[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[The Clamp]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-61101906 at 17:49

'Russian casualties suspected after Moskva sinking - US official'

'The US also believes there were casualties when the Russian missile cruiser Moskva sank, the same official tells Reuters news agency.
The senior US official, who was speaking on condition of anonymity, said the number of casualties was unclear.
The ship had a crew of about 500 sailors, and Russia previously said they were successfully evacuated to other ships.
In a Facebook post before the ship sank, Ukrainian officials said Russian rescue efforts were being hampered by ammunition exploding on board and stormy weather.
The BBC is currently unable to verify whether lives were lost.'

Gosh. Hopefully not many of these poor, innocent young Russian conscripts who have been indiscriminately firing an endless barrage of missiles down on innocent women and children before their young, wet behind the ears, victims of Putin’s evil lies, comrades come along to rape and shoot the survivors.

I hope everyone aboard is okay.

 

[essbee1]

Gosh. Hopefully not many of these poor, innocent young Russian conscripts who have been indiscriminately firing an endless barrage of missiles down on innocent women and children before their young, wet behind the ears, victims of Putin’s evil lies, comrades come along to rape and shoot the survivors.

I hope everyone aboard is okay.

I hope none suffered horrific burns and horrors like the people they are shelling in Mariupol are (and have).

 

[The Clamp]

I hope none suffered horrific burns and horrors like the people they are shelling in Mariupol are (and have).

I’ll be frank, I couldn’t give a **** what happens to them.

 

[Baldseagull]

Archimedes principle:

A body at rest in a fluid is acted upon by a force pushing upward called the buoyant force, which is equal to the weight of the fluid that the body displaces. If the body is completely submerged, the volume of fluid displaced is equal to the volume of the body.

Eureka!

 

[Triggaaar]

I am of course 100%pleased it's been sunk, but I'm not sure about your water level remark... water displacement of a heavy floating ship vs volume of material when sunk? any scientists here who'd know?

Archimedes principle:

A body at rest in a fluid is acted upon by a force pushing upward called the buoyant force, which is equal to the weight of the fluid that the body displaces. If the body is completely submerged, the volume of fluid displaced is equal to the volume of the body.

Yes, the volume of sea displaced is equal to the volume of the ship, but the point is that before it sank, it was displacing a lot of sea because air in the hull was also displacing the water. How much it was displacing will be determined by the weight of the metal ship etc, whereas the weight of that metal will not be irrelevant to the water displaced.

A floating vessel could easily displace more water when it's floating, than after sinking.

 

[Eric the meek]

Gosh. Hopefully not many of these poor, innocent young Russian conscripts who have been indiscriminately firing an endless barrage of missiles down on innocent women and children before their young, wet behind the ears, victims of Putin’s evil lies, comrades come along to rape and shoot the survivors.

I hope everyone aboard is okay.

That's the price of being in a 'special military operation'. Results can be unpredictable if you fire missiles at innocent people in special military operations. They might even defend themselves and fire missiles back at you. These former Russian colonies have got no respect.

 

[raymondo]

Yes, the volume of sea displaced is equal to the volume of the ship, but the point is that before it sank, it was displacing a lot of sea because air in the hull was also displacing the water. How much it was displacing will be determined by the weight of the metal ship etc, whereas the weight of that metal will now be irrelevant to the water displaced.

A floating vessel could easily displace more water when it's floating, than after sinking.

Thank you, Triggaaar, that's the answer I was looking for

 

[essbee1]

I’ll be frank, I couldn’t give a **** what happens to them.

Nor me. The more gruesome the death for those f******, the better.

 

[GT49er]

Nor me. The more gruesome the death for those f******, the better.

I'm glad the Ukrainians have zapped a major Russian ship (assuming it didn't catch fire and sink on its own!) and I hope they can sink several more, as well as destroy Russian planes and tanks - but I cannot rejoice in the deaths of the (mostly) young men on the Moskva. They were simply, in their minds, fighting for their country against aggressors and Fascists - that wasn't their fault - it was what they had been brought up with, taught from the cradle to - in their cases - to the grave.
They, just as much as Ukrainian civilians, are victims of Putin's murderous obsession to reconsruct the Soviet Union and restore the USSR's hegemony over the unfortunate Eatern European countries that were forced for 50 years to live under the oppressive jack-boot of the neo-fascist USSR/Russia.
Sadly many more of them will have to die before this is over - and I recognise that Ukraine has both the need and the right to kill as many of them as possible - but I will only rejoice in any Ukraine victories, not in the deaths of young conscripts.

 

[birthofanorange]

This thread has taken a turn towards the macabre, imo. I'm sure every single one of us want this to be over, but this recent talk of almost celebrating deaths on the Russian side is a step too far for me.
As much as I'm horrified by the reports that we receive, I don't want to revel in the loss of lives - sorry.

 

[essbee1]

Fair point. But sadly, many, many more "young conscripts" will perish before this is out. And that is Putin's fault.

 

[birthofanorange]

And that is Putin's fault.

Quite, and that's where my hatred lies.

 

[essbee1]

Quite, and that's where my hatred lies.

But with all respect, his followers (I won't use the term soldiers because that is being too
respectful of the term) are his instruments.

 

[herecomesaregular]

This thread has taken a turn towards the macabre, imo. I'm sure every single one of us want this to be over, but this recent talk of almost celebrating deaths on the Russian side is a step too far for me.
As much as I'm horrified by the reports that we receive, I don't want to revel in the loss of lives - sorry.

You can thank The Clamp for that.

 

[essbee1]

You can thank The Clamp for that.

Not fair. I have a huge personal interest in this - so I have contributed and take responsibility. But I have no
qualms whatsoever in my opinion and I'm sure Clamp doesn't either. In fact, I wish I'd made my point more
strongly.

 

[birthofanorange]

But with all respect, his followers (I won't use the term soldiers because that is being too
respectful of the term) are his instruments.

I would imagine they're as fecked up as US soldiers were being dumped into Vietnam, only with a complete psycho like Putin pulling their strings.
I'm in no way saying that there won't be lots of bloodthirsty freaks among them, but I can't get excited by death....however justified it may seem.

 

[GT49er]

But with all respect, his followers (I won't use the term soldiers because that is being too
respectful of the term) are his instruments.

But many of those soldiers will absolutely believe they are serving their country's just cause against aggressors,that they are protecting Ukraine form nazis. Many of the infantry have come up agaonst te uncomfprtable truth and have deserted - or just buggered off home. The air force and the navy will have had no chance to see that what the have been fed is all just bollocks, based on Putin's obsession wth restoring the USSR and giving KGB officers like him the power they used to wield over everybody east of the Berlin wall.

I suspect many (although certainly not all) of the attrocties against women and children have been perpetrated by the Chechen and Syrian murderous thugs Putin has called in to bolster his army (especially as many in that army aren't so committed to the cause).

 

[birthofanorange]

You can thank The Clamp for that.

I don't thank anybody who's involved in it, and it detracts from the original point of this thread.

 

[The Clamp]

You can thank The Clamp for that.

I apologised for that post. I still hold that view but I acknowledged it was not appropriate to post. Please accept that in the spirit it was meant. Your above post is below your usually very high standard.

Do you know what I actually wish for? Not one more life to be lost on either side except Putin and his facilitators of war. I wish for everyone else to put down their guns and go home to their loved ones without one more drop of blood being spilled.

Let's make that an end to the gruesome posts and I'll end by repeating that I'm sorry for my post.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

And so....the lurch to savagery takes just minutes. Funny old lot, humans

My take? In the war against the greater bad, lives will be lost.

Anyone joining the military and expecting that no mortal peril is on the agenda is a fool.

In the defence of a nation against tyrrany, you can't **** about.

The day for shedding a tear for Russian military dead is a long way off.