[Music] Your greatest Rock and Roll vocal ever.

[Nitram]

Indeed. Hendrix and Cream were heavy blues rock.

I saw Handsome Dick Manatoba down the Top Rank. MC5 were not a punk band. The first punk rock as we know it was The Ramones.

The NYD and Heartbreakers were glam rock. Early garage bands were sometimes called 'punks' (way back to the 60s, Rokie Erikson, Love...) but the music is very different from Ramones.

Personally, despite Anarchy in the UK, the Pistols weren't really a typical punk band (musically). Until Stuart the DJ cermonially smashed his copy (and it was worth a fair bit) one night, the Hungry Years regularly played Anarchy in the UK in late 76 and early 77. Steve Jones was a fantastic guitarist and invented the one octave lower bass sound (he played bass on the album). After the Ramones, the Brits melded MacLaren's 'fashion' with their own stuff.

Johnny Moped was proper punk. He sounds nothing like the Pistols or Ramones:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdKoBplMLaI

So, for me, the first punk rock record, as I felt it at the time, and still feel it now, every time I hear it, was English (or course - **** the Americans) and it was this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUxFQ5QBiYk

What a song. What a performance.

First Heavy metal? These lovelies. They predate Black Sabbath's first album by a year. Heavy metal began as a non blues, messy, dirgy, riffy, English racket. Listen to this and weep

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHIQkfp0s68

This album was going for £500 20 years ago. Only £200 now owing to things like youtube. Obviously I have a copy

I personally hate all this categorisation, always reminds me of growing up when people only liked certain bands due to fashion and lifestyle. Very limiting. In the past few years there seems to be an industry telling people what is what. I’m sure all the bands could not care less. BTW not aimed at you as you are a person with a wide variation in music and have an open mind.
However my conformist side takes issue with your Punk argument. My offering for discussion is

Although they came from the American garage band scene and others probably have claim.

 

[Tokyohands]

Best vocal of the noisy guitar music genre for me is the line 'Born To Be Wild'

 

[zefarelly]

Lots of references to Marriott’s influences on Led Zep by Page and Plant.
https://swamp-ass.forumotion.net/t898-marriott-greatest-rock-n-roll-singer-ever

It would be very interesting to see how well revered Marriott would be now if he was still around. You'd hope extremely highly given the fawning over those who are still around and effectively copied him.

 

[albionalbino]

Indeed. Hendrix and Cream were heavy blues rock.

I saw Handsome Dick Manatoba down the Top Rank. MC5 were not a punk band. The first punk rock as we know it was The Ramones.

The NYD and Heartbreakers were glam rock. Early garage bands were sometimes called 'punks' (way back to the 60s, Rokie Erikson, Love...) but the music is very different from Ramones.

Personally, despite Anarchy in the UK, the Pistols weren't really a typical punk band (musically). Until Stuart the DJ cermonially smashed his copy (and it was worth a fair bit) one night, the Hungry Years regularly played Anarchy in the UK in late 76 and early 77. Steve Jones was a fantastic guitarist and invented the one octave lower bass sound (he played bass on the album). After the Ramones, the Brits melded MacLaren's 'fashion' with their own stuff.

Johnny Moped was proper punk. He sounds nothing like the Pistols or Ramones:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdKoBplMLaI

So, for me, the first punk rock record, as I felt it at the time, and still feel it now, every time I hear it, was English (or course - **** the Americans) and it was this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUxFQ5QBiYk

What a song. What a performance.

First Heavy metal? These lovelies. They predate Black Sabbath's first album by a year. Heavy metal began as a non blues, messy, dirgy, riffy, English racket. Listen to this and weep

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHIQkfp0s68

This album was going for £500 20 years ago. Only £200 now owing to things like youtube. Obviously I have a copy

David Peel stating a case for being punk in 1970. And giving the Clash an idea.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cF9Ge33EkKc

 

[dandanthebrightonfan]

https://youtu.be/3doBiU6nN0k

Bob "The Bear" Hite , that boy could belt out a tune

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I personally hate all this categorisation, always reminds me of growing up when people only liked certain bands due to fashion and lifestyle. Very limiting. In the past few years there seems to be an industry telling people what is what. I’m sure all the bands could not care less. BTW not aimed at you as you are a person with a wide variation in music and have an open mind.
However my conformist side takes issue with your Punk argument. My offering for discussion is

Although they came from the American garage band scene and others probably have claim.

You say you “hate categorisation”, then use a category to describe where The Stooges came from This is a good example of a point I made earlier.

And when growing up I think it is a good thing that people only ' liked certain bands due to fashion and lifestyle.' Finding a tribe, finding self-identity, self-expression is a good thing and a rite of passage. If no one did this everyone would be dressing like they're middle-aged all their life.

Genres and labels are good.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I personally hate all this categorisation, always reminds me of growing up when people only liked certain bands due to fashion and lifestyle. Very limiting. In the past few years there seems to be an industry telling people what is what. I’m sure all the bands could not care less. BTW not aimed at you as you are a person with a wide variation in music and have an open mind.
However my conformist side takes issue with your Punk argument. My offering for discussion is

Although they came from the American garage band scene and others probably have claim.

Indeed. I recall an era when you couldn't like this if you liked that, and you were defined by your youth tribe. I have no idea if there is anything like this for 'the kids of today', or whether it is acceptable to be friends with a 'goth' if you are into 'r n b'. And I don't care either, obviously.

My interest is in relation to musical history, not pidgeonholing, and especially not pidgeonholing in relation to current music.

Iggy is an interesting case in point, though. I never got to see him until around 2014 (ATP in Iceland!). I was really surprised that his entire set was from the two Bowie albums plus a few Stooges tracks. Checking his CV, he has done next to nothing of note since the late 70s so that would explain it. I love all that stuff but, to me, as you can guess, Iggy fits into that US garage band plus MC5 etc genre, if I were to pidgeonhole, and not punk. Back when places like the Basement club and small venues in Brighton, and the places I went in London (Marquee, Nashville, Vortex, Music Machine, Rainbow, 100 club, Roxy, Roundhouse) played records for the punk audience, it was mostly reggae, with whatever punk singles were around, motorhead and....perhaps some stooges but it wasn't standout. Me and my pals didn't listen to the Stooges, to be honest, but we did like the two Iggy/Bowie albums. Some weird sin still raises the hair on the back of my neck. I bought Raw Power but barely played it. The American accent wasn't the done thing in yer actual punk. So from a historical music genealongy perspective, English punk started with New Rose. And as you probably know, The Captain and pals are general musos, into all things that would have had a sectarian punk in 1976 screaming for a music policeman if they knew

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kom0OPpy5VQ

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Indeed. I recall an era when you couldn't like this if you liked that, and you were defined by your youth tribe. I have no idea if there is anything like this for 'the kids of today'

I hope there is! I truly hope the kids are not saying "I like a bit of everything" and speak about things I understand when asked what they're into.

 

[Iron Butterfly]

I think The Captain was also a member of the Mopettes backing Johnny Moped

 

[Jesus Gul]

erm...

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

David Peel stating a case for being punk in 1970. And giving the Clash an idea.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cF9Ge33EkKc

That's funny. If the Clash never existed that track would have no resonance and would just sound a bit shit. I think this is one of those musical coincidences (unless of course Strummer admitted he based his vocal and guitar style on that one track). I have never heard of David Peel, so, top research

In a similar vein, as a student I was very excited about the similarity of the start of Nadir's Big Chance to the start of Anarchy in the UK. There is a link - Lydon played two tracks from the album on a Capital radio programme (but not the one pasted below). Lydon admired Hammill. I got very excited about that because I loved Lydon (more than the pistols themselves) and was a massive Hammill fan. Did Peter Hammill invent punk with his Nadir's Big Chance album? No. No he didn't. I see that wiki class Nadir's big chance and David Peel as protopunk. I call that aftertiming. Didn't stop Hammill, in one of his flights of grandiose fantasy, claiming he invented punk, though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKoP19WHcFA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbmWs6Jf5dc

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I hope there is! I truly hope the kids are not saying "I like a bit of everything" and speak about things I understand when asked what they're into.

I can assure you that my son (ok, he's 35 so not a yoof) likes practically nothing I like (apart from some of the recent 'wave' stuff, and early 80s post rock) and I like practically nothing he likes (Weezer, Strokes and more recently singer songwriter types).

But, no, the days when I'd be attacked by teds because I was dressed 'funny' are not anything I hanker for, and I would feel a little sad if kids felt they couldn't listen to X or Y because it didn't map to their trible.

Anyway, there were plenty of kids who liked anything and nothing when I grew up. They were the majority in fact. The 'normal' majority. It took me 40 years to stop sneering at them, and for the last 20 years I have become increasingly accepting of people I wouldn't give time of day to at one time, owing to their cheerful lack of passion. I feel better for being kind.

I do still draw the line at dad-rock nazis who just think I'm queer, and 'musicality' snobs who wouldn't recognise anxt, passion and creative madness from the hole in their backside, though.

 

[Stato]

Indeed. I recall an era when you couldn't like this if you liked that, and you were defined by your youth tribe. I have no idea if there is anything like this for 'the kids of today', or whether it is acceptable to be friends with a 'goth' if you are into 'r n b'. And I don't care either, obviously.

My experience, through my kids, is that musical tribes are mostly a thing of the past. Mine listen to chart pop and dance music, but also to all the pop punk stuff from the nineties that, for some reason, still dominates Kerrang TV. Their friends may lean towards dance or rock, but they all seem to be allowed to cross genres in a way that we weren't. I still remember being into metal in the early eighties and secretly listening to the Jam and feeling like a rebel for wearing a 'Black Market Clash' t-shirt to a Saxon gig. It seems funny now.

My poor kids have grown up with my compilations in the car and, by cherry picking the ones that they liked, can now sing along word for word with odd songs by (off the top of my head) The Bonzos, The Real Thing, Tom Petty, The Fiery Furnaces, Carla Thomas, Pulp, Wayne Carson, AC/DC, Syd Barrett, Gram Parsons & Emmy Lou, The Detroit Spinners, Wham, Etta James, PWEI, Hank Williams. The things is, they have no context, they see it all as 'old' music, not knowing what came from what decade, what genre, what country. Obviously, being a dad, I've bored them with endless back stories to the songs they hear, but they don't really care. One of them loves Grace Petrie and anything from the Glee soundtrack, the other is into Taylor Swift, Stormzy, MCR & Slipknot, but they both listen to each other's music too. All of their friends seem just as flexible. Tik Tok seems to eat music voraciously. I'm often surprised that they know an old song and, when asked how they have heard it, the answer is generally 'It was on a Tik Tok video'.

The goths do still seem to hang around together, but I think that is only because they know that this insures them against the possibility that someone in the group might suggest that they should play sport.

 

[zefarelly]

In the early 80's when I first got into music it was very much linked to micro tribalism in the playground. particularly as little skinheads then mods. there were a few new romantic types, a bit of all sorts I guess . . . . and semi hiding a like of something outside the norm for your gang, at least until I was old enough not to give a shit what anyone else thought . . . I was the odd one out in our gang by 14 anyway.

My lad has been brought up with my music, likes some, ignores some, has found his own stuff, which is great. He doesn't have the same enthusiasm for style and music, but neither do the vast majority.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

My experience, through my kids, is that musical tribes are mostly a thing of the past. Mine listen to chart pop and dance music, but also to all the pop punk stuff from the nineties that, for some reason, still dominates Kerrang TV. Their friends may lean towards dance or rock, but they all seem to be allowed to cross genres in a way that we weren't. I still remember being into metal in the early eighties and secretly listening to the Jam and feeling like a rebel for wearing a 'Black Market Clash' t-shirt to a Saxon gig. It seems funny now.

My poor kids have grown up with my compilations in the car and, by cherry picking the ones that they liked, can now sing along word for word with odd songs by (off the top of my head) The Bonzos, The Real Thing, Tom Petty, The Fiery Furnaces, Carla Thomas, Pulp, Wayne Carson, AC/DC, Syd Barrett, Gram Parsons & Emmy Lou, The Detroit Spinners, Wham, Etta James, PWEI, Hank Williams. The things is, they have no context, they see it all as 'old' music, not knowing what came from what decade, what genre, what country. Obviously, being a dad, I've bored them with endless back stories to the songs they hear, but they don't really care. One of them loves Grace Petrie and anything from the Glee soundtrack, the other is into Taylor Swift, Stormzy, MCR & Slipknot, but they both listen to each other's music too. All of their friends seem just as flexible. Tik Tok seems to eat music voraciously. I'm often surprised that they know an old song and, when asked how they have heard it, the answer is generally 'It was on a Tik Tok video'.

The goths do still seem to hang around together, but I think that is only because they know that this insures them against the possibility that someone in the group might suggest that they should play sport.

Brilliant post

Back in the day this really made me laugh. I can't remember whether I was laughing at the idea of part time punks, or laughing at part time punks (laughing nervously, because I was, ahem, a student)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmbJdcsGl_Q

I did go on the dole for a bit, though. During the long vacation. And I went to a party in a squat! Seen.

 

[Weststander]

Assuming the OP meant the wider context of all contemporary music, not just rock?

Perfection on every level:

 

[Stato]

Assuming the OP meant the wider context of all contemporary music, not just rock?

The thread seems to have headed towards 'classic rawk' very quickly. I'm presuming that most were seeing soul, reggae & R&B as different genres, separate to the question. If not, then you'd have to question some of the suggestions. A thread of the best vocal performances ever in all popular music that had Rod Stewart, John Lennon and Ronnie James Dio, but didn't include Aretha, Sam Cooke, Otis Redding, Irma Thomas, Bessy Smith, Mahalia Jackson, Ben E King, James Brown, Etta James, Solomon Burke, Bobby Bland, Marvin Gaye, Aaron Neville, Jimmy Cliff, Curtis Mayfield, Toots Hibbert, James Carr, Bill Withers, Gladys Knight, Dionne Warwick, etc. would be like a list of the best ever footballers that was missing all South Americans and Europeans.

Lets face it, Erma Franklin wasn't even the best singer in her family, but her vocals on her recording of 'Piece of My Heart' were head and shoulders above the hallowed Joplin version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5fqWugnIhk

 

[Stato]

Back in the day this really made me laugh. I can't remember whether I was laughing at the idea of part time punks, or laughing at part time punks (laughing nervously, because I was, ahem, a student)

It seemed that in the eighties the worst possible insult you could throw at anyone was 'poser'. I remember my horror a few years back when high street shops started selling Ramones and Motorhead t-shirts to kids that had never heard of them. I tried to explain to my kids the level of embarrassment that you would have faced had you ever been caught wearing a tour t-shirt, but hadn't been at one of the dates on the back!!! Had you been caught wearing the t-shirt of a band that you didn't even know, you would have had to lock yourself in your bedroom and not come out until you'd left school for good.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

It seemed that in the eighties the worst possible insult you could throw at anyone was 'poser'. I remember my horror a few years back when high street shops started selling Ramones and Motorhead t-shirts to kids that had never heard of them. I tried to explain to my kids the level of embarrassment that you would have faced had you ever been caught wearing a tour t-shirt, but hadn't been at one of the dates on the back!!! Had you been caught wearing the t-shirt of a band that you didn't even know, you would have had to lock yourself in your bedroom and not come out until you'd left school for good.

Indeed. Unless you were a fan of this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CYrJ1POzns

Saw them at The Nashville. Another sad RIP.

 

[Weststander]

The thread seems to have headed towards 'classic rawk' very quickly. I'm presuming that most were seeing soul, reggae & R&B as different genres, separate to the question. If not, then you'd have to question some of the suggestions. A thread of the best vocal performances ever in all popular music that had Rod Stewart, John Lennon and Ronnie James Dio, but didn't include Aretha, Sam Cooke, Otis Redding, Irma Thomas, Bessy Smith, Mahalia Jackson, Ben E King, James Brown, Etta James, Solomon Burke, Bobby Bland, Marvin Gaye, Aaron Neville, Jimmy Cliff, Curtis Mayfield, Toots Hibbert, James Carr, Bill Withers, Gladys Knight, Dionne Warwick, etc. would be like a list of the best ever footballers that was missing all South Americans and Europeans.

Lets face it, Erma Franklin wasn't even the best singer in her family, but her vocals on her recording of 'Piece of My Heart' were head and shoulders above the hallowed Joplin version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5fqWugnIhk

Those of the E.Franklin, A.Franklin and Holliday era, very often referenced Bessie Smith as the greatest singer, their inspiration.