Lewis Hamilton

[Gullywog]

and his colleagues in the england team are of the same standard, hence playing for man united/arsenal/liverpool, but as a team they leave a lot to be desired in most instances.

Wes Brown notched a good goal yesterday didn't he??

He is a fine example of English players, they are not world beaters, that is not Mr Brown's fault.

Are you saying that because he plays for a top four side, he is world Class?

 

[One True BHA]

And lost to South Africa in the test series

Anyway, what does one series mean? It's no different to one football match, or one grand prix. Tell me that England have world class cricketers when they have either a) the best batsman in the world, b) the best bowler in the world, or alternatively tell me they're a world class TEAM when they reach the top of either the test or ODI tables.

a test side and one day side are two completely different teams. different sports almost.

one series is different from one football match, in that is it more than one match

pietersen and flintoff at a very minimum from our ODI team would walk into every other

 

[Barrel of Fun]

I've no idea how long footballers spend actually on the training pitch, but I'm sure they have to remain dedicated to their profession 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. There are a lot of things they won't be able to do, and a lot of rules to stick to. As professionals, they ensure they're in top condition all year round. Very different to amateurs who have another job (something that, in itself, compromises their sporting pedigree), and only have to be at their peak once every FOUR YEARS. I mean I reckon even I could get fit once every four years

That has to be a wind up. Besides which, the Olympics is the pinnacle of their respective sports, but there are plenty of competitions in the meantime.

Surely to be a world class footballer, they would have to perform on the world stage (once every four years)?

 

[One True BHA]

Wes Brown notched a good goal yesterday didn't he??

He is a fine example of English players, they are not world beaters, that is not Mr Brown's fault.

Are you saying that because he plays for a top four side, he is world Class?

no, of course not. he is a good player, but not outstanding.

lampard is arguably the pinnacle of the chelsea team. brown is merely a squad player at united who could quite easily be replaced.

i like how you ignored the rest of my comment

 

[Barrel of Fun]

- None of those players are playing now, or have been for some years.
- If they were able to succeed in an environment populated by supremely fit sportsman whilst under the influence then that's even greater testimony to their talent.

They don't make these stories up about Ledley King or John Terry or many other players getting into drunken brawls in night clubs.

 

[One True BHA]

- None of those players are playing now, or have been for some years.
- If they were able to succeed in an environment populated by supremely fit sportsman whilst under the influence then that's even greater testimony to their talent.

so you think no sportsmen go out and get hammered on the weekends?

you really are on another planet if you believe that

 

[seagulls4ever]

According to the Argus on Friday the Brighton players train 2 or 3 hours a day and have Wednesdays off and Sundays off (if my memory serves me correctly).

Michael Phelps trains for 5 hours every day.

Brighton players are not world class but you get my point.

 

[One True BHA]

Ok, let's split hairs, it's not the same as one football match or grand prix, it's the same as five. Wahey.

As I said, come back to me when we reach the top of any of the individual or team tables. We won't.

five matches, as in two less that what it would take to win the world cup?

what like pietersen did last year? or flintoff as a bowler the year before?

i know it's in the past, but to be "world class" does not mean you have to be head and shoulders above the rest. being able to compete at the same level as "the best in the world" puts you in that class.

 

[One True BHA]

I'm pretty sure they can't go out three times a week and down 20 pints like you or I could should we wish.

you'd be surprised

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Michael Phelps trains for 5 hours every day.

Brighton players are

And the rest.

He is in the gym for 3 hours alone

 

[tedebear]

Yep, so when they become professional and dedicate every minute of every day to their sport they can then come under consideration for 'world class.'

In my opinion an athlete is far more "world class" when they are at the top of their game for free. Yes they may achieve further greatness when they are paid to do it, but doing it on your own has to be a far greater achievement.

AND I come from a family with an Olympian - who (I'm told) trained from 5am til 8am, then went to work and came home to train again before starting it all again, FOR FREE - 7 days a week!!

Question - is Michael Phelps world class?

 

[One True BHA]

Well that's clearly where we disagree. For me, world class is the best in the world, or as good as the best in the world if there are more than one. "Being able to compete with" is a feeble way of viewing it. I mean Andorra competed with England the other night. By your reckoning both those sides would be world class! Typical English attitude is to accept second best, and to label all these overrated posers world class because they knock in a couple of goals against West Brom when surrounded with some genuinely world class players.

the england team are not world class, hence 15th in fifa ranking.

being able to compete with, on a regular basis, then. better?

as in man united and chelsea regularly compete with each other to win the premiership.

genuinely world class players like whom, then? you belittle lampard, but who playing alongside him is as good as "torres kaka messi" as you previously mentioned? essien? no, he can not be compared unless it is to someone like fabregas, where he comes off worse. malouda? of course not. drogba? don't make me laugh. anelka? i think i might puke.

lampard would walk into the madrid team, the barcelona team, milan/inter/united/liverpool/arsenal/any other f***ing club in the world. to me, that says he is world class.

end of story.

 

[Gullywog]

genuinely world class players like whom, then? you belittle lampard, but who playing alongside him is as good as "torres kaka messi" as you previously mentioned? essien? no, he can not be compared unless it is to someone like fabregas, where he comes off worse. malouda? of course not. drogba? don't make me laugh. anelka? i think i might puke.

Drogba is incredible, when he plays at his best and doesn't try to cheat or moan, he is arguably the most threatening player in the world, in his position as a footballer (striker) that is a massive facet.

I would rather have Drogba than Berbatov, and Man Utd have just paid 30.5 million pounds for him!!

 

[1067Seagull]

Surely the results from the last week have proved, that, person for person, given the size of this country compared to China and America, we have the best spastics in the world, and I'm for one far prouder of them than Lewis Hamilton.

 

[tedebear]

I think you miss my point. I agree with everything you've just said, but that's not what I'm arguing about. Yes, someone training the 5am-8am and then competing in the Olympics is a fantastic achievement. Someone doing it for free is highly commendable. Yes, they should feel proud of what they achieve. BUT that still doesn't make them better than professionals. Ok, if you're getting paid millions to do something the sense of achievement may be less, but because you're able to devote all your time and reap the benefit of all the best technology you're going to be better than the poor sould who's waking up at 5am every morning for a run in the park.

I know what your point is and yes in some sports (not all for example - swimming/cycling/marathons) the professionals are better, but I'm trying to prove that thats a sad view to take.