[Drinking] Milk

[tedebear]

The more I hear about the dairy industry as well as the beef and pork industries, the more I choose other products, although bacon, sausages and cheese are really just yum...But I need to make my own personal choices in line with my own environmental desires...although I'm far from perfect in what I choose, but I am trying to be more concious.

Having said that, drinking full fat milk is what I've read is not great for you, we as humans cannot digest saturated fatty acids very well as opposed to young cows that are its intended consumer!. This causes an increased risk of cardio vascular disease and stroke as it raises the ratio of LDL to HDL cholesterol. HDL (good) moves the LDL (bad) out of the bloodstream so you want more HDL than LDL. Full fat increases LDL so should be reduced in your diet....Thats my less than scientific understanding anyhow...

I'm mid switch to almond milk (drink / juice as its not really milk) I have it now in smoothies, but need to switch the coffee and tea now...somewhat aprehensive!

 

[herecomesaregular]

I do remember a big newspaper article that you really only ought to drink organic milk, the rest is really poor quality and poor animal welfare.

As for almond milk, American especially, it's awful for the bee population apparently who are worked to exhaustion and death. More details available on Google.

 

[beorhthelm]

Please can you explain this point?

In the UK quite a lot of our almond milk comes from European, rain watered almonds.

Even looking at a place like California, almond milk uses less water per litre, less land and has a lower carbon footprint.

Cows milk uses twice as much water to produce the same amount of milk vs almond milk.

Oat milk doesn't have to be made with all those ingredients anyway, only certain brands will have that.

how much land use changes and water consumed if we switched from dairy to almond gallon for gallon?

alternatives look good because they are so low consumption, they dont scale out.

 

[Goldstone Guy]

Some fantastic parody replies from people pretending to be “wokeistas” - really made me laugh. This thread couldn’t have gone better - some genuine insight and some brilliant trolling from pretend “vegans”.

Anyone who tries to discredit what others are saying by using the term "woke/wokeism/wokeistas/woke-something" is not worth listening to (see Anderson, Lee).

 

[tedebear]

I do remember a big newspaper article that you really only ought to drink organic milk, the rest is really poor quality and poor animal welfare.

As for almond milk, American especially, it's awful for the bee population apparently who are worked to exhaustion and death. More details available on Google.

Almonds are out. Dairy is a disaster. So what milk should we drink?

A glass of dairy milk produces almost three times more greenhouse gas than any plant-based milk. But vegan options have drawbacks of their own

www.theguardian.com

Yes, its hard to keep up, but I might try hazlenut next..

 

[abc]

Please can you explain this point?

In the UK quite a lot of our almond milk comes from European, rain watered almonds.

Even looking at a place like California, almond milk uses less water per litre, less land and has a lower carbon footprint.

Cows milk uses twice as much water to produce the same amount of milk vs almond milk.

Oat milk doesn't have to be made with all those ingredients anyway, only certain brands will have that.


Factually incorrect.

When it comes to lowering our carbon footprint, what we eat makes far more difference than where it comes from.

View attachment 183144

Sorry but you statements re almond milk are incorrect.

Almonds can only be grown in dry, hot climates. Farming almonds requires large amounts of irrigation at a time when these areas are getting dryer due to climate change and the competition for water is increasing. ONE almond requires 6.44 litres of water. One litre of Almond milk on average uses 107 litres of blue water (water that is suitable for human consumption) whilst cows milk requires just 8 litres of blue water on average. (Figures from Cranfield University's report on climate change).This is predominantly because dairying is globally concentrated in areas of high rainfall. In the UK, the use of blue water could be reduced to zero if cow's drinking water was collected and stored from rainfall. This is not possible in areas suitable for growing almonds and in many such areas the large almond farms are clashing directly with a population that are facing water shortages.
That is the main reason why Almond milk is bad from a sustainability perspective but also add the fact that any cows milk you buy will be produced n the UK when no almond milk ever can be.

From a health perspective, cows milk is an entirely natural unprocessed product whilst the average almond milk offer contains 2% almonds (Also Cranfield University). Water, added sweeteners, vitamins, minerals and thickening agents make up the rest.
None of this means you should drink cows milk if you don't want to but it is why I say oat milk is a more sustainable alternative - preferably from organic oats.

There is no 'factually correct' answer as to whether how or what we farm is most important - as said it is a very nuanced debate and both are relevant. The IPPC (Intergovernmental panel on Climate change) stated that livestock farming in northern europe is part of the solution to climate change because of available rainfall, grass as a carbon sink etc. However this assumes that livestock are grazed rather than kept in doors all year and if they are not then they are part of the problem not the solution.
Similarly soya 'milk' environmental disastrous if rainforest is being cut down to grow the soya. If it is grown on ordinary arable land (it is even possible in the UK) in a sound rotation then there is nothing wrong with soya.

Both of my examples are nuanced; both can be good and both can be bad. This is why I believe it is the 'how' not the 'what' where we should focus first and foremost.

​

 

[abc]

He won't be able to because it's not true

Cows only produce milk when they are pregnant so your organic dairy farm is incredibly likely artificially inseminating the cows to they constantly produce milk and babies, doesn't sound very organic to me

I don't understand your point. What does Organic farming mean to you?

 

[abc]

The more I hear about the dairy industry as well as the beef and pork industries, the more I choose other products, although bacon, sausages and cheese are really just yum...But I need to make my own personal choices in line with my own environmental desires...although I'm far from perfect in what I choose, but I am trying to be more concious.

Having said that, drinking full fat milk is what I've read is not great for you, we as humans cannot digest saturated fatty acids very well as opposed to young cows that are its intended consumer!. This causes an increased risk of cardio vascular disease and stroke as it raises the ratio of LDL to HDL cholesterol. HDL (good) moves the LDL (bad) out of the bloodstream so you want more HDL than LDL. Full fat increases LDL so should be reduced in your diet....Thats my less than scientific understanding anyhow...

I'm mid switch to almond milk (drink / juice as its not really milk) I have it now in smoothies, but need to switch the coffee and tea now...somewhat aprehensive!

Just for interest, what do you think the full fat % of cows milk is? The answer is just 3.6% which officially makes it a low fat food. There is currently a very significant shift in consumer behaviour to full fat milk (as opposed to skimmed/semi skimmed) because apparently sound research has shown the body absorbs the vitamins and nutrients better from full fat. The consumption of alternative milks is also dropping in favour of cows milk. Market research suggests this is primarily due to cost but also due to the realisation that the alternatives are all highly processed when cows milk is not.

As a previous poster commented 'you cant keep up'! I am sure the answer is to drink or eat what suits you, always in sensible moderation as part of a balanced diet and live and let live if you don't agree with someone else's preference!

 

[abc]

As a previous poster commented 'you cant keep up'!

Almonds are out. Dairy is a disaster. So what milk should we drink?

A glass of dairy milk produces almost three times more greenhouse gas than any plant-based milk. But vegan options have drawbacks of their own

www.theguardian.com

Yes, its hard to keep up, but I might try hazlenut next..

Sorry, that was you!

 

[zefarelly]

Like wives but less demanding.

Thats one way of looking at it

 

[jackanada]

To quote Ron Burgundy; "And you ate the whole wheel of cheese? How'd you do that? Heck, I'm not even mad; that's amazing.”

It's not just me. There's the missus and three primary age children.
Christ knows what the food bill is going to be when they're teenagers.

Oh and three dozen eggs, I haven't dared tot up the other foodstuffs.

 

[tedebear]

Sorry, that was you!

No worries was just trying to badly make the point that almond milk was originally the way forward, until the water consumption was mentioned...now it appears hazlenuts are...

 

[Seagull58]

i switched to lactose free milk, quit the omeprazole, gaviscon. Very very few burps or indigestion since!

Soy milk for me.

 

[schmunk]

But coconut milk has been a thing for decades.

What about peanut "butter"?

Yeah! And what about "Custard" "Cream"s...?

SHAMBLES

 

[Coldeanseagull]

I drink a lot of milk. so much so, I married a cow

 

[AstroSloth]

how much land use changes and water consumed if we switched from dairy to almond gallon for gallon?

alternatives look good because they are so low consumption, they dont scale out.

They scale out far better than dairy lmao.

Per litre they use less water, less land and have a lower carbon footprint.

If you scale it up then it would lower the impact due to reducing inefficiencies due to smaller scale size currently.

 

[A mex eyecan]

I drink a lot of milk. so much so, I married a cow

you deserve a pat on the head

 

[HalfaSeatOn]

Used to be a big milk drinker and now just oat milk, coconut milk etc that my wife stocks in the fridge. A mix of laziness but I think that film ‘Cow’ had an impact.

 

[BN9 BHA]

So, I get through four 2l bottles of semi skimmed milk per week. I drink it mostly straight. My girlfriend finds it very weird - and says it’s the behaviour of a movie villain.

View attachment 183101

I saw this today and thought of you

 

[abc]

Per litre they use less water, less land and have a lower carbon footprint.
.

Please base your assertion on knowledge and facts rather than your bias. What you are saying is simply not true. If we are to ever address climate change we have to abandon personal bias or preference in favour of what actually makes a difference and is true