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Official thread for the people who hate Uruguay
- Thread starter matthew
- Start date
- Jul 7, 2003
- 47,501
I seem to remember Ghana doing their fair share of cheating- mainly feigning injury- in the last round so can't say I'm that bothered by their protests.
Gully
Monkey in a seagull suit.
He is being made to look a bit of a fool...talking about it not being cheating when you handle the ball on the line...now talking about England cheating when they won the World Cup in 66 with the ball that didn't cross the line.
Barrel of Fun
Abort, retry, fail
I don't think it is the same. The ball in this instance was destined for the net until Suarez intervened. A striker breaking through is not guaranteed to score.
HseagullsH
NSC's tipster
I hate all this cheating bollocks.
I see cheating as doing something 'sneaky' to con the referee, such as a blatant dive or kicking out at a player out of sight of the ref.
A completely unselfish all or nothing block with your hand isn't the same. You know full well the consequences but you are effectively 'taking one for the team'
Although I had Suarez in my fantasy team, he's gone up in my estimations
I see cheating as doing something 'sneaky' to con the referee, such as a blatant dive or kicking out at a player out of sight of the ref.
A completely unselfish all or nothing block with your hand isn't the same. You know full well the consequences but you are effectively 'taking one for the team'
Although I had Suarez in my fantasy team, he's gone up in my estimations
Barrel of Fun
Abort, retry, fail
I hate all this cheating bollocks.
I see cheating as doing something 'sneaky' to con the referee, such as a blatant dive or kicking out at a player out of sight of the ref.
A completely unselfish all or nothing block with your hand isn't the same. You know full well the consequences but you are effectively 'taking one for the team'
Although I had Suarez in my fantasy team, he's gone up in my estimations
So to summarise, cheating is only cheating if it is not certain you will be caught and/or punished? Excellent.
blue and white army
New member
Take a bow Luis Suarez, put his team's advancement before himself. Lets face it if it happened to England everyone on here would be rejoicing. His handball was a superb showing of fantastic reflexes 
HastingsSeagull
Well-known member
Yeh Gus didn't sound great, but people are twisting his early words I think. I agree with his initial point but not the way he made it mainly due to the way he was then baited into expanding his point with poorly thought out examples or trying to explain off the cuff, in a foreign language (all be it one he's used to speaking) which is how the debate is created and how they make the calls flood in. You could tell the presenter was trying to wind him up, not have a debate, as that makes callers phone in for the debate themselves and fills the show.
If he tried to hide the fact he hand-balled or didn't accept the punishment that's cheating, this is gamesmanship for want of a better word. It is purposely taking a 'penalty' included in the rules for the chance the opponent will miss. If the rule was it's a red card and a goal given, he wouldn't have done it. It's not so he took the chance.
In basketball in every match there are perhaps 5 or so deliberate fouls. Probably more. If you intentionally injured a player that is completely different. In basketball you take a foul against your name, take the 'penalty' in this case it was a red card (basketball a foul which is a sixth of a red card essentially), and make the player earn the goal / points. It gives someone two free point shots worth one point each (average hit about 85-90% of them when not under last minute of a key game pressure thus giving roughly a one in four chance they score less than 2 points), instead of giving the player clean through a 99.9% lay-up worth the full 2 points. In football especially in the last minute, you give a player a 3/4 chance to win the game and take your consequence because it's worth the cost. Taking one for the team like Gus said.
If a world class NBA player like Shaq or Dwight Howard freakishly only shoots 40% (most 14 year olds in British school teams can hit over 50% and drunken British uni players get slaughtered by coaches for less than 75%) then that player is completely hacked ("hack a Shaq") in the last couple of minutes of a close game purposely to send him to the line to shoot free throws. This is not cheating it is part of the game. It is not as the game was meant to be played, but is bending the rules to gain an advantage (by following the rules, admitting what you've done and taking the consequences) not breaking them! I.M.H.O.
Purposefully injuring someone, punching the ball into the net, trying to get someone sent off for a challenge, diving, that is all cheating. This is not. Go Gus!
Edit I'd compare it to running the ball into the corner in injury time, and shielding someone from reaching the ball which is not how things were done years ago, probably isn't the right way to play granted, but is not against the rules, and for the sake of passing 20-30 seconds, they usually loose the ball but the cost is worth that and could affect the final score (the whole point).
On a worrying note they don't mention him as Brighton manager, just repeatedly as chelski and Uruguay midfielder. The one comment was a caller saying that's why he's gone no-where in management and a passing comment along the lines of "I believe he's at Brighton"
If he tried to hide the fact he hand-balled or didn't accept the punishment that's cheating, this is gamesmanship for want of a better word. It is purposely taking a 'penalty' included in the rules for the chance the opponent will miss. If the rule was it's a red card and a goal given, he wouldn't have done it. It's not so he took the chance.
In basketball in every match there are perhaps 5 or so deliberate fouls. Probably more. If you intentionally injured a player that is completely different. In basketball you take a foul against your name, take the 'penalty' in this case it was a red card (basketball a foul which is a sixth of a red card essentially), and make the player earn the goal / points. It gives someone two free point shots worth one point each (average hit about 85-90% of them when not under last minute of a key game pressure thus giving roughly a one in four chance they score less than 2 points), instead of giving the player clean through a 99.9% lay-up worth the full 2 points. In football especially in the last minute, you give a player a 3/4 chance to win the game and take your consequence because it's worth the cost. Taking one for the team like Gus said.
If a world class NBA player like Shaq or Dwight Howard freakishly only shoots 40% (most 14 year olds in British school teams can hit over 50% and drunken British uni players get slaughtered by coaches for less than 75%) then that player is completely hacked ("hack a Shaq") in the last couple of minutes of a close game purposely to send him to the line to shoot free throws. This is not cheating it is part of the game. It is not as the game was meant to be played, but is bending the rules to gain an advantage (by following the rules, admitting what you've done and taking the consequences) not breaking them! I.M.H.O.
Purposefully injuring someone, punching the ball into the net, trying to get someone sent off for a challenge, diving, that is all cheating. This is not. Go Gus!
Edit I'd compare it to running the ball into the corner in injury time, and shielding someone from reaching the ball which is not how things were done years ago, probably isn't the right way to play granted, but is not against the rules, and for the sake of passing 20-30 seconds, they usually loose the ball but the cost is worth that and could affect the final score (the whole point).
On a worrying note they don't mention him as Brighton manager, just repeatedly as chelski and Uruguay midfielder. The one comment was a caller saying that's why he's gone no-where in management and a passing comment along the lines of "I believe he's at Brighton"
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mcshane in the 79th
New member
- Nov 4, 2005
- 10,485
I'm surprised so many people at advocating the hand ball and then saying it's Ghana's fault for missing the pen. Ghanascored in the 120th minute. They had the ball heading for the back of the net but someone cheated. It's not the same as hacking someone down when they're through on goal as they still have to beat the keeper. This was a certain goal and it was taken away from them. To then say they had a penalty to win it so it's their fault is bollocks. The pressure on Gyan to make African history was immense, and after they'd scored a perfectly good goal just adds more pressure. Would guarantee if it happened to England/Brighton the reaction would be far different
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HseagullsH
NSC's tipster
There is a difference in my eyes between the two.
Anyway I'm not against cheating whatsoever. It pleases me to see players doing absolute ANYTHING to win. Competitiveness is what it's all about for me.
You will have your views, I have mine
mcshane in the 79th
New member
- Nov 4, 2005
- 10,485
Players doing ANYTHING to win? Brilliant. The game is descending faster and faster into a complete farce
Spider
New member
- Sep 15, 2007
- 3,614
Don't worry. I think almost everyone I know wanted Ghana to win. And that piece of cheating made that preference even stronger. TCB lives in his own little world where his ironic heroism is funny and his views on football are taken seriously.
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
World Cup 'incidents' tend to make FIFA change the rules. Red cards for taking out someone clean through on goal is one example. From this one we are going to have goal-line technology revisited again, and I wouldn't be surprised if they have a good look at the idea of a 'penalty goal' for cases like this.
Juan Albion
Chicken Sniffer 3rd Class
I don't understand all the fuss. This has been happening in the football league for years. It is hardly new.
perth seagull
Well-known member
- Jul 5, 2003
- 5,487
To paraphrase Finchy from the Office, "how can you hate Uruguayans, our coach is one?".
cjd
Well-known member
Not sorry to see the back of Ghana, no matter the circumstances.
As for Adrian Chilles suggesting that Ghana are my "adopted" team now.........no thanks. He is only backing them because his mate Desailly is now "Ghananian". Personally find that a bit odd seeing as he captained FRANCE.
Shame though.......Africa has lost its team. Marvellous how the whole continent is behind them now, but tomorrow, they,ll be machete-ing their neighbours wives and children to death due to tribal differences.
As for Adrian Chilles suggesting that Ghana are my "adopted" team now.........no thanks. He is only backing them because his mate Desailly is now "Ghananian". Personally find that a bit odd seeing as he captained FRANCE.
Shame though.......Africa has lost its team. Marvellous how the whole continent is behind them now, but tomorrow, they,ll be machete-ing their neighbours wives and children to death due to tribal differences.
Gully
Monkey in a seagull suit.
Uncle Spielberg
Well-known member
It was sad Ghana f***ed up but they had a golden chance and blew it. They would not have won the final anyway. I am rooting for Argentina as they have been the best team, have the best players and have the best manager. This is Maradona's World Cup and I would love to see him lift the trophy. He has been the star of the show.