Winker
CUM ON FEEL THE NOIZE
If Wagner are a mercenary group then why don't we hire them to destroy the Russian forces in Ukraine? I'm sure the West could afford to do it. It would be cheaper than sending endless weaponry over there.
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[Politics] Wtf is going on in Moscow?
- Thread starter Dave the OAP
- Start date
FatSuperman
Well-known member
- Feb 25, 2016
- 2,922
This is precisely the issue with Russia.
I was wondering, even if somehow the entire military and espionage leadership structure was wiped out (hundreds of senior figures), what would happen?
The populace are not used to voting for genuine candidates, with published mandates. And even if they did, the entire military structure in Russia operates on corruption. Every junior officer would have seen their superiors creaming their little bit. And they themselves would have done similar. All they know is this, so presumably some charismatic strongman would rise to prominence quickly and they would simply seize control, and we carry on.
There is practically no scenario where someone takes over and genuinely spends a few decades requiring the Russian psyche.
The only way that could be done is as a multi-generation black ops mission to start shifting how they think.
We’re more likely to see aliens arrive and wholesale change the culture of the planet than the Russians take care of themselves.
Please note, I am wholly uneducated to make any of the above statements, and very ready to be corrected by longtime students of Russia.
Also, the few Russian people I know (including my Aunt) are AMAZING people. So I’m not saying there is anything wrong with the humans themselves. Should be obvious but you never know!
deletebeepbeepbeep
Well-known member
- May 12, 2009
- 21,794
Yeah this Prigozhin chap doesn't seem like anyone we want to have access to any kind of nuclear codes for starters.
junior
Well-known member
I knew he was destined for bigger things when he left Huddersfield.
- Jul 10, 2003
- 27,766
Much as I want to see Putin go, I would urge some caution as to what or who replaces him. The West don't have the greatest record of replacing the vacuum left after taking out a dictator, so I'm not sure that I would have great faith in the head of a company supplying mercenaries being any better at it. Have a look at his history in Africa 
Nobby
Well-known member
- Sep 29, 2007
- 2,892
The difference may well be that the current troops marching on Moscow are Russian.
And if they pick up a few stragglers along the way....
Agreed. Putin is a head case but maybe, just maybe, will stay clear of the nuclear button. Who knows what might happen if someone even worse gets control.Much as I want to see Putin go, I would urge some caution as to what or who replaces him. The West don't have the greatest record of replacing the vacuum left after taking out a dictator, so I'm not sure that I would have great faith in the head of a company supplying mercenaries being any better at it. Have a look at his history in Africa
FatSuperman
Well-known member
- Feb 25, 2016
- 2,922
Indeed. He’s at least a known quantity and whilst clearly a very negative influence on the world and region, he has at least been consistent and until 2014 and Crimea, generally stable.
Perhaps he’s getting worse as he comes closer to death, but is it better the devil you know?
Much as I like to see Putin discomforted, I'm not at all sure this is good news. As far as I can see, Prigozhin's main beef with Putin is that the Russian army has made a complete balls-up of destroying Ukraine and wiping Ukrainians off the face of the earth, so he, Prigozhin, wants to take over the war and do a proper job of the slaughter and destruction.
It's not made up
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
Firing a nuclear weapon is never down to one individual, no matter how powerful they are.
They can give the order but the order can be ignored. It is also up to the discretion of the military in charge at the time. Funnily enough, it happened twice, in 1963 and 1983
Soviet submarine officer who averted nuclear war honoured with prize
Vasili Arkhipov, who prevented escalation of the cold war by refusing to launch a nuclear torpedo against US forces, is to be awarded new ‘Future of Life’ prize
www.theguardian.com
The man who saved the world from nuclear catastrophe
False alarm of a US nuclear first attack was detected by a Soviet military analyst who helped evade a nuclear war.
Weststander
Well-known member
This to me has echoes of Ernst Röhm and his Sturmabteilung (SA).
The Wagner Group leaders will be assassinated.
Putin will blame Ukraine.
The Wagner Group leaders will be assassinated.
Putin will blame Ukraine.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
Is it a narrative for a Russian exit from the conflict? We haven’t found any Nazis / we went in on false info / those responsible will be held to account etc etc.
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
It appears the Russian troops aren't doing much at all. This chap is Estonian and fairly accurate.
If that was the plan, why would they need Prigozhin and Putin fighting?
Prigozhin gave that as an option for Putin (blaming Shoigu for deceiving Putin and the Russian people) and Putin could have simply said 'yep, it's Shoigu's fault, we're withdrawing. Instead, Putin has said that Progozhin is a traitor and must die. If Putin wins, he can't blame Prigozhin for the pointless war as it clearly wasn't Prigozhin's decision to invade.
SeagullinExile
Well-known member
He more or less said in one of his rants that the war was a mistake, and that the Defence ministry lied as a pretext to war.
Being reported Wagner troops have taken control of military base in another city halfway between Rostov and Moscow no indication relating to size of base or numbers involved depending upon the answers it might be an indication that some troops might be sympathetic to the Wagner cause.
