[Politics] Sir Keir Starmer’s route to Number 10

[Bodian]

until Covid was a rail commuter for decades, enjoying the subsidy of cheap commute to London. problems with rail are down to management, operations and capacity, which wont change under a different ownership structure. as proven by so many franchises returning to public ownership and problems persist. Network Rail has been publicly owned since 2002! this is all besides the point, which is the notion that a top policy to solve the country's problems is rail and it's nationalisation. it should be somewhere way down the list.

In general those franchises taken back into public ownership have been better - timewise, profitability and so on. Network Rail are public - but hampered by the fact that they cannot do anything in a joined up fashion - as they have to meet the demands of the TOCs (and pay them for delaying services to carry out maintenance and so on).

Also - it's not going to solve all the country's problems, but it is one bit of the whole jigsaw.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

It’s interesting how previously out and proud vocal Tories are now acting. @Steve Foster has slinked off, @Titanic is being reasonable but otherwise keeping quiet and you’re making these accusations. It’s as though you have nothing to actually say anymore for the party you support.

I would never claim to support any party or declare myself out and proud as a vocal Tory. I've always had more of an affinity towards the Tories as I'm sure others do to Labour. I don't denigrate or disapprove of other voter's views and the comments I made are observations rather than accusations. I'm just a voter, not passionate about Conservatism, Conservative politicians or politics at all. I read all the papers online for different views at times and I'm probably as much of a swing voter as you'll find. It's up to Keir and his mates to make their case. If they offer a better alternative they can have my vote.

 

[WATFORD zero]

I would never claim to support any party or declare myself out and proud as a vocal Tory. I've always had more of an affinity towards the Tories as I'm sure others do to Labour. I don't denigrate or disapprove of other voter's views and the comments I made are observations rather than accusations. I'm just a voter, not passionate about Conservatism, Conservative politicians or politics at all. I read all the papers online for different views at times and I'm probably as much of a swing voter as you'll find. It's up to Keir and his mates to make their case. If they offer a better alternative they can have my vote.

Maybe when you post this a couple of hours earlier, that's why you get called out for it

Never hidden it. Never had a good reason to change or consider change till now and Labour has never resonated with me, my life, my work etc. Nor have Labour politicians. Not going to apologise for it. But a struggling Tory government gives Labour it's chance. It's up to them to present themselves as an attractive alternative, not just 'not the Tories'. Like many previous Tory voters considering their options, I'm not going to be a turkey voting for Christmas. Unfortunately, anyone suggesting a natural disposition to voting Tory on NSC usually gets battered, so they keep their heads down.

But this is probably just another one of your 'scathing attacks' on a poor centralist

I hope nobody makes a fool of themselves tonight, I'm off so have a good evening

 

[Is it PotG?]

I would never claim to support any party or declare myself out and proud as a vocal Tory. I've always had more of an affinity towards the Tories as I'm sure others do to Labour. I don't denigrate or disapprove of other voter's views and the comments I made are observations rather than accusations. I'm just a voter, not passionate about Conservatism, Conservative politicians or politics at all. I read all the papers online for different views at times and I'm probably as much of a swing voter as you'll find. It's up to Keir and his mates to make their case. If they offer a better alternative they can have my vote.

Excellent post.

 

[rogersix]

I would never claim to support any party or declare myself out and proud as a vocal Tory. I've always had more of an affinity towards the Tories as I'm sure others do to Labour. I don't denigrate or disapprove of other voter's views and the comments I made are observations rather than accusations. I'm just a voter, not passionate about Conservatism, Conservative politicians or politics at all. I read all the papers online for different views at times and I'm probably as much of a swing voter as you'll find. It's up to Keir and his mates to make their case. If they offer a better alternative they can have my vote.

you don't vote to spite people then?

 

[rogersix]

Maybe when you post this a couple of hours earlier, that's why you get called out for it



But this is probably just another one of your 'scathing attacks' on a poor centralist

I hope nobody makes a fool of themselves tonight, I'm off so have a good evening

the most amazing thing is the total lack of self awareness!

 

[Javeaseagull]

Railways have never made money and should not have been privatised. They are important for mass transportation and should be used to reduce the reliance on cars. There are too many interested parties that this does not suit, car manufacturers, petrol companies etc. Why everything has to make a profit is beyond me. Some things should be for the public good and this should be one along with the NHS and Water.

 

[rogersix]

Excellent post.

that is a total contradiction of his previous positlon, did you give him a thumbs up for that as well?

 

[Is it PotG?]

that is a total contradiction of his previous positlon, did you give him a thumbs up for that as well?

Which bit of I think that's an 'excellent post' don't you get?

 

[rogersix]

Which bit of I think that's an 'excellent post' don't you get?

the contradicting bit

 

[Is it PotG?]

the contradicting bit

As is the sensible approach on here, I take each post on its own merits. I saw a learned contributor criticise the lack of verbosity in some posts, maybe hinting at ignorance being a cause.
One thing that one learns quickly is that some spend an inordinate amount of time wading through each and every post since 1901, and so brief responses to individual listings are a prudent and satisfying approach to interaction, allowing development where required and later discussion.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

you don't vote to spite people then?

In the real world no, but you could still tempt me.

 

[rogersix]

As is the sensible approach on here, I take each post on its own merits. I saw a learned contributor criticise the lack of verbosity in some posts, maybe hinting at ignorance being a cause.
One thing that one learns quickly is that some spend an inordinate amount of time wading through each and every post since 1901, and so brief responses to individual listings are a prudent and satisfying approach to interaction, allowing development where required and later discussion.

i suppose if you vote bungle, coherence is not of much import to you

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

The immediate cause of bringing them back into public ownership will have be financial, but in the case of Northern in particular they were widely regarded as a totally incompetent basketcase.
Happily at that time I walked to work so it didn't bother me too much.

We shouldn't forget that the tories were playing fast and loose with BR from when Thatcher made it clear she though we should all be using cars. Regional improvements seemed to be planned simply to leverage votes. This resulted in regional variations in service. Barely a thought about national infrastructure.

I would suggest they have been doing the same with the health service. Different regions rationing differently, with political capital to be had. Didn't Johnson promise 40 new hospitals? What happened to all that I wonder?

There is a strong anti public ownership, anti public service imperative among the right of the tory party (not all of the party it should be stated, there is still some one nation instincts among the quieter element, albeit they have been sitting on their hands during the rise of the lunatics).

This has to stop. The idea that everything can be flogged off for easy short term wins (votes) should be precluded by some new laws. National interest laws. Bribing elements of the nation with their own (taxpayers') money is grotesque. I expect Labour to continue, sadly, but with a different flavour. But....even if they say they want to spend tax payers' money to boost deprived areas, and rightly so, this will simply entrench the tory vote in the leafy shires, outraged that their taxes are being used to 'subsidize single parent scousers', etc.

Politics is toxic at the moment. It will take years for the swamp to be drained. And the tories in opposition will, I predict, be the most disgusting opposition in living memory.

 

[rogersix]

We shouldn't forget that the tories were playing fast and loose with BR from when Thatcher made it clear she though we should all be using cars. Regional improvements seemed to be planned simply to leverage votes. This resulted in regional variations in service. Barely a thought about national infrastructure.

I would suggest they have been doing the same with the health service. Different regions rationing differently, with political capital to be had. Didn't Johnson promise 40 new hospitals? What happened to all that I wonder?

There is a strong anti public ownership, anti public service imperative among the right of the tory party (not all of the party it should be stated, there is still some one nation instincts among the quieter element, albeit they have been sitting on their hands during the rise of the lunatics).

This has to stop. The idea that everything can be flogged off for easy short term wins (votes) should be precluded by some new laws. National interest laws. Bribing elements of the nation with their own (taxpayers') money is grotesque. I expect Labour to continue, sadly, but with a different flavour. But....even if they say they want to spend tax payers' money to boost deprived areas, and rightly so, this will simply entrench the tory vote in the leafy shires, outraged that their taxes are being used to 'subsidize single parent scousers', etc.

Politics is toxic at the moment. It will take years for the swamp to be drained. And the tories in opposition will, I predict, be the most disgusting opposition in living memory.

how much disgust can they generate in opposition, not many will desire to corrupt them!

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

how much disgust can they generate in opposition, not many will desire to corrupt them!

They will be rabid attack dogs 24/7, marching up and down with a Culture War banner, inspecting every penny of tax payers' money that labour waste on do-goodery, standing up for honest British folk who are trying to do their best for their family, while family values are under constant attack from the loony left. Brace yourself.

 

[rogersix]

They will be rabid attack dogs 24/7, marching up and down with a Culture War banner, inspecting every penny of tax payers' money that labour waste on do-goodery, standing up for honest British folk who are trying to do their best for their family, while family values are under constant attack from the loony left. Brace yourself.

yeah, there is that, i was a tad naive, we live in hope!

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

until Covid was a rail commuter for decades, enjoying the subsidy of cheap commute to London. problems with rail are down to management, operations and capacity, which wont change under a different ownership structure. as proven by so many franchises returning to public ownership and problems persist. Network Rail has been publicly owned since 2002! this is all besides the point, which is the notion that a top policy to solve the country's problems is rail and it's nationalisation. it should be somewhere way down the list.

Operations are far more politically controlled now than they ever were when railways were under state control.
If you're of working age and use the train to go to work (or indeed, could use the train to go to work) then it's likely the arm of the government that has most impact on your life, unless you're unfortunate enough to fall seriously ill.

 

[Bodian]

I do hope you don't get any sarky 'TLDR' replies. This is the sort of post that should be read by all.

I write reports at work, and the managers above me often want to make them shorter. Until I point out that if they want those who they are aimed at to have a full understanding of what it is they are meant to be deciding - then they have to read and understand the background. These things can't / shouldn't be decided on a superficial, glib one liner.

I saw a learned contributor criticise the lack of verbosity in some posts, maybe hinting at ignorance being a cause.

I do hope you're not referring to me as a 'learned contributor'!!

 

[clapham_gull]

Rail would be right down the bottom of my list for re-nationalisation.

Water companies please.