Handbrake RANT

[Herr Tubthumper]

BBC NEWS | England | Hampshire | Text driver jailed for bike death

Or is there some limit on the number of deaths that are permissible before it needs to be dealt with?

By all means deal with it. Driving at 45 in a 30 and texting is plain irresponsible.

 

[sten_super]

By all means deal with it. Driving at 45 in a 30 and texting is plain irresponsible.

And the accident had absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the cyclist ran a red light? If that cyclist had not run that light, would the accident have still happened?

There's not much point opening an old debate (I originally posted that link about a year ago) but for my cyclists running red lights is a crazy and completely unnecessary risk which saves them all of about 2 minutes and puts their life in real danger. I just don't understand the mentality one bit.

Getting back on track, idiot motorists also annoy the hell out of me. Middle-lane drivers and those that don't use their indicators are the worst for me.

 

[Notters]

And the accident had absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the cyclist ran a red light? If that cyclist had not run that light, would the accident have still happened?

There's not much point opening an old debate (I originally posted that link about a year ago) but for my cyclists running red lights is a crazy and completely unnecessary risk which saves them all of about 2 minutes and puts their life in real danger. I just don't understand the mentality one bit.

Getting back on track, idiot motorists also annoy the hell out of me. Middle-lane drivers and those that don't use their indicators are the worst for me.

I'm with you Sten... I find it far more irritating when I too, am on a bike, though.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

And the accident had absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the cyclist ran a red light? If that cyclist had not run that light, would the accident have still happened?

There's not much point opening an old debate (I originally posted that link about a year ago) but for my cyclists running red lights is a crazy and completely unnecessary risk which saves them all of about 2 minutes and puts their life in real danger. I just don't understand the mentality one bit.

Getting back on track, idiot motorists also annoy the hell out of me. Middle-lane drivers and those that don't use their indicators are the worst for me.

Clearly the cyclist played their part but the far greater irresponsibility is with the motorist. If you're in charge of a huge vehicle which, as has been demonstrated here, you have a duty to be bloody careful. When I drive I am pretty damn careful, courteous and spacially aware at all times.

I only took to driving at a late age, and have now sold my car. The first things which struck me about car drivers is how selfish and incredibly impatient they are. If I was developing a driving test I would seriously have a blood pressure and impatience test. Anyone failing doesnt get a license. Simple. The roads would be a much safer place.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

I only used my handbrake when stopped at lights on an incline , otherwise just kept my foot on the brake pedal as my jamjar was an automatic and liked to creep forward even when stationary.

 

[Uncle C]

Oh, don't get me started on that... I must've driven 200,000 miles in the last 5 or 6 years and it's only been foggy enough to need fog lights twice.

If the car is approaching, a good blast of main beam often does the trick.

 

[Garage_Doors]

Clearly the cyclist played their part but the far greater irresponsibility is with the motorist. If you're in charge of a huge vehicle which, as has been demonstrated here, you have a duty to be bloody careful. When I drive I am pretty damn careful, courteous and spacially aware at all times.

I only took to driving at a late age, and have now sold my car. The first things which struck me about car drivers is how selfish and incredibly impatient they are. If I was developing a driving test I would seriously have a blood pressure and impatience test. Anyone failing doesnt get a license. Simple. The roads would be a much safer place.

Disagree completely.
If the cyclist decides to run the red light then clearly the cyclist played the greater part and should accept the far greater responsibility than the motorist.

If the cyclist decides to run a red light then he has to accept responsibility for any resultant outcome of this action.
He or she knows that by going through a red light there will be opposing traffic coming his way and has chosen to enter it.

To say the other road users they are obeying road instructions correctly should should have the responsibility to look out for those who are not in these cases is ridiculous.

 

[Uncle C]

My dad cycles a lot and he says the same. I find cyclists picking and choosing when they want to be a pedestrian and road user incredibly annoying too, not to mention dangerous. The rules of the road are for ALL who use it!

My pet hate is cyclists riding on the pavement, then pushing the button on the pelican crossing so they can cycle to the opposite pavement. I often wonder what the outcry would be if I did this on my motorbike.

 

[Napper]

My dad cycles a lot and he says the same. I find cyclists picking and choosing when they want to be a pedestrian and road user incredibly annoying too, not to mention dangerous. The rules of the road are for ALL who use it!

not at all, lights slow momentum of the cyclist down, if it's clear to go then cyclist can jump the lights. A bike slowly jumping lights isnt going to kill anyone

 

[Uncle C]

not at all, lights slow momentum of the cyclist down, if it's clear to go then cyclist can jump the lights. A bike slowly jumping lights isnt going to kill anyone

I hope I don't meet you on the roads, with your overwhelming command of the Highway Code

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Disagree completely.
If the cyclist decides to run the red light then clearly the cyclist played the greater part and should accept the far greater responsibility than the motorist.

If the cyclist decides to run a red light then he has to accept responsibility for any resultant outcome of this action.
He or she knows that by going through a red light there will be opposing traffic coming his way and has chosen to enter it.

To say the other road users they are obeying road instructions correctly should should have the responsibility to look out for those who are not in these cases is ridiculous.

So, given the context of our exchange, i.e. the case supplied, you believe that driving at speed and texting is a lesser crime than cycling through a red light? Can you explain this please. I'm a little lost with your argument.

 

[cardboard]

On my way home up past Preston Road towards the A23 and loads of Motorcyclists ride up the cycle lane!!!
Its well dangerous

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Disagree completely.
If the cyclist decides to run the red light then clearly the cyclist played the greater part and should accept the far greater responsibility than the motorist.

If the cyclist decides to run a red light then he has to accept responsibility for any resultant outcome of this action.
He or she knows that by going through a red light there will be opposing traffic coming his way and has chosen to enter it.

To say the other road users they are obeying road instructions correctly should should have the responsibility to look out for those who are not in these cases is ridiculous.

I bet you also think any woman who has been drinking is asking for it eh?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

To say the other road users they are obeying road instructions correctly should should have the responsibility to look out for those who are not in these cases is ridiculous.

Of course we do. You're the one being rediculous. If a child runs out into the street I have a duty to spot them. If someone is being a little less careful than normal for whatever reason I also feel I have a duty to conduct myself in a manner conducive to their well being. It is called responsibility. Just because you obay the rules it doesnt give you carte blanche to mow down anyone who isnt.

 

[Napper]

I hope I don't meet you on the roads, with your overwhelming command of the Highway Code

depends on the traffic lights, if just to let people cross the road then fair enough to jump. Wouldnt jump onto a roundabout etc. Often getting up momentum before a car pulls away stops the cars cutting you up

 

[sten_super]

not at all, lights slow momentum of the cyclist down, if it's clear to go then cyclist can jump the lights. A bike slowly jumping lights isnt going to kill anyone

Cylist jumps lights. Car, perfectly legally doing 30 across the junction for which they have a green light, for whatever reason doesn't see bike (possibly because bike is flashing across at 20mph, which I have seen). Hits bike, cyclist is knocked off and killed. Car swerves into pavement and mows down 3 pedestrians waiting (as they should be) at the crossing.

Completely fictional but completely feasible example of why it is not okay for a cyclist to ignore the rules of the road. As I said above, I simply cannot understand your viewpoint. All you are going to lose is a few seconds (or maybe even *shock horror* a couple of minutes) waiting for the lights to change, oh and you may have to impart slightly more effort getting started again. Is it really worth risking your life over (which is what you are doing, whether you want to admit it or not).

A lot of cyclists that have this mentality seem to think that it is only themselves that they are putting into danger doing this, so therefore it is okay. That, of course, is complete nonsense, in exactly the same way it is when a car driver thinks the same thing. Other road users have to respond to what you are doing, and can as a result put themselves, and others, into danger, all as a result of the reckless behaviour of ONE person.

Herr, I think I understand what you are saying. I don't think Programme_Seller is saying that users should have carte blanche. At the same time, EVERYONE who uses the road needs to exercise caution and common sense. Far too many cyclists (in my experience) think that they have carte blanche to do what they want, and everyone else will have to react to that and damned to the consequences.

 

[Napper]

Cylist jumps lights. Car, perfectly legally doing 30 across the junction for which they have a green light, for whatever reason doesn't see bike (possibly because bike is flashing across at 20mph, which I have seen). Hits bike, cyclist is knocked off and killed. Car swerves into pavement and mows down 3 pedestrians waiting (as they should be) at the crossing.

Completely fictional but completely feasible example of why it is not okay for a cyclist to ignore the rules of the road. As I said above, I simply cannot understand your viewpoint. All you are going to lose is a few seconds (or maybe even *shock horror* a couple of minutes) waiting for the lights to change, oh and you may have to impart slightly more effort getting started again. Is it really worth risking your life over (which is what you are doing, whether you want to admit it or not).

A lot of cyclists that have this mentality seem to think that it is only themselves that they are putting into danger doing this, so therefore it is okay. That, of course, is complete nonsense, in exactly the same way it is when a car driver thinks the same thing. Other road users have to respond to what you are doing, and can as a result put themselves, and others, into danger, all as a result of the reckless behaviour of ONE person.

Herr, I think I understand what you are saying. I don't think Programme_Seller is saying that users should have carte blanche. At the same time, EVERYONE who uses the road needs to exercise caution and common sense. Far too many cyclists (in my experience) think that they have carte blanche to do what they want, and everyone else will have to react to that and damned to the consequences.

yeah but as mentioned only jump lights where you arn't cycling across the path of any other traffic , ie pedestrian crossing with no junctions

 

[sten_super]

yeah but as mentioned only jump lights where you arn't cycling across the path of any other traffic , ie pedestrian crossing with no junctions

I can see the argument for that, but as a cyclist it's not anything I've ever done, while I was actually hit once (thankfully a glancing blow) by a cyclist that didn't stop at a pedestrian crossing and ploughed into me as I stepped off the kerb when my light went green. So I'm afriad you're not going to convince me!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Cylist jumps lights. Car, perfectly legally doing 30 across the junction for which they have a green light, for whatever reason doesn't see bike (possibly because bike is flashing across at 20mph, which I have seen). Hits bike, cyclist is knocked off and killed. Car swerves into pavement and mows down 3 pedestrians waiting (as they should be) at the crossing.

Completely fictional but completely feasible example of why it is not okay for a cyclist to ignore the rules of the road. As I said above, I simply cannot understand your viewpoint. All you are going to lose is a few seconds (or maybe even *shock horror* a couple of minutes) waiting for the lights to change, oh and you may have to impart slightly more effort getting started again. Is it really worth risking your life over (which is what you are doing, whether you want to admit it or not).

A lot of cyclists that have this mentality seem to think that it is only themselves that they are putting into danger doing this, so therefore it is okay. That, of course, is complete nonsense, in exactly the same way it is when a car driver thinks the same thing. Other road users have to respond to what you are doing, and can as a result put themselves, and others, into danger, all as a result of the reckless behaviour of ONE person.

Herr, I think I understand what you are saying. I don't think Programme_Seller is saying that users should have carte blanche. At the same time, EVERYONE who uses the road needs to exercise caution and common sense. Far too many cyclists (in my experience) think that they have carte blanche to do what they want, and everyone else will have to react to that and damned to the consequences.

Get real. We can all hypothesis about freak accidents. This my whole bloody point.

 

[Napper]

I can see the argument for that, but as a cyclist it's not anything I've ever done, while I was actually hit once (thankfully a glancing blow) by a cyclist that didn't stop at a pedestrian crossing and ploughed into me as I stepped off the kerb when my light went green. So I'm afriad you're not going to convince me!

you are talking of extreme situations where a cyclist is going full pelt . I'm talking appraoching a traffic lights with caution , having a good look and jumping just before it turns to amber. Gives cyclist the jump on traffic . Technically against law but 100% safe.