's worth adding that one small team could potentially make more than do currently by playing Manchester United a couple of times a year...

The big clubs are also being threatened with the need to break even for European competition. If they think the above ruling threatens their income streams they will fight tooth and nail to replace it with something else.

( They already complain they don't receive enough of the SKY profits.. )

So don't be surprised if some of the big boys ask to sell their games themselves, even if a collective deal of sorts stays in place. It's a depressing but inevitable "step forward"...

The Glaziers want it, Chelsea currently against it.

 

[Rookie]

Subscribing to a foreign tv station for cheaper football i can see, But if you wanted the rest of the channels aswell (movies,documentries,etc) you would still have to subscribe to Sky.If you went down this route you would have to buy a new satellite receiver/decoder/dish (1 metre) + installation costs + card costs. In the short term its not very cheap.

Sorry I must be missing something. If someone goes to the trouble of setting themselves up to receive football for a foreign station why wouldn't they get the cheaper movies and programs that are on offer.
If the ECJ pass what many expect them to do, then the barriers come down and it will be perfectly legal to receive your film from wherever you want (in Europe). The ruling will not only apply to football

 

[clapham_gull]

Sorry I must be missing something. If someone goes to the trouble of setting themselves up to receive football for a foreign station why wouldn't they get the cheaper movies and programs that are on offer.
If the ECJ pass what many expect them to do, then the barriers come down and it will be perfectly legal to receive your film from wherever you want (in Europe). The ruling will not only apply to football

The whole issue of rights make this quite messy at the moment.

The best loved TV programmes in this country tend to be ones made for a domestic market. You get the odd exception (Dr Who, Top Gear), but it's worrying if the all the money goes towards making stuff that always be sold globally.

It's quite subtle, but you can usually spot a programme that has been made like that. Bland story lines and dialogue easy to dub.

.. and the European Song Contest.

 

[R. Slicker]

Subscribing to a foreign tv station for cheaper football i can see, But if you wanted the rest of the channels aswell (movies,documentries,etc) you would still have to subscribe to Sky.If you went down this route you would have to buy a new satellite receiver/decoder/dish (1 metre) + installation costs + card costs. In the short term its not very cheap.

A pub can get set up for a year of Tring TV for far less than the cost of 1 months Sky subscription. Sky Italia is a bit more expensive, but no longer does English commentary.

 

[sten_super]

I suspect that this will now run and run. What the ruling implies is relevant not just to the broadcast of football, but to the segregation of almost any market along national boundaries. It suggests that iTunes will not be able to price-discriminate between EU member states, that Amazon will have to offer all goods at the same price (excluding shipping costs) to anywhere within the EU, etc. This is a potentially massive ruling.

 

[GOM]

A pub can get set up for a year of Tring TV for far less than the cost of 1 months Sky subscription. Sky Italia is a bit more expensive, but no longer does English commentary.

Sky Germany has English commentary (for the troops) and can be found in several places around here for 3pm Saturday kick offs.

 

[Gwylan]

I suspect that this will now run and run. What the ruling implies is relevant not just to the broadcast of football, but to the segregation of almost any market along national boundaries. It suggests that iTunes will not be able to price-discriminate between EU member states, that Amazon will have to offer all goods at the same price (excluding shipping costs) to anywhere within the EU, etc. This is a potentially massive ruling.

I suspect you're right but one big legal minefield is tax. What happens if you buy a book from Amazon UK (VAT zero-rated) to send to France (where VAT is levied)? In the US, tax is levied according to the purchaser's state so Amazon UK would have to charge VAT if sending items to France - that would be quite a logistical problem that they'd face.

 

[seagulls4ever]

I suspect that this will now run and run. What the ruling implies is relevant not just to the broadcast of football, but to the segregation of almost any market along national boundaries. It suggests that iTunes will not be able to price-discriminate between EU member states, that Amazon will have to offer all goods at the same price (excluding shipping costs) to anywhere within the EU, etc. This is a potentially massive ruling.

Not necessarily. It's not as simple as that.

 

[GOM]

I suspect you're right but one big legal minefield is tax. What happens if you buy a book from Amazon UK (VAT zero-rated) to send to France (where VAT is levied)? In the US, tax is levied according to the purchaser's state so Amazon UK would have to charge VAT if sending items to France - that would be quite a logistical problem that they'd face.

The same NON-minefield as now when buying CDs /DVDs / printer ink etc from the Channel Islands or the USA, or Hong Kong or China or wherever.
Or you could just order from Amazon.fr or whichever country.

 

[beorhthelm]

I suspect that this will now run and run. What the ruling implies is relevant not just to the broadcast of football, but to the segregation of almost any market along national boundaries.

erm... thats sort of the whole point of the single market. if there are seperate rules for copyright materials, they are the exceptions.

 

[sten_super]

erm... thats sort of the whole point of the single market. if there are seperate rules for copyright materials, they are the exceptions.

But the single market has not really got into the area of discriminative pricing previously. They have stopped overt measures such as tariffs and quotas along national lines, but this is much more involved. They are effectively saying that all goods and services within the EU must be traded at the same price, ignoring regional price levels.

 

[Simster]

But the single market has not really got into the area of discriminative pricing previously. They have stopped overt measures such as tariffs and quotas along national lines, but this is much more involved. They are effectively saying that all goods and services within the EU must be traded at the same price, ignoring regional price levels.

I don't think they are. There is nothing to suggest that a retailer is not allowed to trade at different prices for different regions, but this must come about through market forces, not from trade restrictions imposed by the supplier (in this case, Sky).

 

[sten_super]

I don't think they are. There is nothing to suggest that a retailer is not allowed to trade at different prices for different regions, but this must come about through market forces, not from trade restrictions imposed by the supplier (in this case, Sky).

True, my previous post is a bit ott. However, what they are doing is making it very difficult to sell items on a region-specific basis within the EU. The likely response to this is Sky securing the rights for selling across the EU in one package, which they would then have to make available at one price across Europe (otherwise we'd all go for the cheapest). It seems to me that anything that is not limited by physical presence (i.e. anything that can be delivered) could well fall under a similar remit. Why order from Amazon UK for £10 when you can order from Amazon PL for £4 (+£3 delivery)?