Nani, Gomes and THAT Goal

[drew]

Several issues.
1. Clattenburg was pulled back by Scholes when he didn't give the penalty. He took no action.
2. He saw the deliberate handball (he later admitted this as he said he played advantage) but failed to book Nani as per the laws of the game. A booking that late in the game is unlikely to affect the outcome but a future ban for accumulated bookings could affect the outcome of another game and therefore league positions.
3. He failed to tell Ferdinand to move away.

I am sure Redknapp described Clattenburg as a top ref with his tongue firmly in his cheek as controversy follows him around both on and off the pitch.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Wouldnt of changed anything.

Bit of a cock up all round really, I have no issue with Clattenburg over it, Gomes should have played to the whistle.

The one thing that did piss me off was that our players where told to go away and Rio Could stand there shouting at ref.

But in true NSC style maybe I should write a letter to the FA or something?

 

[severnside gull]

Who gives a f*** on a day like today.

 

[Bob!]

I'm assessing the refereeing standards of the Premier League for our incumbent visit and scouting our future opponents.

 

[The Hon Sec]

I've seen refs take longer than 2 seconds to reverse similar decisions but as said couldnt really give a monkeys Trying to come to terms with our teams performance yesterday and enjoying the attempt.

 

[Icy Gull]

Seeing as this was the same ref who cheated Spurs out of a win against the same team a few years ago, I'm cynical enough to think it may not have been a co-incidence that he let the goal stand or that Ferdinand was allowed to have his input.

 

[Tricky Dicky]

Absolutely no problem with it. Ref played advantage to Spurs and didn't blow his whistle. Quick thinking by Nani, as if Clattenburg had seen it differently, he would have had to book Nani for kicking the ball away.

A minor point, but the ref should not have allowed Rio near him as he was talking to the lino.

Some people suggest that if it hadn't been Utd at OT, it wouldn't have stood - on many occassions I think they do get the rub, as a top team at home, but in this instance, I think it didn't make any difference.

 

[tonymgc]

Great another reason for Tottenham fans to whinge & moan.
IMO there's nowt wrong with it & Gomes has dropped a right clanger

 

[trueblue]

If Gomes really thought it was a free-kick for handball, why was he trying to take it ten yards away from where Nani was still on the deck? The sensible thing would have been to retrospectively given the handball but referees would end up with all sorts of problems if they took that view as there'd be uproar every time an 'advantage' went against the team they'd been trying to help.

 

[withdeanwombat]

Wasn't it possible for the ref to see that no advantage had accrued,and therefore returned to the original offense for a free kick?

The linesman did not flag but could clearly be seen saying it was hand ball,which of course it was.

It would have been truly interesting had it happened at the other end,when,of course,the goal would have been disallowed and a free kick given.Just ask Rio,the true ref in this game.

But I refer to earlier replies.Who cares when Albion are playing so well?

 

[Paxton Dazo]

What a nightmare.

I'm not sure what's worse, this or the fact I had to STAND on the train the whole way back from Manchester to London.

 

[ILIKECANDLES]

I found it funny. I don't like spurs and have nothing but respect for man u.

 

[mcshane in the 79th]

Seeing as this was the same ref who cheated Spurs out of a win against the same team a few years ago, I'm cynical enough to think it may not have been a co-incidence that he let the goal stand or that Ferdinand was allowed to have his input.

If you're referring to the Mendes 'goal', then how is that the ref's fault? He was on the half way line.

 

[Gazwag]

Wasn't it possible for the ref to see that no advantage had accrued,and therefore returned to the original offense for a free kick??

Agreed

The linesman did not flag but could clearly be seen saying it was hand ball,which of course it was.

He did flag after he realised the ref gave the goal.

I would bet my life savings that if it was united who had been scored against the goal would not have stood.

The whole incident shows how united are favoured at home by referees - the ref ordered all of the Spurs players away before he spoke to the lineman, but allowed Ferdinand to join in with the converstaion.

Similar to the attrocious decision a few season ago which denied Spurs a goal in the last minute at Old Trafford when the keeper clear the ball two feet over the line.

 

[Paxton Dazo]

Same ref too with the Mendes goal..

 

[drew]

It was a balls up, not from the point of view that he didn't blow his whistle but that it was deliberate handball and Nani should have been booked. That should not be discretionary.

 

[Acker79]

Caution for Handball?

This is what the law book says under disciplinary action:

Sending-off offences
A player, substitute or substituted player is sent off if he commits any of the
following seven offences:
• denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goalscoring opportunity
by deliberately handling the ball (this does not apply to a goalkeeper within
his own penalty area)

A player, substitute or substituted player who has been sent off must leave the
vicinity of the field of play and the technical area.

And

Handling the ball
Handling the ball involves a deliberate act of a player making contact with
the ball with his hand or arm. The referee must take the following into
consideration:
• the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
• the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
• the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an
infringement
• touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.)
counts as an infringement
• hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) counts as an
infringement

Disciplinary sanctions
There are circumstances when a caution for unsporting behaviour is required
when a player deliberately handles the ball, e.g. when a player:
• deliberately and blatantly handles the ball to prevent an opponent gaining
possession
• attempts to score a goal by deliberately handling the ball

A player is sent off, however, if he prevents a goal or an obvious goalscoring
opportunity by deliberately handling the ball. This punishment arises not from
the act of the player deliberately handling the ball but from the unacceptable
and unfair intervention that prevented a goal being scored.
Restart of play
• Direct free kick from the position where the offence occurred (see Law 13 –
Position of free kick) or penalty kick

Outside his own penalty area, the goalkeeper has the same restrictions
on handling the ball as any other player. Inside his own penalty area, the
goalkeeper cannot be guilty of a handling offence incurring a direct free kick
or any misconduct related to handling the ball. He can, however, be guilty of
several handling offences that incur an indirect free kick.

Deliberate handball isn't enough for a card. Would it be fair to say Nani stopped Tottenham gaining possession considering the ball was going out of play, he grabbed it because he thought it was a penalty, and Gomes picked it up and took possession anyway? As a Man Utd hater, I'd say yes, but it's not a guaranteed booking. Deliberately handling the ball isn't a guaranteed yellow, it's how it affects the game that leads to cautions/sendings off.


Advantage
This is what the book has to say on such things:

The authority of the referee
Each match is controlled by a referee who has full authority to enforce the
Laws of the Game in connection with the match to which he has been
appointed.

Powers and duties
The Referee:
• enforces the Laws of the Game
• controls the match in cooperation with the assistant referees and, where
applicable, with the fourth official
• acts as timekeeper and keeps a record of the match
• stops, suspends or abandons the match, at his discretion, for any
infringements of the Laws
• stops, suspends or abandons the match because of outside
interference of any kind
• allows play to continue when the team against which an offence has been
committed will benefit from such an advantage and penalises the original
offence if the anticipated advantage does not ensue at that time
• punishes the more serious offence when a player commits more than one
offence at the same time
• takes disciplinary action against players guilty of cautionable
and sending-off offences. He is not obliged to take this action immediately
but must do so when the ball next goes out of play
• takes action against team officials who fail to conduct themselves in a
responsible manner and may, at his discretion, expel them from the field of
play and its immediate surrounds
• acts on the advice of the assistant referees regarding incidents that he has
not seen
• ensures that no unauthorised persons enter the field of play
• indicates the restart of the match after it has been stopped
• provides the appropriate authorities with a match report, which includes
information on any disciplinary action taken against players and/or team
officials and any other incidents that occurred before, during or after the
match

Decisions of the referee
The decisions of the referee regarding facts connected with play, including
whether or not a goal is scored and the result of the match, are final.
The referee may only change a decision on realising that it is incorrect or, at his
discretion, on the advice of an assistant referee or the fourth official, provided
that he has not restarted play or terminated the match.

For me everyone involved need to be embarrassed, except perhaps the linesman.


Nani - Should not have handled the ball. He may have thought it was a penalty, but as so many people are quick to tell Gomes "play to the referee's whistle". There's also an element of fair play. He knew he handballed it, he knew that's why Gomes put the ball down. But fair play isn't so important in football these days, unfortunately.

Gomes - Play to the ref's whistle. If you thought it was handball, why take the ball 8 yards away from the incident? Why back away from the ball so much and for so long? Why ignore the ref's indications that the ball is still in play?

Clattenberg - Reports are that the linesman told him there was a handball. The linesman was waving for an infringement, so why are you overruling someone who apparently saw something you didn't and was better placed to see it? If you played advantage, why not bring it back when Nani stood over the ball?

The question no one seems to answer with any certainty is would it have happened at the other end?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

All things considered, if I were a Spurs fan I'd be thinking my 'keeper is a bit of a prick.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

All things considered, if I were a Spurs fan I'd be thinking my 'keeper is a bit of a prick.

yep.

 

[drew]

All things considered, if I were a Spurs fan I'd be thinking my 'keeper is a bit of a prick.

Irrespective of the ins and outs of the laws, you still play to the whistle. Memories of Barthez and Di Canio.