Selling your seat at The Amex

[Beach Hut]

I'm struggling to see what I'd get for my £495 if I took out the PSL thing, I really am.

I have an uncomfortable feeling that the advent of Falmer is the start of us being sucked into the corporate machine, the point where we cease to become supporters but are instead viewed as little more than an unwavering income stream, to be tapped as much as possible. Give us more money and we welcome you...be an "ordinary" ticket holder and you will be treated very differently.

Hope I'm wrong.

Unfortunately that is about right now in the brave new world - money talks but needs must if the club wants to move forward.

However on a brighter note at least Falmer offers this opportunity which Withdean could not

 

[Simster]

Probably a way of making a few extra quid at the end of the day.

Well yes, but as far as I can see, Herr Tubthumper has nailed it in post #36. I think we need to know a bit more about what you're getting with a PSL.

I think this has been poorly thought through. This PSL is going to end up meaning there are empty seats all over the place for some games because people won't pay £500 for the privelege of trading their unused tickets. I'd have thought a better solution would be a ticket exchange, where the club provides a refund on unrequired tickets minus an administration fee of a £7 or so (which would surely still be quite profitable for the club) when a ticket is sold on to a buyer.

 

[The Large One]

That's how I'm reading it too. The trouble is, nobody seems to know what the PSL is intended for!

From the reply Martin Perry gave for the Roar a few weeks ago, it seems that, if for whatever reason you decide not to renew your season ticket and wish to pass your seat over to someone you know, you can't do that unless you have a PSL. In other words, it's for you to choose who has that given seat.

If there is no PSL, the seat goes to the next person who wants it.

The PSL is not about the private sharing/borrowing of season tickets on a single match basis.

 

[The Large One]

Here's his reply...

• Are STs transferrable? Can you share a ST? Or is it the case that - while you're not supposed to - there's not much you can do in reality?

Season Tickets are not transferable and remain the property of the Club at all times. However we understand that on a match by match basis tickets do get passed to friends or family and provided they are used on a like for like basis i.e. Adult for Adult, Child for Child or Senior Citizen for Senior Citizen this practice will be tolerated. Supporters should be aware however that with the new entry systems at the Amex Stadium we will be able to tell what sort of ticket you are holding and if an adult tries to access the stadium on a concession ticket it will be picked up and entry prevented.

Season Ticket holders will also have the right to renew their season tickets at the end of the season as normal. However in a situation where a supporter no longer wishes to renew it is important to understand that in this situation the ticket is not transferable. This is because, If the Club has sold all available season tickets we will create a waiting list and we want to be able to offer tickets that become available to the people at the top of the waiting list.

Some people might however like to be able to nominate who the ticket is passed on to – perhaps another member of the family for example, and to cater for this we have created a new product called a Private Seat Licence. These will be available for sale at the time you purchase your season tickets and they give you the right to right to transfer your ticket to whoever you choose provided of course they are acceptable to the Club i.e haven’t been banned or excluded.

Full details of Private Seat Licences are being sent out with confirmation of your booking for your visit to the Amex Stadium

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

The cost far out weighs the benefit of the PSL. All it seems to do is legally enshrine your right to re-purchase the seat season after season and for the club to help you pass any spare tickets on. Is this worth £500? Maybe the idea that you 'own' a piece of Falmer will appeal?

Well the presentation bumph includes a page headed 'How will PSLs be traded in the future?' and shows an illustration of 'a special trading webpage where PSL holders who wish to trade their seats can list them for sale at anytime, at any price they want'. The illustration shows asking prices ranging from £1250 through to £5700 for specific named seats. So the club appear to be actively encouraging a trade in PSLs as a commodity in their own right, with the implicit suggestion that you might be able to turn a tidy profit on your £500 in due course.

Not everybody's cup of tea, but I can see where the club are coming from.

 

[Ernest]

It's a punt that's all, you're having a gamble on the club getting to the Premiership but if they did who would want to sell their season anyway ?

 

[Was not Was]

There are (at least) two different linked issues here:

1. The club making it hard for STHs to pass on their ticket for odd games (or, indeed, to 'share' a season ticket)
2. Trying to flog us PSLs.

What saddens me is that, in both cases, whatever benefit the club gets from taking the approach it is taking could have been achieved in a different, much more fan-friendly way. Specifically:

1. making it possible for STHs to 'pass on' their match tkt electronically to another member they know (or a ticket exchange open to any member) with the club taking a fee in either case. This way, everyone's happy, the club makes a few bob and ensures that, if demand is sufficient, SEATS WILL NOT BE EMPTY.

2. asking people to invest in the club. Plenty of us threw hundreds at the Live and Kicking fund for no personal benefit, and we'd invest again in return for a risibly small percentage of a share. This way, the club gets a cash injection, we get a bit of a voice.

Instead of the above, they're asking us to invest in a PSL to, in effect, speculate on the future of the club for our own personal gain. This makes the club look venal, and makes it look as though they think we're all bloody selfish. The last 13 years show that we are anything but. We've put heart and soul into saving this club, as it means such a lot to us.

Conclusion: the club's approach may be good business practice, but it's not in keeping with the values that we have built and demonstrated over the past 13 years.

Discuss.

 

[Couldn't Be Hyypia]

The PSL is not about the private sharing/borrowing of season tickets on a single match basis.

Not quite right though TLO. From The Terms & Conditions:

"Rules of Tradeability & Transferability ii: PSL holder may sell or transfer individual match tickets in accordance with the designated seat for events their season ticket entitles them to."

The fact that you own the licence means that the club have to let you do this. They don't encourage it but it is specifically addressed in the T&C's.

As has been explained, it seems the key benefit (over and above chipping a bit more into the pot) is the right to transfer or sell the seat if demand outstips supply, and to have the right to redesignate the seat to a new owner if you want to pass it to a friend or family member.

 

[GOM]

Some people might however like to be able to nominate who the ticket is passed on to – perhaps another member of the family for example, and to cater for this we have created a new product called a Private Seat Licence. [/i]

Solution -
1 other member of family / friend gives you the money to renew ST.
2 You renew ST
3. You give ST to friend etc.

Sorted

:albion1:

 

[Beach Hut]

The reason is because the club are moving to a corporate footing and therefore drawing a line under the last 13 years.

I suspect the business model is probably on a par with many other football clubs and to be honest they have a very healthy potential set of new fans to be enticed that are quite wealthy given the area we are located.

 

[Couldn't Be Hyypia]

PSLs are not a new idea - gained traction in the 90's and started in the US. Generally accepted as a means of generating some additional revenue to off-set the very high cost of new stadia. Almost always contentious.

I'd be all for a proper electronic ticket exchange as suggested by some here. And I'd be happy for the club to add a £7 admin fee for this. No need to have this jus for PSLs though.

 

[Simster]

The reason is because the club are moving to a corporate footing and therefore drawing a line under the last 13 years.

I suspect the business model is probably on a par with many other football clubs and to be honest they have a very healthy potential set of new fans to be enticed that are quite wealthy given the area we are located.

I suspect you are correct, but nevertheless this is two fingers to the majority of our fan base. I couldn't agree more with Was not Was' most recent post.

Fine, limit the PSLs to 1901 seats or even a part of the West Stand, but the simple fact is that most people won't spend £500 on this, and that will mean consequently that there will be empty seats because STHs won't necessarily be able to sell all their unused tickets.

 

[mcshane in the 79th]

Here's his reply...

• Are STs transferrable? Can you share a ST? Or is it the case that - while you're not supposed to - there's not much you can do in reality?

Season Tickets are not transferable and remain the property of the Club at all times. However we understand that on a match by match basis tickets do get passed to friends or family and provided they are used on a like for like basis i.e. Adult for Adult, Child for Child or Senior Citizen for Senior Citizen this practice will be tolerated. Supporters should be aware however that with the new entry systems at the Amex Stadium we will be able to tell what sort of ticket you are holding and if an adult tries to access the stadium on a concession ticket it will be picked up and entry prevented.

Season Ticket holders will also have the right to renew their season tickets at the end of the season as normal. However in a situation where a supporter no longer wishes to renew it is important to understand that in this situation the ticket is not transferable. This is because, If the Club has sold all available season tickets we will create a waiting list and we want to be able to offer tickets that become available to the people at the top of the waiting list.

Some people might however like to be able to nominate who the ticket is passed on to – perhaps another member of the family for example, and to cater for this we have created a new product called a Private Seat Licence. These will be available for sale at the time you purchase your season tickets and they give you the right to right to transfer your ticket to whoever you choose provided of course they are acceptable to the Club i.e haven’t been banned or excluded.

Full details of Private Seat Licences are being sent out with confirmation of your booking for your visit to the Amex Stadium

That all makes good sense. As long as the games I can't get to, I can give my ticket to someone else that's all I am interested in. I would never expect to be able to choose who got my season ticket if I ever stopped renewing so I see no reason to £495 for the priviledge. I would be surprised if they got many takers at all for a PSL for that price

 

[Titanic]

With the inherent design of the Amex allowing for significant expansion of the capacity in future, should demand be there, I don't see the PSL's really taking off in a big way for quite a long time to come - except perhaps for some premium locations in the stadium. I don't think I will be bothering with it.

 

[The Large One]

Not quite right though TLO. From The Terms & Conditions:

"Rules of Tradeability & Transferability ii: PSL holder may sell or transfer individual match tickets in accordance with the designated seat for events their season ticket entitles them to."

The fact that you own the licence means that the club have to let you do this. They don't encourage it but it is specifically addressed in the T&C's.

As has been explained, it seems the key benefit (over and above chipping a bit more into the pot) is the right to transfer or sell the seat if demand outstips supply, and to have the right to redesignate the seat to a new owner if you want to pass it to a friend or family member.

Understood. But while the PSL officially allows a ticket transfer on a single match basis, the reality is you can do that without a PSL as well, provided it's 'like for like'.

 

[mcshane in the 79th]

Fine, limit the PSLs to 1901 seats or even a part of the West Stand, but the simple fact is that most people won't spend £500 on this, and that will mean consequently that there will be empty seats because STHs won't necessarily be able to sell all their unused tickets.

Why will there be empty seats? You can pass your ticket onto someone else if you are unable to make it. Or am I missing something?

 

[Lord Bracknell]

If you have a PSL, selling your seat for a match is not touting because you actually own the seat (like someone having a long leasehold on a property). So you are perfectly entitled to seel the seat on a match by match basis. However, doesn't sound like the club are keen to facilitate that.

If they are "not keen" to facilitate it, they shouldn't be charging £495 for the facility.

 

[Couldn't Be Hyypia]

Understood. But while the PSL officially allows a ticket transfer on a single match basis, the reality is you can do that without a PSL as well, provided it's 'like for like'.

Understood. As you can now. But you can't do it "officially". Also, having the swipe cards will make the thing a lot more complex than it is now. But yes, I guess you can do it on a like for like basis - just not easily.

So the £500 for the PSL then is purely about either a speculation or having a transferable asset.

 

[The Large One]

I suspect you are correct, but nevertheless this is two fingers to the majority of our fan base. I couldn't agree more with Was not Was' most recent post.

Fine, limit the PSLs to 1901 seats or even a part of the West Stand, but the simple fact is that most people won't spend £500 on this, and that will mean consequently that there will be empty seats because STHs won't necessarily be able to sell all their unused tickets.

Can't see that point there. You won't need a PSL to offload your ticket to a friend on single match basis.

 

[Simster]

Why will there be empty seats? You can pass your ticket onto someone else if you are unable to make it. Or am I missing something?

The current arrangement is one where you can simply pass on an unused ticket for a specific match. However in the new world, you'd have to pass on the whol season ticket pass for the one-off unused seat, so you'd better be confident of getting it back.