[Politics] Brexit - Deal we have or Rejoin CU/SM

[Wokeworrier]

Brexit to blame for rising inflation, says former Bank of England governor

Mark Carney says Bank’s negative predictions about consequences of leaving EU ‘proven to be the case’

www.theguardian.com

... but Mark Carney is an expert so I expect Brexiters will switch off to his analysis.

Is that the 'expert' who previously said ...

"in 2016 the British economy was 90% the size of Germany’s. Now it is less than 70%"

... which turned out to be total bollox? Same old same old.

What Mark Carney got wrong

In a recent interview with the Financial Times, former Bank of England Governor Mark Carney made the striking claim that ‘in 2016 the British economy was 90% the size of Germany’s. Now it is less t…

julianhjessop.com

Carney v Portes. Does it Matter? - Briefings For Britain

It was disingenuous for a former Governor of the Bank of England to compare the UK economy exclusively with the German economy when they have very different dominate industries, international trade, and energy provision and then pretend the relative performance had something to do with Brexit.

www.briefingsforbritain.co.uk

 

[Wokeworrier]

winning financial ruination feels good....................... i can't argue with that

Could be worse rog, we could be in recession like Germany and the Eurozone ..

 

[Wokeworrier]

I’ve said this before, we did not vote for a trading agreement in the 70s, as we had already joined the equivalent of EFTA in 1960.
Since 2016, we’ve thrown the baby out with the bath water, and leavers like yourself should be campaigning for the trade agreement to be restored, to help businesses etc.
Those of us on regular medication are facing difficulties at the chemists because, they’re not in stock, so come back next week. Over 90% of insulin comes from Denmark, for example.

After all, the Leave campaign, said, Nobody is talking about leaving the Single Market. Even Farage, said we could have a Norway deal. All lies of course.

Speaking of spreading lies .. the main players on both sides were pretty clear on leaving the single market.

 

[Machiavelli]

I’ve said this before, we did not vote for a trading agreement in the 70s, as we had already joined the equivalent of EFTA in 1960.
Since 2016, we’ve thrown the baby out with the bath water, and leavers like yourself should be campaigning for the trade agreement to be restored, to help businesses etc.
Those of us on regular medication are facing difficulties at the chemists because, they’re not in stock, so come back next week. Over 90% of insulin comes from Denmark, for example.

After all, the Leave campaign, said, Nobody is talking about leaving the Single Market. Even Farage, said we could have a Norway deal. All lies of course.

To believe one thing the Leave campaign said is to fundamentally misunderstand what actually occurred during the referendum. The Leave campaign said multiple things to multiple different audiences, some of which were contradictory to one another, and much of which was unlikely ever to be delivered. This was probably the biggest problem with the referendum: one side lacked accountability, and this directly flowed from the question posed and the structure of the way the referendum was organised. So, while so many are so keen to point the finger at Farage, Johnson, etc, the biggest culprits were Cameron and Osborne.
This is what the Conservative Party does to the country, and has done throughout my lifetime, they screw up the country, and a sufficient enough sector of the electorate view them as a safe-pair of hands and the natural fit for government.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

To believe one thing the Leave campaign said is to fundamentally misunderstand what actually occurred during the referendum. The Leave campaign said multiple things to multiple different audiences, some of which were contradictory to one another, and much of which was unlikely ever to be delivered. This was probably the biggest problem with the referendum: one side lacked accountability, and this directly flowed from the question posed and the structure of the way the referendum was organised. So, while so many are so keen to point the finger at Farage, Johnson, etc, the biggest culprits were Cameron and Osborne.
This is what the Conservative Party does to the country, and has done throughout my lifetime, they screw up the country, and a sufficient enough sector of the electorate view them as a safe-pair of hands and the natural fit for government.

Agreed. Throw everything out there to confuse the electorate, which succeeded.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Brexit still isn’t ‘done’.

 

[chickens]

Brexit still isn’t ‘done’.

Actually necessary, Hunt has made the right decision, but we all know he’s going to try and delay implementing this until the next election, so the Conservatives have got some instant mud to throw at any non-Conservative government that may be elected.

 

[Gwylan]

One thing that I've started to see suggested by various commentors, is that the Tories suggest rejoining the EU, wrong-footing the Labour party as the side wanting to stick to a lousy deal.

I can't see it happening myself, at least not before the GE, but I could see it happening afterwards if Labour sticks with its Brexit policy ... particularly if the Tories get a drubbing.

What has definitely happened is the Torygraph has become much more critical of Brexit over the past few months. It's always been rabidly anti-EU and pro-Brexit - that's no longer the case. And the Torygraph is a good indicator of the way that the party is thinking.

It's very, very unlikely that the next Tory manifesto contains a commitment to rejoin the EU but I wouldn't entirely rule it out.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

One thing that I've started to see suggested by various commentors, is that the Tories suggest rejoining the EU, wrong-footing the Labour party as the side wanting to stick to a lousy deal.

I can't see it happening myself, at least not before the GE, but I could see it happening afterwards if Labour sticks with its Brexit policy ... particularly if the Tories get a drubbing.

What has definitely happened is the Torygraph has become much more critical of Brexit over the past few months. It's always been rabidly anti-EU and pro-Brexit - that's no longer the case. And the Torygraph is a good indicator of the way that the party is thinking.

It's very, very unlikely that the next Tory manifesto contains a commitment to rejoin the EU but I wouldn't entirely rule it out.

Yes, I’ve seen the articles recently.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Yes, I’ve seen the articles recently.

Where would they go?

I love the arrogance of people who talk about 're-joining' – like the UK would have much say in the matter. If I was the EU, I'd tell the UK to do one – 'we' made our bed, so then have to deal with the consequences.

It would be a pretty hard sell (and the biggest U-turn ever) for the Tories to change tack, given they've spent seven years saying how great it's going to be. Not to mention it would be a colossal waste of money. Also, I wouldn't trust them to do anything about it if they got back into power on the back of it, either. It would just go down as yet another failed policy/target, possibly with a meek "Well, we did ask, but they said it wasn't possible."

 

[CheeseRolls]

One thing that I've started to see suggested by various commentors, is that the Tories suggest rejoining the EU, wrong-footing the Labour party as the side wanting to stick to a lousy deal.

I can't see it happening myself, at least not before the GE, but I could see it happening afterwards if Labour sticks with its Brexit policy ... particularly if the Tories get a drubbing.

What has definitely happened is the Torygraph has become much more critical of Brexit over the past few months. It's always been rabidly anti-EU and pro-Brexit - that's no longer the case. And the Torygraph is a good indicator of the way that the party is thinking.

It's very, very unlikely that the next Tory manifesto contains a commitment to rejoin the EU but I wouldn't entirely rule it out.

I expect Labour to campaign on a bland safe manifesto, with some reference to royal commissions or similar vehicle, which will give them the grounds to reset the position with Europe and reform the House of Lords with a post election change of policy.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Yes, I’ve seen the articles recently.

Early adopter!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Where would they go?

I love the arrogance of people who talk about 're-joining' – like the UK would have much say in the matter. If I was the EU, I'd tell the UK to do one – 'we' made our bed, so then have to deal with the consequences.

It would be a pretty hard sell (and the biggest U-turn ever) for the Tories to change tack, given they've spent seven years saying how great it's going to be. Not to mention it would be a colossal waste of money. Also, I wouldn't trust them to do anything about it if they got back into power on the back of it, either. It would just go down as yet another failed policy/target, possibly with a meek "Well, we did ask, but they said it wasn't possible."

Very much this. I think most of the EU, both politicians and the people, have had enough of the UK for the time being. I also think the UK now serves as a good example of how chaotic and expensive life can be like outside of the EU.

 

[sparkie]

I'd join the European Economic Area yesterday but maybe that's just me.

 

[Gwylan]

Where would they go?

I love the arrogance of people who talk about 're-joining' – like the UK would have much say in the matter. If I was the EU, I'd tell the UK to do one – 'we' made our bed, so then have to deal with the consequences.

It would be a pretty hard sell (and the biggest U-turn ever) for the Tories to change tack, given they've spent seven years saying how great it's going to be. Not to mention it would be a colossal waste of money. Also, I wouldn't trust them to do anything about it if they got back into power on the back of it, either. It would just go down as yet another failed policy/target, possibly with a meek "Well, we did ask, but they said it wasn't possible."

Oh, I don't think that there'd be any problem there: the EU would have us back in a blink of an eye, we're too large a market to ignore. I doubt that we'd get the same favourable terms as last time though: we may well have to adopt the Euro and sign up to Schengen.

But it's far too big a step at the moment, but I really wouldn't rule it out in future. The Toris may well be desperate if they get a drubbing in the GE and have to adopt a more radical approach.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Oh, I don't think that there'd be any problem there: the EU would have us back in a blink of an eye, we're too large a market to ignore. I doubt that we'd get the same favourable terms as last time though: we may well have to adopt the Euro and sign up to Schengen.

But it's far too big a step at the moment, but I really wouldn't rule it out in future. The Toris may well be desperate if they get a drubbing in the GE and have to adopt a more radical approach.

It's only a pledge to join the euro. Denmark did over 15 years ago but still hasn't.
We wouldn't get as many rebates as we used to.

 

[The Clamp]

Look at the bumblefuck surrounding leaving. Imagine the bowl of spaghetti and shitballs the Tory’s would make of rejoining

 

[chickens]

The Conservative Party in its current form is essentially UKIP. There would have to be a (much needed and welcome) clear out of the party before it could embrace any return to the EU, regardless of the economic benefits.

It’s telling that one of the main benefits of Brexit was supposed to be taking back control of our borders, which we actually keep delaying because we can’t afford to.

Embarrassing.

 

[The Clamp]

The Conservative Party in its current form is essentially UKIP. There would have to be a (much needed and welcome) clear out of the party before it could embrace any return to the EU, regardless of the economic benefits.

It’s telling that one of the main benefits of Brexit was supposed to be taking back control of our borders, which we actually keep delaying because we can’t afford to.

Embarrassing.

Can’t afford to / have no desire to.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Oh, I don't think that there'd be any problem there: the EU would have us back in a blink of an eye, we're too large a market to ignore. I doubt that we'd get the same favourable terms as last time though: we may well have to adopt the Euro and sign up to Schengen.

But it's far too big a step at the moment, but I really wouldn't rule it out in future. The Toris may well be desperate if they get a drubbing in the GE and have to adopt a more radical approach.

I don't think they would. And it's that kind of 'we're too big' attitude that undid the negotiators when trying to sort out a deal! I reckon the EU is pretty happy with the situation at the moment. And there is NO WAY any form of re-joining would be on favourable terms – the EU, quite rightly wouldn't do us ANY favours. Once that got out, there would probably be a spike in anti-EU rhetoric and any ideas about re-joining would be thrown out again because of 'public opinion'.

Didn't Rees-Mogg suggest it would take 50 years before we saw the real benefits? They'll probably wait until then before making an informed decision to beg to come back or not!