[Cricket] Yorkshire cricket.end off

[Chicken Run]

Can’t stand Yorkshire CC , their original policy of only picking players who were born in the county was a thinly veiled attempt to ensure those of an ethnic background didn’t play for them, nasty horrible club, hope they suffer for this!!!


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[Papa Lazarou]

Given that I am not one of the gammon crew on here, and folk know it, I feel qualified to make my point here.

There was clearly a strong relationship between the two. I wouldn't use racial slurs as banter, but some younger folk may well between them. That is not for the law to arbitrate.

When I was younger myself and a close friend from Ghana did say stuff to each other that would not be acceptable outwith our relationship. That is no-one else's business.

Unless a child or a person of limited capacity in mental capability, for a person to be a victim they need to consider themselves as such first. Gary seems to suggest that Azeem never saw himself as such at the time and this was consenting dialogue between friends.

If that was the case, then what happened between them is no-one's business.

As for the other claims, can't comment. I know nothing of them.

didn't the report say that Rafiq was reduced to tears by some of the comments? Were they tears of joy?

 

[highflyer]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m00113dp

Listen from around 40 mins in

Excellent interview with George Dobell, senior correspondence at ESPN Cricinfo, who was involved in uncovering this.

He doesn't gloss over the actions of individuals ('banter') but in his coverage he made a decision not to name individuals (although that's all public now through the leaked report) as his concen is focussed much more on the cover-up side of the story.

 

[Eeyore]

didn't the report say that Rafiq was reduced to tears by some of the comments? Were they tears of joy?

I'm referring to his relationship with Gary Ballance who says 'To my knowledge, it has never been alleged that I reduced Rafa to tears'

As said, I don't know about any other circumstance. And as I also said 'First point. No place for racism in sport. Or anywhere'.

 

[highflyer]

At what point does banter between friends become a national issue?

Is the correct answer 'when the used of the word 'banter' is a thinly veiled attempt to excuse racism as part of a cover up that goes to the very top of a major national sport'?

 

[DJ NOBO]

Unacceptable behaviour not dealt with

A serious error of judgement in how they handled this out of the gate....

Paying a heavy price now

Are they ? The club seems to be doing a fine job of escaping reprimand.

 

[Easy 10]

Are they ? The club seems to be doing a fine job of escaping reprimand.

They are paying a heavy price in a literal sense, as two of their major sponsors have now binned them off.

 

[Springal]

Are they ? The club seems to be doing a fine job of escaping reprimand.

Not really - the mishandling of all of this and the flaky report that was produced (how did a black, anti discrimination lawyer put his name to 'P*ki* being acceptable as banter) means they are being hauled in front of the Government Select Committee with the ECB.

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

I'm referring to his relationship with Gary Ballance who says 'To my knowledge, it has never been alleged that I reduced Rafa to tears'

As said, I don't know about any other circumstance. And as I also said 'First point. No place for racism in sport. Or anywhere'.

I believe that Ballance has been compelled to make a public statement as a result of effectively being identified by the ludicrous claim that Yorkshire would punish Rafiq for using the word "zimbo" if he were still a player there. Since he's the only Zimbabwean player at the club it's obvious that refers to him, and reading the article on Monday it was easy to make the assumption that the rest of the claims involved him as well. That clearly wasn't the case, and the issue is much larger than the relationship between Rafiq and Ballance (which, taking Ballance's statement at face value, I tend to agree with you about).

 

[happypig]

It’s also odd that Rafiq made 43 allegations but only 7 were upheld in the external investigation. The hiring of a law firm to investigate this suggests that they used a court’s measure of ‘truth’ (beyond a reasonable doubt) instead of the benchmark needed in an internal workplace investigation/report (in all probability).

"Beyond Reasonable Doubt" is the standard of proof required in a criminal court. In a civil court is is "Balance of Probability".

 

[DJ NOBO]

Not really - the mishandling of all of this and the flaky report that was produced (how did a black, anti discrimination lawyer put his name to 'P*ki* being acceptable as banter) means they are being hauled in front of the Government Select Committee with the ECB.

Yes, and hopefully that will lead to resignations at Yorkshire CCC at the very least.
But I don’t think the cricketing public should be complacent at this point that strong action is inevitable.
The cricket authorities have dragged their heels on this for more than a year.
The lack of integrity by the club in wanting to address the racism is as bad as the racism itself.

 

[Springal]

Yes, and hopefully that will lead to resignations at Yorkshire CCC at the very least.
But I don’t think the cricketing public should be complacent at this point that strong action is inevitable.
The cricket authorities have dragged their heels on this for more than a year.
The lack of integrity in wanting to address the racism is as bad as the racism itself.

Agreed - the ESPN / Cricinfo guy seems to think it is not just a Yorkshire thing and he has a lot of stories and accounts of players who suffered racist abuse in the English County Cricket scene

 

[Cheshire Cat]

It isn't difficult.

Don't use racist or other offensive language or behaviour to anyone - ever.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Question

The statement made by Ballance, does Rafiq back up that version of events?

 

[Fat Boy Fat]

Ongoing use of P***, also admitted to telling other people "don't talk to him [Rafiq], he's a P**i", asking "is that your uncle?" when they saw bearded Asian men and saying "does your dad own those?" in reference to corner shops. Didn't realise it was the 1980’s up there

Sounds like an episode of Love Thy Neighbour, doesn't it!

https://www.britishclassiccomedy.co.uk/never-seen-on-tv-love-thy-neighbour-pilot

 

[Springal]

Question

The statement made by Ballance, does Rafiq back up that version of events?

It is difficult to say because Rafiq doesn't name any one.

 

[Dave the OAP]

That said, Gary Ballance was born and raised in Zimbabwe...

Ok then, great and self righteous ones on here, is this a racist statement as by inference being born and raised in Zimbabwe automatically makes you a racist?

Does NSC tolerate racist overtones?

Just asking

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

OK then. So my stance on Ballance is that if Rafiq doesn't come out and contradict his statement, then they way mates choose to address each other is their business and should not be conflated with the wider issues at YCCC

If Rafiq does contradict it, then Ballance is a racist and a liar.

 

[Dave the OAP]

OK then. So my stance on Ballance is that if Rafiq doesn't come out and contradict his statement, then they way mates choose to address each other is their business and should not be conflated with the wider issues at YCCC

If Rafiq does contradict it, then Ballance is a racist and a liar.

It seems a bit detailed about weddings, staying at each others houses, befriended brothers and being invited to Pakistan to his wedding to be a lie….

But there again….

 

[Eeyore]

I believe that Ballance has been compelled to make a public statement as a result of effectively being identified by the ludicrous claim that Yorkshire would punish Rafiq for using the word "zimbo" if he were still a player there. Since he's the only Zimbabwean player at the club it's obvious that refers to him, and reading the article on Monday it was easy to make the assumption that the rest of the claims involved him as well. That clearly wasn't the case, and the issue is much larger than the relationship between Rafiq and Ballance (which, taking Ballance's statement at face value, I tend to agree with you about).

Quite. What happened between Gary Ballance and him is a sideshow. If it was consented behaviour between them then Ballance has no case to answer even if the language used was regrettable.

I don't know anything about the other issues excepting that some were upheld.

I tire of the media coverage here though. Even the BBC didn't report the Gary Ballance statement in full.

This is the problem. Yorkshire took no action. So it's important to first here from them the full reasoning behind this.

Is there to be an MP select committee thingy ? I'd rather it be an independent hearing than MPs trying to elevate their moral stature. It's not like some of them don't have form...

If Yorkshire have allowed a culture of racism to fester then it should be addressed. But given that Rafiq was made captain, it does seem at odds. They need to explain themselves fully and all the facts need to be considered for a proper judgement. Being a cricket devotee and one that thinks that the game is a great opportunity for different groups in society to come together I find myself keenly following what is happening here.

But I'm not starting at a default anti-Yorkshire position. I just want to hear the facts.