32Gb Nexus 7 - £200

[Goldstone Rapper]

I am not going to support Google's predatory pricing, trying to create a monopoly by heavily subsidising their products (to make little or no profit) to try to drive competition out of the market. Amazon are also trying to play the same anti-competitive game.

iPad mini all the way!

 

[beorhthelm]

I am not going to support Google's predatory pricing, trying to create a monopoly by heavily subsidising their products (to make little or no profit) to try to drive competition out of the market. Amazon are also trying to play the same anti-competitive game.

iPad mini all the way!

yeah, how dare they supply a competitive product with only a £70 odd profit. stand up against this, give your money to Apple, they wont do anything monopolistic. ever. really.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

yeah, how dare they supply a competitive product with only a £70 odd profit. stand up against this, give your money to Apple, they wont do anything monopolistic. ever. really.

That £70 profit between component cost and price does not take into consideration R & D, packaging and marketing costs.

 

[Seagull on the wing]

Not happy with Apple and my iPod....they sent me an Email to verify my account I filled in the form and it kept saying my birthday was incorrect....Jeez I know when my birthday is... I phoned them up ...on premiun line and they kept putting me on hold then passing me to another operator who again put me on hold and still after 23 minutes could'nt verify my account. They then sent me a survey on how well there customer care was.....how can you put politely.... S**T

 

[scooter1]

I've been reluctant to buy anything Apple for years for fear of being sucked into the I thing. However I checked out the nexus 32 gb and thought it was ok. I then straight away tried an iPad mini and was blown away by the difference and ease of use - I just don't like the android software. I've never been one to gush about gadgets, but the iPad mini that I bought is great

 

[sten_super]

yeah, how dare they supply a competitive product with only a £70 odd profit. stand up against this, give your money to Apple, they wont do anything monopolistic. ever. really.

Is that really the margin? Wow, I would never have thought it was that much on a £159 tablet. Really does put the profit on these things (and particularly the 'premium' iPads) into perspective.

That £70 profit between component cost and price does not take into consideration R & D, packaging and marketing costs.

But the point of pricing it competitively is that they will sell in droves. £70 (or even £50, to allow for packaging and marketing) x 1 million units is a hell of a lot of R&D!

Incidentally, I went into Comet yesterday and their pricing of these was comedy.

Nexus 7 16Gb £189 (google price £159) - 10% reduction = £170 Shit loads left
Nexus 7 32Gb £199 (google price £199) - 10% reduction = £180 Sold out

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I am not going to support Google's predatory pricing, trying to create a monopoly by heavily subsidising their products (to make little or no profit) to try to drive competition out of the market. Amazon are also trying to play the same anti-competitive game.

iPad mini all the way!

Unbelievable. Presumably you would prefer a closed, controlled economy. Google's stance is actually helping the consumer. Perhaps they are subsidising the nexus but it's obviously an attack on Apple's vastly inflated price structure. You wouldn't happen to own Apple products now would you?

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

Unbelievable. Presumably you would prefer a closed, controlled economy. Google's stance is actually helping the consumer. Perhaps they are subsidising the nexus but it's obviously an attack on Apple's vastly inflated price structure. You wouldn't happen to own Apple products now would you?

You are missing the point. Apple has enough in reserve to ride out Google's predatory pricing. They are also selling a premium product where consideration of pricing is less significant. It's Google Android partners that will suffer the most - such as Dell, LG, HTC etc - as they will make a loss if they compete on hardware pricing and can't make anything back via an apps store - and the commoditising of tablet computers will lead to a lack of competition and then lack of innovation.

And no, supporting a free market (where prices are determined by supply and demand) doesn't mean going soft on practices such as using vast cash reserves obtained in another market to artificially drive out competition.

 

[CheeseRolls]

Goldstone Rapper

Wow I too am suffering from predatory pricing ! Let me know if there is any other stuff you need and I will be sure to give you a fair deal.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

Goldstone Rapper

Wow I too am suffering from predatory pricing ! Let me know if there is any other stuff you need and I will be sure to give you a fair deal.

Could I have some cheese rolls?

 

[beorhthelm]

You are missing the point.

and you're drinking too much Apple fanboi juice. elsewhere in consumer electronics margins are in teens down to single digits. Apple has managed to sell people stuff (acepted high quality) for 200% margin or more. a company comes along and says, hey we can do a similar product for 100% margin, and you think that predatory pricing? and whats that about monopolies, how about the tight control of Apple's app store or itunes, what are they?

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Coming for a Linux user perspective, there is one thing Apple and Mozilla has done that is good in my book. It has made people realise that there are alternatives to Microsoft Windows and Internet Explorer and that Microsoft does not own every single computer on this planet.

People moving away from Windows to Apple has also created more interest in Linux distributions, so much so that Linux users can now look forward to a native version of Steam and native games which will be excellent. This sort of thing would have been pipe dream 5 years ago but it seems the market is there.

 

[sten_super]

You are missing the point. Apple has enough in reserve to ride out Google's predatory pricing. They are also selling a premium product where consideration of pricing is less significant. It's Google Android partners that will suffer the most - such as Dell, LG, HTC etc - as they will make a loss if they compete on hardware pricing and can't make anything back via an apps store - and the commoditising of tablet computers will lead to a lack of competition and then lack of innovation.

And no, supporting a free market (where prices are determined by supply and demand) doesn't mean going soft on practices such as using vast cash reserves obtained in another market to artificially drive out competition.

I don't normally get involved in these google/apple spats, but this argument is so riddled with holes I don't know where to begin.

Google's Nexus 7 pricing is far from predatory; it is, as you almost admit, because they have a different revenue model to Apple and/or the Android tablet manufacturers.

Apple - make profit on both hardware and software
Google/Amazon - make little/no profit on hardware, make profit on software
Samsung, Asus et al - make profit on hardware

There is clearly a discussion that's being had between Google and tablet manufacturers as to where their common interests lie; but Asus wouldn't make the Nexus 7 for Google if they didn't think there was something in it for them. Same goes for the LG Nexus 4 and the Samsung Nexus 10.

If you are so convinced that a lack of competition leads to little innovation, can you explain Apple's continued development of the iPad at a time when there were no viable tablet alternatives? Or Google's invest in frankly crazy projects like Google Glasses?

Your viewpoint seems very business focussed. How is it okay for Apple to maintain massive profit margins at the cost of the consumer (I would assume your answer is something along the lines of 'because the market will bear it') but not for Google to push prices down at the cost of the producer (I assume your answer here isn't something along the lines of 'because the market will bear it')?

About the only part that I do agree with is that it is the manufacturers that stand to lose out in this race. However what we'll probably end up with is domination of the market by a small number of large firms (e.g. Apple, Samsung, Asus and Motorola/Google) with many of those making small margins on large volumes (and probably one making large margins on large volumes). I'm not particularly convinced that's a bad thing, particularly from the consumer's standpoint.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

I don't normally get involved in these google/apple spats, but this argument is so riddled with holes I don't know where to begin.

Google's Nexus 7 pricing is far from predatory; it is, as you almost admit, because they have a different revenue model to Apple and/or the Android tablet manufacturers.

Apple - make profit on both hardware and software
Google/Amazon - make little/no profit on hardware, make profit on software
Samsung, Asus et al - make profit on hardware

There is clearly a discussion that's being had between Google and tablet manufacturers as to where their common interests lie; but Asus wouldn't make the Nexus 7 for Google if they didn't think there was something in it for them. Same goes for the LG Nexus 4 and the Samsung Nexus 10.

If you are so convinced that a lack of competition leads to little innovation, can you explain Apple's continued development of the iPad at a time when there were no viable tablet alternatives? Or Google's invest in frankly crazy projects like Google Glasses?

Your viewpoint seems very business focussed. How is it okay for Apple to maintain massive profit margins at the cost of the consumer (I would assume your answer is something along the lines of 'because the market will bear it') but not for Google to push prices down at the cost of the producer (I assume your answer here isn't something along the lines of 'because the market will bear it')?

About the only part that I do agree with is that it is the manufacturers that stand to lose out in this race. However what we'll probably end up with is domination of the market by a small number of large firms (e.g. Apple, Samsung, Asus and Motorola/Google) with many of those making small margins on large volumes (and probably one making large margins on large volumes). I'm not particularly convinced that's a bad thing, particularly from the consumer's standpoint.

Yes, there is clearly unhappy discussion to be had between the hardware manufacturers that counted on Google as a partner who are now forced to see it as a competitor too (and one who can undercut them on hardware prices without sharing the revenue gained from app purchases). It really is a muddle, similar to when Palm licensed its OS and still made hardware with that OS, or when Apple allowed clones to run Mac OS, or when Microsoft launched the Zune after creating a Plays For Sure alliance in digital music. It's truly the thin end of the wedge for those Google partners such as LG who have little choice but to develop Google-branded hardware or allow a rival hardware partner to get the contract.

As far as innovation goes, Apple had first mover status in the creation of the multi-touch tablet computer market. It takes innovation to be a first mover, just like Google have been with Google Glasses. Where innovation is likely to decrease is when what was a high-tech product becomes a cheap-as-chips commodity, such as the pocket calculator. In a maturing market, technological products often do become commodities through lower prices due to an increase in efficiencies in the production process. I also get that that there is a natural shake-out when many pretenders in a fledgling market make an exit, similar to many of the iPod killers of ten years ago (such as Rio, Iomega HipZip, Olympus m:robe) biting the dust. What Google are doing is something different, using its cash reserves to artificially reduce prices to such an extend that it will drive out its 'partners.' it's great for price-conscious consumers in the short term, but it will lead to a reduction in choice in the long-term. By reducing what profit can be made from the tablet computer industry, it also reduces the incentive to enter the market and bring new ideas to it.

What Google are doing is akin to the predatory pricing that supermarkets do with their price-flexing that drives local shops out of business and make it hard for farmers to earn a decent living.

 

[beorhthelm]

is that the same Rio that was making MP3 players for 3 years before Apple came along with its iPod, who later used its closed itunes service to kill off the MP3 player market.

Apple didnt invent either the tablet or the multi-touch interface, nor put them together. the only innovation they done was putting an Apple logo on one and adding a slick marketing campaign. and innovation continues with commodity products, as that becomes the differentiator when everything is similar price.

Google is indeed doing something different - spreading the love. they arent tieing in to one manufacturer but instead sharing the Nexus brand and marketing of the effective reference device for the andriod platform.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

is that the same Rio that was making MP3 players for 3 years before Apple came along with its iPod, who later used its closed itunes service to kill off the MP3 player market.

Apple didnt invent either the tablet or the multi-touch interface, nor put them together. the only innovation they done was putting an Apple logo on one and adding a slick marketing campaign. and innovation continues with commodity products, as that becomes the differentiator when everything is similar price.

Google is indeed doing something different - spreading the love. they arent tieing in to one manufacturer but instead sharing the Nexus brand and marketing of the effective reference device for the andriod platform.

You're right that Apple didn't invent the MP3 player, tablet or multi-touch. I certainly remember the Windows tablets around 2001 and at the time enviously wished Apple had a product! What matters is that Apple were first in the mind of many consumers willing to part with their cash for products (or products with those features).

In theory, it would be lovely if companies innovated in terms of their products. The reality tends to be that cost-cutting is the key driver in the manufacturing of consumer products, rather than innovative features. The Dell argument was always that they were as innovative as Apple, just that they were innovative in their cost-cutting manufacturing process rather than the form of their product. Nevertheless, in terms of features, when was the last great innovation in pocket calculators or cigarette lighter?

As for your 'spreading the love' viewpoint, I can see where you are going with that. It will be interesting to see how that pans out. In the tablet market, I won't be surprised to see HTC, Dell, LG exit it in a shake out pretty soon, with Amazon, Apple and Google (the three with content and app stores) and possibly Microsoft as the three survivors. We'll see.

 

[beorhthelm]

... In the tablet market, I won't be surprised to see HTC, Dell, LG exit it in a shake out pretty soon, with Amazon, Apple and Google (the three with content and app stores) and possibly Microsoft as the three survivors. We'll see.

i doubt it will be any time soon while theres still such large margins to be had. i think i read HP are looking to get back in (their mistake was trying to have another OS platform). the underlying hardware is so cheap, its already commodity prices. you can get generic tablets from China for £40, albeit lower spec and poorer quality. Nexus 7 cost $151 to make. this is where i came in, so i'll leave, except to note how great those margins are: add 8GB to a spec for $8 and increase the retail price by $50; Apple increase their cost by $90 adding 48GB and 3G over the base model, then charge $330 more retail (ipad 3 numbers). manufactuers aint leaving soon.

 

[Colossal Squid]

Some seriously stupid arguments on this thread. There seems to be a real reluctance from Apple fanboys to embrace anything that beats Apple devices on specs as well as price.

Nobody is killing this market, only making a killing in it. There's a huge amount of money to be made in the high volume of sales for 10" and 7" tablets, so let's leave the manufacturers to do so by picking the best products that suit our own needs and budget. Then, surely, everybody's happy, no?

For the record I got a 32gb Nexus 7 because a) the price point is very reasonable and b) I already own an Android powered phone and many apps for the system. It's a lovely bit of kit and I'd recommend it to anyone

 

[Marshy]

£250 Ipad2 64GB 3G wifi, I call that great value

 

[Colossal Squid]

£250 Ipad2 64GB 3G wifi, I call that great value

That would be great value.

Where on earth have you found such a deal then?