Saturday - Not good enough

[The Large One]

they used it on saturday to tell the players a change of tactics - and that was around the 89th minute....

Fair enough - I wasn't at 'Nam.

Hang on - did they change the tactics on 89 minutes? I thought the substitutions were made AFTER Cheltenham scored?

 

[Scotty Mac]

Fair enough - I wasn't at 'Nam.

Hang on - did they change the tactics on 89 minutes? I thought the substitutions were made AFTER Cheltenham scored?

wilkins, white and chapman were screaming at the players and indicating to the board in around the 89th minute - it had nothing to do with the substitution

gatting was bought on as soon as cheltenham got the second, which must have been around the 93rd minute

 

[Perry Milkins]

Have you never seen him going apoplectic at anything and everything - especially shit refereeing decisions?

And I am always questioning his managerial style and ability, based on the limited knowledge I (and everyone else outside the playing squad for that matter) have about it. I just choose not to add to the binfests by putting those concerns on here.

Well no I haven't but then I don't watch as many games as many on here. All I see is the arms folded looking throroughly unconcerned posture.

If you have concerns (and I respect your principles on not posting them here) it must make it hard to debate against those binfesters so to speak.

We are all football fans who frequently see things differently than the manager and then consider ourselves 'experts'. None of us have the knowledge and experience i would think Wendy has - yet he has an uncanny way of alienating a lot of us. I know that some of you have seen him getting 'as one' with the supporters but to me he is cold and has precious little rapport with the fans. maybe it is this factor which drives a lot of the binfests.

 

[BigGully]

Well no I haven't but then I don't watch as many games as many on here. All I see is the arms folded looking throroughly unconcerned posture.

If you have concerns (and I respect your principles on not posting them here) it must make it hard to debate against those binfesters so to speak.

We are all football fans who frequently see things differently than the manager and then consider ourselves 'experts'. None of us have the knowledge and experience i would think Wendy has - yet he has an uncanny way of alienating a lot of us. I know that some of you have seen him getting 'as one' with the supporters but to me he is cold and has precious little rapport with the fans. maybe it is this factor which drives a lot of the binfests.

Not sure about that, he might not wish to be too demonstrative at times, but how does he alienate you

He will only have his hands in his pockets, never crossed by the way ( unless he is being demonstrative of course )

 

[Hadlee]

Well no I haven't but then I don't watch as many games as many on here. All I see is the arms folded looking throroughly unconcerned posture.

If you have concerns (and I respect your principles on not posting them here) it must make it hard to debate against those binfesters so to speak.

We are all football fans who frequently see things differently than the manager and then consider ourselves 'experts'. None of us have the knowledge and experience i would think Wendy has - yet he has an uncanny way of alienating a lot of us. I know that some of you have seen him getting 'as one' with the supporters but to me he is cold and has precious little rapport with the fans. maybe it is this factor which drives a lot of the binfests.

Yes, but do you think that is a reason to get rid if him ?

Managers are human beings, each have different styles and just because Wilkins doesn't rant and rave on the touchline does not mean he has no passion.

 

[unnameable]

At the moment, it is deeply frustrating being a fan of the Albion. The club has so much potential but cannot fulfil it owing to the situation with the stadium. Thanks to Lewes District Council, we must wait until 2010 before the team plays its first game at the new home. In the meantime, we must endure seeing clubs like Reading getting a piece of the Premier League action whilst we lose to the likes of Cheltenham and Northampton.

 

[Perry Milkins]

Yes, but do you think that is a reason to get rid if him ?

Managers are human beings, each have different styles and just because Wilkins doesn't rant and rave on the touchline does not mean he has no passion.

Hadlee, knowing you as well as I do I doubt you would complain if DK had appointed a parrot called Brenda to take Mcghee's place who then lost every single game in charge by 10 goals to nil..

 

[Les Biehn]

Les, What exactly do you want me to answer?

Which of his selections and tactics do you think are wrong and why? What tangible evidence or observation has lead you to believe that Wilkins isn't getting the best from the players?

Anything along those lines would do.

I find it odd that you either don't care about other people opinions of your posts or don't want to debate with people. I don't care what people think of my posts on the club but I do like to debate them with people as I usually learn somthing new or see it from a different angle. You however just seem to want to dictate your opinion as fact and have people accept it. It makes me wonder why you post in the first place.

 

[Perry Milkins]

Not sure about that, he might not wish to be too demonstrative at times, but how does he alienate you

He will only have his hands in his pockets, never crossed by the way ( unless he is being demonstrative of course )

Perhaps it is just 'gut feeling' and he is the 'crux to bend my bow'.

 

[The Large One]

Yes, but do you think that is a reason to get rid if him ?

Managers are human beings, each have different styles and just because Wilkins doesn't rant and rave on the touchline does not mean he has no passion.

Quite. Steve Coppell anyone?

Well no I haven't but then I don't watch as many games as many on here. All I see is the arms folded looking throroughly unconcerned posture.

If you have concerns (and I respect your principles on not posting them here) it must make it hard to debate against those binfesters so to speak.

We are all football fans who frequently see things differently than the manager and then consider ourselves 'experts'. None of us have the knowledge and experience i would think Wendy has - yet he has an uncanny way of alienating a lot of us. I know that some of you have seen him getting 'as one' with the supporters but to me he is cold and has precious little rapport with the fans. maybe it is this factor which drives a lot of the binfests.

My main issues about Dean Wilkins, which does make it hard for me rally against the extreme polarised view of some, it something he has very little control over - his lack of experience in first-team management, which in itself leads on to another set of issues which he is still learning.

I certainly do not subscribe to the view that he is tactically naive, and cannot motivate his team. There are far too many examples where this you can demonstrate the exact opposite. It's just that it doesn't happen often enough.

He is now about 75-80 games into his first foray into first-team management. Plenty, some might say, to have everything facing the right way, and settled down enough for us to be motoring up the table. I could make reason after reason, excuse after excuse as to why this is not happening yet. But just because they might be hackneyed old excuses, it doesn't make them any less valid.

My main one - especially bearing in mind the squads we have had since 1999, is the lack of Bobby Zamora. No Zamora - no back-to-back Championships, no higher, elevated expectations. But that's another issue.

I appreciate Wilkins is not the world's greatest media darling - I suspect he'd rather not do the media bit, if he can help it. But if that's what it takes to endear you to him, may I respectfully suggest that there are other ways of judging him than his perceived posture during the game, or how monotoned he can sound when talking to the mumbling Hawesy.

I still believe, despite my brother's scepticism on here, that we will finish in around 10th place this season - the same place Micky Adams finished his first full season as Brighton manager, albeit a division higher.

 

[Les Biehn]

My main issues about Dean Wilkins, which does make it hard for me rally against the extreme polarised view of some, it something he has very little control over - his lack of experience in first-team management, which in itself leads on to another set of issues which he is still learning.

I certainly do not subscribe to the view that he is tactically naive, and cannot motivate his team. There are far too many examples where this you can demonstrate the exact opposite. It's just that it doesn't happen often enough.

He is now about 75-80 games into his first foray into first-team management. Plenty, some might say, to have everything facing the right way, and settled down enough for us to be motoring up the table. I could make reason after reason, excuse after excuse as to why this is not happening yet. But just because they might be hackneyed old excuses, it doesn't make them any less valid.

My main one - especially bearing in mind the squads we have had since 1999, is the lack of Bobby Zamora. No Zamora - no back-to-back Championships, no higher, elevated expectations. But that's another issue.

I appreciate Wilkins is not the world's greatest media darling - I suspect he'd rather not do the media bit, if he can help it. But if that's what it takes to endear you to him, may I respectfully suggest that there are other ways of judging him than his perceived posture during the game, or how monotoned he can sound when talking to the mumbling Hawesy.

I still believe, despite my brother's scepticism on here, that we will finish in around 10th place this season - the same place Micky Adams finished his first full season as Brighton manager, albeit a division higher.

Well said TLO, that was actually a pleasure to read.

 

[byf]

Which of his selections and tactics do you think are wrong and why? What tangible evidence or observation has lead you to believe that Wilkins isn't getting the best from the players?

Anything along those lines would do.

I find it odd that you either don't care about other people opinions of your posts or don't want to debate with people. I don't care what people think of my posts on the club but I do like to debate them with people as I usually learn somthing new or see it from a different angle. You however just seem to want to dictate your opinion as fact and have people accept it. It makes me wonder why you post in the first place.

When have I said I majorly disagree with Wilkins team selection or tactics?

There are reasons why we struggled for survival last season under Wilkins & result wise the same. Now whether that is down to poor management,poor tactics,poor team selection,lack of motivation,poor training/set-up. Poor players or a certain aspect of all shown above I do not know, do you?

I am not a football tactician or am I a person who can tell the manager what players are right to pick as I am just a mere fan who has an opinion. Im just a fan like you les. I do not know the secret to success.

I cant factually prove that el abd is a bad player....but he is certainly one that wouldnt get in my side....We are needing a leader at the back and under wilkins we have not had one Les...past albion teams have always had one. Morgan/Chippy/Oatway/Cullip even Virgo & it shocks me that wilkins doesnt think like that......I dont see a leader, do you?

The players on the pitch are better than the trash they sometimes serve up, because we have seen that. Orient away was a perfect example, I was proud to be an albion fan that day and we should have had 3 points. That was incredible attacking football. But the frustrating thing is we can never sustain any sort of decent form, Hence last seasons league place and this seasons up and down season.

There is no given right for us to be at the top of the league or in the playoff's, but only my opinion as a fan that results dont lie and neither do performances and who-ever is in charge of this club whether it be wilkins or Bruce forsyth must be judged on this basis.

Do you think for £25 per match that you are getting value for money Les?

Do you honestly think Wilkins is getting the very best out of these players?

I care about people's opinions and am very interested in them. I just dont feel people can see no wrong with wilkins, when to me and many others he hasnt taken us forward league placing wise or really performances.Personal has changed and soon the excuses will run out. Flashes of brilliance combined with inconsistant trash is not a good recipe for success, surely you see that?

 

[Mendoza]

on another note, Saturday was BRILLIANT, the sun was out, and my shorts and flip flops got their first outdoor airing of the year!!


bbrrrrraaaaapppppppp!!!

 

[Knotty]

When have I said I majorly disagree with Wilkins team selection or tactics?

There are reasons why we struggled for survival last season under Wilkins & result wise the same. Now whether that is down to poor management,poor tactics,poor team selection,lack of motivation,poor training/set-up. Poor players or a certain aspect of all shown above I do not know, do you?

I am not a football tactician or am I a person who can tell the manager what players are right to pick as I am just a mere fan who has an opinion. Im just a fan like you les. I do not know the secret to success.

I cant factually prove that el abd is a bad player....but he is certainly one that wouldnt get in my side....We are needing a leader at the back and under wilkins we have not had one Les...past albion teams have always had one. Morgan/Chippy/Oatway/Cullip even Virgo & it shocks me that wilkins doesnt think like that......I dont see a leader, do you?


The players on the pitch are better than the trash they sometimes serve up, because we have seen that. Orient away was a perfect example, I was proud to be an albion fan that day and we should have had 3 points. That was incredible attacking football. But the frustrating thing is we can never sustain any sort of decent form, Hence last seasons league place and this seasons up and down season.

There is no given right for us to be at the top of the league or in the playoff's, but only my opinion as a fan that results dont lie and neither do performances and who-ever is in charge of this club whether it be wilkins or Bruce forsyth must be judged on this basis.

Do you think for £25 per match that you are getting value for money Les?

Do you honestly think Wilkins is getting the very best out of these players?

I care about people's opinions and am very interested in them. I just dont feel people can see no wrong with wilkins, when to me and many others he hasnt taken us forward league placing wise or really performances.Personal has changed and soon the excuses will run out. Flashes of brilliance combined with inconsistant trash is not a good recipe for success, surely you see that?

On the basis of getting "value-for-money" on what I pay to watch the Albion,
I should not have paid for about 80% of the many hundreds of matches I have seen in 40 years!

But how do you quantify value-for-money? They are human beings playing to the best of their ability. If that's not good enough to win most matches or get promotions, it's not their fault. If we need to pay more money to get better players, but don't have the money, is that anyone's fault?

 

[byf]

On the basis of getting "value-for-money" on what I pay to watch the Albion,
I should not have paid for about 80% of the many hundreds of matches I have seen in 40 years!

But how do you quantify value-for-money? They are human beings playing to the best of their ability. If that's not good enough to win most matches or get promotions, it's not their fault. If we need to pay more money to get better players, but don't have the money, is that anyone's fault?

Fair comment.

Do you think we are getting the best out of them?

 

[Les Biehn]

When have I said I majorly disagree with Wilkins team selection or tactics?

There are reasons why we struggled for survival last season under Wilkins & result wise the same. Now whether that is down to poor management,poor tactics,poor team selection,lack of motivation,poor training/set-up. Poor players or a certain aspect of all shown above I do not know, do you?

I am not a football tactician or am I a person who can tell the manager what players are right to pick as I am just a mere fan who has an opinion. Im just a fan like you les. I do not know the secret to success.

I cant factually prove that el abd is a bad player....but he is certainly one that wouldnt get in my side....We are needing a leader at the back and under wilkins we have not had one Les...past albion teams have always had one. Morgan/Chippy/Oatway/Cullip even Virgo & it shocks me that wilkins doesnt think like that......I dont see a leader, do you?

I was merely suggesting tactics and selection may be one of the areas you feel Wilkin's lets himself down and would be willing to expand on that. I am just a fan but I still have opinions on these matters.

I agree we need a leader and I believe Wilkin's recognises this and it's why he got Thompson & Forster and has pushe Elphick to the fore. I know what you mean about El-Abd, he needs to cut out the silly mistakes in his game.

The players on the pitch are better than the trash they sometimes serve up, because we have seen that. Orient away was a perfect example, I was proud to be an albion fan that day and we should have had 3 points. That was incredible attacking football. But the frustrating thing is we can never sustain any sort of decent form, Hence last seasons league place and this seasons up and down season.

There is no given right for us to be at the top of the league or in the playoff's, but only my opinion as a fan that results dont lie and neither do performances and who-ever is in charge of this club whether it be wilkins or Bruce forsyth must be judged on this basis.

Do you think for £25 per match that you are getting value for money Les?

Do you honestly think Wilkins is getting the very best out of these players?

I care about people's opinions and am very interested in them. I just dont feel people can see no wrong with wilkins, when to me and many others he hasnt taken us forward league placing wise or really performances.Personal has changed and soon the excuses will run out. Flashes of brilliance combined with inconsistant trash is not a good recipe for success, surely you see that?

I do agree that performances have been inconsistent but I personally feel a little more time needs to be given to see what Wilkin's does once he has his own team in place. As I have said this time for me will be after the summer.

I definately think £25 is too much for any match in this league no matter what the football. I don't think Wilkin's is necessarily getting the best out of the players but then I think that will take time as I think he is trying to change the way we play. Having watched a fair number of youth matches during his days in charge he seems to focus more on the system of play and slotting players in and making them adaptable. This will take time with the first team but the results could be very good.

Dear god byf, we actually seem to be debating the issues.

 

[Knotty]

Fair comment.

Do you think we are getting the best out of them?

I simply do not know. How does any of us know that we could be doing better?We all have opinions on that, but we don't KNOW.

I do know that some people have expectations that are way too high. Our hopes and expectations of the Albion should be tempered by our financial situation much more than the quality of our players and manager. I firmly believe that they do give 100% all the time. Sadly that 100% might not be good enough to satisfy our hopes.

Sure, we can change the manager (with the attendant costs) and bring in a 'better' manager (with the attendant costs), but would he do any better with the players we have? In my view, unlikely.

 

[byf]

I was merely suggesting tactics and selection may be one of the areas you feel Wilkin's lets himself down and would be willing to expand on that. I am just a fan but I still have opinions on these matters.

I agree we need a leader and I believe Wilkin's recognises this and it's why he got Thompson & Forster and has pushe Elphick to the fore. I know what you mean about El-Abd, he needs to cut out the silly mistakes in his game.



I do agree that performances have been inconsistent but I personally feel a little more time needs to be given to see what Wilkin's does once he has his own team in place. As I have said this time for me will be after the summer.

I definately think £25 is too much for any match in this league no matter what the football. I don't think Wilkin's is necessarily getting the best out of the players but then I think that will take time as I think he is trying to change the way we play. Having watched a fair number of youth matches during his days in charge he seems to focus more on the system of play and slotting players in and making them adaptable. This will take time with the first team but the results could be very good.

Dear god byf, we actually seem to be debating the issues.

Wilkins is obviously under pressure due to the recent success of previous managers who managed to work minor miracles on shoe string budgets..accepts Adams who had a larger budget but still did exceptionally well with it. Also the fact it is so expensive doesnt help wilkins out, as if it was a normal league one price around £15-20...im sure another 1k would be there.

You have made some good points and I hope it does all click for wilkins, as I know fans would love a previous player who has given so much for the club to achieve.

I often just give a quick rant and do not back up my reasoning for the rant or why ive said it and it can come across wrong.

 

[BigGully]

Quite. Steve Coppell anyone?


My main issues about Dean Wilkins, which does make it hard for me rally against the extreme polarised view of some, it something he has very little control over - his lack of experience in first-team management, which in itself leads on to another set of issues which he is still learning.

I certainly do not subscribe to the view that he is tactically naive, and cannot motivate his team. There are far too many examples where this you can demonstrate the exact opposite. It's just that it doesn't happen often enough.

He is now about 75-80 games into his first foray into first-team management. Plenty, some might say, to have everything facing the right way, and settled down enough for us to be motoring up the table. I could make reason after reason, excuse after excuse as to why this is not happening yet. But just because they might be hackneyed old excuses, it doesn't make them any less valid.

My main one - especially bearing in mind the squads we have had since 1999, is the lack of Bobby Zamora. No Zamora - no back-to-back Championships, no higher, elevated expectations. But that's another issue.

I appreciate Wilkins is not the world's greatest media darling - I suspect he'd rather not do the media bit, if he can help it. But if that's what it takes to endear you to him, may I respectfully suggest that there are other ways of judging him than his perceived posture during the game, or how monotoned he can sound when talking to the mumbling Hawesy.

I still believe, despite my brother's scepticism on here, that we will finish in around 10th place this season - the same place Micky Adams finished his first full season as Brighton manager, albeit a division higher.

Oh dear ....... I totally agree with you

 

[Hadlee]

Hadlee, knowing you as well as I do I doubt you would complain if DK had appointed a parrot called Brenda to take Mcghee's place who then lost every single game in charge by 10 goals to nil..

Just for the record I thought we should never have sacked McGhee, but we did so we move on.

Wilkins is not the best Manager we have ever had, nor is he the worst, I feel sorry for him cos he got his team together in the Summer, then since Xmas and the players leaving he's had to rebuild, so we have stuttered a bit.