Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #61
In eight months or as near as dam it 240 days child 'P' was seen 60 times by what is called 'professional' workers. Strange use of the word professional. 
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Baby abuse death,reveiw ordered.
- Thread starter Leekbrookgull
- Start date
London Calling
New member
In eight months or as near as dam it 240 days child 'P' was seen 60 times by what is called 'professional' workers. Strange use of the word professional.
ONE IN THREE DAYS
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #63
London,just how did it happen ? 
London Calling
New member
London,just how did it happen ?
Whilst these are a minority,
you do wonder about the staff, the Climbie case child was managed by a new junior member of staff, with an over loaded case load and a manager, who had her own daughter taken into care!!!!!!
It must be that when a certain threshold is reached, a senior enough memeber of staff takes over with the welly, to hit s***.
I would say, there should be (a) local Coppers, seconded to each authority, who is able to go out on site visits, and use their powers to make arrests, instaed of having to be pulled into to a case meeting.
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #65
London,alot of this is covered in the press and radio,your point of the Police being 'on call' or one of them by the door is a solid point. However when it comes to issues like this how MANY of those involved in the 'care' workforce are parents themselves ? Therefore able to add their advice. Maybe we are talking about 'low life people' how simply just don't get it ? It is beyond them ?
Finally 60 'PROFESSIONALS' saw baby 'P' in EIGHT months, = once every FOUR days. i rest my case.
Finally 60 'PROFESSIONALS' saw baby 'P' in EIGHT months, = once every FOUR days. i rest my case.
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
I actually felt quite sick reading this about these disgracegul monsters who see it fit to beat a defenceless child and kill it. I seem to also remember a case very similar around a month ago when the boyfriend "snapped" the childs back over his knee.
There really now is no alternative then a full enquiry and people in authority must be disciplined for this woeful negligence and perhaps training procedures changed as well as clearly they did not see what was going on despite numerous visits.
I was brought up as a christian and still have my faith which taught me to forgive however in these instances I cannot and I sincerely hope the people who have committed these heinous crimes meet the match in prison in no uncertain terms.
An eye for an eye is acceptable
There really now is no alternative then a full enquiry and people in authority must be disciplined for this woeful negligence and perhaps training procedures changed as well as clearly they did not see what was going on despite numerous visits.
I was brought up as a christian and still have my faith which taught me to forgive however in these instances I cannot and I sincerely hope the people who have committed these heinous crimes meet the match in prison in no uncertain terms.
An eye for an eye is acceptable
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #67
Beach,where have you been? Religion share it,this is SICK. 
franks brother
Well-known member
These three pieces of filth should be hung, drawn and quartered.
There is no deterrent to stop scum from indulging in this sort of behaviour.
The punishment should be so severe as to scare off some other perverts from doing the same.
I cannot find the words to express how strongly I feel about this innocent child's maltreatment.
I would personally throw the switch/ pull the lever/press the button/start the syringe which ended the lives of these scum
There is no deterrent to stop scum from indulging in this sort of behaviour.
The punishment should be so severe as to scare off some other perverts from doing the same.
I cannot find the words to express how strongly I feel about this innocent child's maltreatment.
I would personally throw the switch/ pull the lever/press the button/start the syringe which ended the lives of these scum
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #69
Baby 'P' of Yahoo news.
NMH
Banned
Seeing the baby's picture brought it a lot closer to the reality of what it is.
Only monstrous people could do such a thing,it's made me absolutely shake with anger it's so abhorrent.
I very much hope they get their proper penalty in the slammer, big f***ing style.
Only monstrous people could do such a thing,it's made me absolutely shake with anger it's so abhorrent.
I very much hope they get their proper penalty in the slammer, big f***ing style.
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #71
and thats all they are a baby,they depend on you.
Storer68
New member
you're all probably too young to remember this..........
but just to show that this is nothing new and can affect just about any community, this from the Argus
This week's harrowing report into the death of Victoria Climbie has chilling echoes of a case which rocked Brighton, and Britain, exactly 30 years ago.
The central recommendations of the report are virtually identical, prompting people to question whether the basic lessons will ever be learned.
A little girl died after being starved and beaten by those who were supposed to love her.
Despite being under local authority supervision, the social services, council, police and NSPCC failed to spot the horrors within her home in time to prevent the tragedy.
A subsequent inquiry into the horrendous cruelty found none of those tasked with protecting her were talking to each other.
But despite individual mistakes, it was decided that ultimately it was the system which failed.
It all sounds chillingly familiar, but this investigation had nothing to do with eight-year-old Victoria Climbie.
It took place exactly 30 years ago.
Seven-year-old Maria Colwell was starved and battered to death by her step father, William Kepple, at their home in Whitehawk, Brighton, in January 1973.
The two cases are uncannily similar. Both went beyond their communities and shocked the nation.
In both, after initial reluctance, the authorities bowed to public pressure and held a public inquiry.
But most worrying is the similarity between the two inquiries' findings.
The 1974 report said the authorities "entirely failed" to supervise Maria for six crucial months between June and December 1972, in spite of a supervision order.
The inquiry found there had been a prolonged series of involvements in Maria's welfare but none of those supposed to be looking after her shared the information which could have pieced together a picture of the full horrors going on behind the closed doors of her home.
Teachers at Whitehawk Junior School, the school welfare officer, social workers and the NSPCC knew some of the facts of the case but no one completed the jigsaw.
This week, Lord Laming's report into Victoria Climbie's death similarly condemned everyone involved in her care.
Four social service departments, two housing departments, two police child protection teams, a consultant paediatrician, the NSPCC and a church pastor were among those involved.
But there was a "catalogue of administrative, managerial and professional failure by the services charged with her safety".
The report concluded: "Not one of the agencies empowered by Parliament to protect children in positions similar to Victoria's, funded by the public purse, emerge from the inquiry with much credit."
Victoria's death was called "a gross failure of the system and inexcusable."
In the years since Maria's death, the rules have been tightened and many experts say they are among the best in the world.
Barry Luckock, a lecturer in social work and policy at the University of Sussex, warned against claims the system remained fundamentally flawed. It was not, he says.
He said: "The child protection laws, systems and procedures are essentially sound."
The problem, said Mr Luckock, was social workers needed more time to do their job properly and less time filling in forms.
He said: "Social work has become a demoralised profession. What they want is to do more work with children and families."
Lib-Dem councillor Jenny Barnard-Langston, a former foster parent, has called for more money to be pumped into Brighton and Hove's social services.
She said no matter how many procedures were in place the most important thing was to make sure they were effective.
She said: "There have been recent child deaths at the hands of carers in Brighton and Hove.
"However we were assured 30 years ago, following the death of Maria Colwell, this must not happen again.
"Yet, since Maria's death, 32 more children have died nationally as a result of abuse by carers. This is a damning legacy for those responsible.
"It it neither realistic or fair to expect our social workers to be meticulous in the care of vulnerable children when they are expected to manage huge case loads."
In September 1991, three- year-old Sophie Merry, from Chichester, was beaten to death by her mother's boyfriend Kevin Strudwick. Doctors found 170 injuries on her body, which was so disfigured the judge refused to show the photos to the jury.
In May 1993, Abena Bowley, from Littlehampton, was sentenced to eight years for the manslaughter of two-year-old Kirsty Bowley, her step-daughter.
In July 1994, Colin Waters was jailed for killing 17-month-old Aaron Dellow, his ex-girlfriend's son.
Aaron, who lived in Montpelier Terrace, Brighton, had 40 bruises on his face and body. His skull was fractured in two places.
On Christmas Eve 1999, in a case that would lead to a campaign by The Argus to cage child killers for murder under the joint enterprise rule, four-year-old John Smith, from Southwick, died.
He had 54 bruises and three adult bite marks on his body among a host of other injuries.
A legal loophole meant his foster parents, Simon and Michelle McWilliam, escap-ed a murder conviction and were jailed for cruelty instead, each receiving an eight-year sentence.
Mr Luckock said a central theme in all child death inquiries since Maria Colwell was still a lack of communication.
Agencies such as police, hospitals and social services still did not talk to each other or share their information well enough.
Even more importantly, they did not communicate with children effectively.
He said: "John Smith is an example. His parents were lying about his injuries. Social workers have got to find ways of making sense of children's experiences.
"Children get lost from sight. Services are very over-stretched because of increased demands and this can lead to social workers spending even more time in the office instead of with the children they are responsible for.
Following the John Smith case, Brighton and Hove City Council set up a child protection team, which holds regular meetings, bringing together schools, health experts, social services and the police.
A spokesman said: "We believe strongly this has improved communications between our child protection teams and schools, where staff may have crucial knowledge about problems individual children are facing."
No one is suggesting these abhorrent cases are not being taken seriously enough.
But there are still clear lessons which have not been learned.
Archive Home
but just to show that this is nothing new and can affect just about any community, this from the Argus
This week's harrowing report into the death of Victoria Climbie has chilling echoes of a case which rocked Brighton, and Britain, exactly 30 years ago.
The central recommendations of the report are virtually identical, prompting people to question whether the basic lessons will ever be learned.
A little girl died after being starved and beaten by those who were supposed to love her.
Despite being under local authority supervision, the social services, council, police and NSPCC failed to spot the horrors within her home in time to prevent the tragedy.
A subsequent inquiry into the horrendous cruelty found none of those tasked with protecting her were talking to each other.
But despite individual mistakes, it was decided that ultimately it was the system which failed.
It all sounds chillingly familiar, but this investigation had nothing to do with eight-year-old Victoria Climbie.
It took place exactly 30 years ago.
Seven-year-old Maria Colwell was starved and battered to death by her step father, William Kepple, at their home in Whitehawk, Brighton, in January 1973.
The two cases are uncannily similar. Both went beyond their communities and shocked the nation.
In both, after initial reluctance, the authorities bowed to public pressure and held a public inquiry.
But most worrying is the similarity between the two inquiries' findings.
The 1974 report said the authorities "entirely failed" to supervise Maria for six crucial months between June and December 1972, in spite of a supervision order.
The inquiry found there had been a prolonged series of involvements in Maria's welfare but none of those supposed to be looking after her shared the information which could have pieced together a picture of the full horrors going on behind the closed doors of her home.
Teachers at Whitehawk Junior School, the school welfare officer, social workers and the NSPCC knew some of the facts of the case but no one completed the jigsaw.
This week, Lord Laming's report into Victoria Climbie's death similarly condemned everyone involved in her care.
Four social service departments, two housing departments, two police child protection teams, a consultant paediatrician, the NSPCC and a church pastor were among those involved.
But there was a "catalogue of administrative, managerial and professional failure by the services charged with her safety".
The report concluded: "Not one of the agencies empowered by Parliament to protect children in positions similar to Victoria's, funded by the public purse, emerge from the inquiry with much credit."
Victoria's death was called "a gross failure of the system and inexcusable."
In the years since Maria's death, the rules have been tightened and many experts say they are among the best in the world.
Barry Luckock, a lecturer in social work and policy at the University of Sussex, warned against claims the system remained fundamentally flawed. It was not, he says.
He said: "The child protection laws, systems and procedures are essentially sound."
The problem, said Mr Luckock, was social workers needed more time to do their job properly and less time filling in forms.
He said: "Social work has become a demoralised profession. What they want is to do more work with children and families."
Lib-Dem councillor Jenny Barnard-Langston, a former foster parent, has called for more money to be pumped into Brighton and Hove's social services.
She said no matter how many procedures were in place the most important thing was to make sure they were effective.
She said: "There have been recent child deaths at the hands of carers in Brighton and Hove.
"However we were assured 30 years ago, following the death of Maria Colwell, this must not happen again.
"Yet, since Maria's death, 32 more children have died nationally as a result of abuse by carers. This is a damning legacy for those responsible.
"It it neither realistic or fair to expect our social workers to be meticulous in the care of vulnerable children when they are expected to manage huge case loads."
In September 1991, three- year-old Sophie Merry, from Chichester, was beaten to death by her mother's boyfriend Kevin Strudwick. Doctors found 170 injuries on her body, which was so disfigured the judge refused to show the photos to the jury.
In May 1993, Abena Bowley, from Littlehampton, was sentenced to eight years for the manslaughter of two-year-old Kirsty Bowley, her step-daughter.
In July 1994, Colin Waters was jailed for killing 17-month-old Aaron Dellow, his ex-girlfriend's son.
Aaron, who lived in Montpelier Terrace, Brighton, had 40 bruises on his face and body. His skull was fractured in two places.
On Christmas Eve 1999, in a case that would lead to a campaign by The Argus to cage child killers for murder under the joint enterprise rule, four-year-old John Smith, from Southwick, died.
He had 54 bruises and three adult bite marks on his body among a host of other injuries.
A legal loophole meant his foster parents, Simon and Michelle McWilliam, escap-ed a murder conviction and were jailed for cruelty instead, each receiving an eight-year sentence.
Mr Luckock said a central theme in all child death inquiries since Maria Colwell was still a lack of communication.
Agencies such as police, hospitals and social services still did not talk to each other or share their information well enough.
Even more importantly, they did not communicate with children effectively.
He said: "John Smith is an example. His parents were lying about his injuries. Social workers have got to find ways of making sense of children's experiences.
"Children get lost from sight. Services are very over-stretched because of increased demands and this can lead to social workers spending even more time in the office instead of with the children they are responsible for.
Following the John Smith case, Brighton and Hove City Council set up a child protection team, which holds regular meetings, bringing together schools, health experts, social services and the police.
A spokesman said: "We believe strongly this has improved communications between our child protection teams and schools, where staff may have crucial knowledge about problems individual children are facing."
No one is suggesting these abhorrent cases are not being taken seriously enough.
But there are still clear lessons which have not been learned.
Archive Home
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #73
Money is not the issue. Any parent has that gut felling something is wrong.
I understand the arguments that say it's the 'system' and don't blame those at the coal face who are under paid, but I still feel you can to a degree. Where is the conviction and individual leadership that anyone at any level can posses where you just do the right thing? It's human life, why heed beurocracy when it comes to human life? Maybe half the problem is the whistle blower who tried to do that was sacked and gagged.
It stinks and I'm warming to the idea that until we have an answer we revert to public hanging of the guility until we find of way of identifying and stopping these hideous beasts.
It stinks and I'm warming to the idea that until we have an answer we revert to public hanging of the guility until we find of way of identifying and stopping these hideous beasts.
Freddie Goodwin.
Well-known member
Corporate World has a lot to answer for. We have a 'management culture' of numbskulls who are good at spreadsheets, surveys, press releaces and negotiating big salaries.
I would have expected the junior social service staff to report matters up and the structure should be in place. even if they hadn't then I would have expected senior management to know what was going on in their department.
Either way, senior heads should roll....and I don't just mean into a nice, well paid job in the office next door.
I would have expected the junior social service staff to report matters up and the structure should be in place. even if they hadn't then I would have expected senior management to know what was going on in their department.
Either way, senior heads should roll....and I don't just mean into a nice, well paid job in the office next door.
captainmorganrum
Wrexham
That'd be nice NMH, but they'll be placed in a segregated wing for their own protection. They'll be placed with similar people of similar immoral fortitude who've done equally as sick and disturbing things.
If they get a nice modern prison then it'll be far far far removed from the experience they deserve to get but never will.
Whole hearedly summing up the problem.
The people who know this is happening are not the people who can stop it.
That is the way it is, or else we would be having the same discussion, reversed, because a loved child has been taken into care by a concerned Social Worker, just because they are brused from a tumble.
Sadly this will always happen, all society can do, is make sure it happens less.
Sacking an undervalued Social Worker (I'm sure there are some shite ones out there) ain't gonna make it better.
Leekbrookgull
Well-known member
- Thread starter
- #78
Just read the apology on the Haringey council website,and i find it 'matter of fact' rather than sincere. Take a look just google Haringey council. Also Monday November 17th Panorama Baby 'P',s life. Also the BBC have done a timeline of this case and the injuries are listed i would suggest you take a look maybe someone can link it 'Short life of misery and pain' it really just beggars belief. Like many i am not convinced by bring back the rope arguement but in cases like this it is very hard to hold that veiw.
Like many i am not convinced by bring back the rope arguement but in cases like this it is very hard to hold that veiw.
The question is:-
would these people be able to live in society, again?.
If the answer is no, you have to wonder, what do you do?.
Apparently a big supporter of capital punishment, was Ian Brady.
