Would you change your referendum vote?

[Soulman]

My ex father in law was in the Royal Artillery, but got home from Dunkirk. He belonged to the Dunkirk Asociation.

I looked up my Grandfather on the HMS Lancastria site which is based in Scotland. He died on the same day as my birthday. Still the biggest loss of life in a maritime disaster I believe.

 

[cheshunt seagull]

I'd be interested to know which European countries you consider made ''Equally big sacrifices '' ?

WW2 deaths
UK: 450k
France: 550k
Greece: 563k
Netherlands: 301k (a much smaller nation)

I am not wishing to under-state the massive sacrifice of my parent's generation, and this is not the only measure of it, but others did make some very big sacrifices as well..

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I looked up my Grandfather on the HMS Lancastria site which is based in Scotland. He died on the same day as my birthday. Still the biggest loss of life in a maritime disaster I believe.

Was he on the Lancastria as she tried to set sail from St Nazaire?

 

[drew]

Some local politician in Calais said the Touquet accord should end but the French government have confirmed there is to be no change to the border arrangements. Or any of the other bi lateral agreements we have with France. There must be many people who voted remain because of Project Fear as numerous people (including on NSC) seemed to believe or suggested this would actually happen.

Have to say of all the people that I have spoken to that voted remain, none have cited that as the reason. On the other side of the coin there will be many that voted Leave because they thought immigration rules would change or because they thought the NHS would be richer by £350m per week!!!

 

[nicko31]

As a pensioner Baby Boomer, please don't think we're all selfish. I voted remain, & still think remain.

Good on you, my inlaws did as well.

My parents didn't, its created a lot of tension of my family

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Have to say of all the people that I have spoken to that voted remain, none have cited that as the reason. On the other side of the coin there will be many that voted Leave because they thought immigration rules would change or because they thought the NHS would be richer by £350m per week!!!

They will be happy on the immigration rules bit then but not so with the £350m per week for the NHS

Most of the peeps I know who voted Remain did seem to think fear of the unknown was a major factor and some have said (after an initial bout of depression) how it doesn't seem that bad after all. Still to early to tell obviously but I am greatly encouraged by the relative stability considering the seismic shift in direction for this country and the political paralysis/chaos in both main parties.

 

[Uncle Buck]

Would be a little unfair to ignore Natos contribution to that and a good example of how countries can collaborate positively outside of political union

But NATO is a military organisation. Yes its attack more, means you attack all, has as a rule maintained peace. See Russia willing to nab bits of the Ukraine, but less likely to try and grab back the Baltic states as they are now NATO members.

However the original European Steel and Coal group, was in essence to control the materials of war and stop Germany becoming resurgent again. Now militarily that has worked, you can argue that economically Germany has become dominant in Europe, but at least they do not seem intent on recreating a land greater Reich.

 

[sten_super]

Most of the peeps I know who voted Remain did seem to think fear of the unknown was a major factor and some have said (after an initial bout of depression) how it doesn't seem that bad after all. Still to early to tell obviously but I am greatly encouraged by the relative stability considering the seismic shift in direction for this country and the political paralysis/chaos in both main parties.

The economic impact wasn't ever likely to be instantaneous, though. The key questions for economic growth in the short/medium term are;
- What happens to business investment; to what extent will businesses (including UK- but mostly foreign-owned) hold off (in the short term) or cancel investments in the UK? When is the trigger point for decisions - is it triggering Article 50, or is it when the likely terms of a trade agreement start to appear?
- Household expenditure; to what extent do households postpone/cancel big purchases (e.g. white goods) and "tighten their belts" given the prolonged period of uncertainty
- Trade; in the short term, will weaker sterling benefit export volumes/values (unlikely to be a huge effect); in the longer term, what will the negotiated trade deal look like, what are the implications for the costs of imports and exports, and what impact will this have on economic activity in key traded sectors (including business & financial services, which is very difficult to measure but on which a large number of jobs now depend)?

 

[Rugrat]

I agree with you entirely, need a much longer time horizon to judge, but a lot of remainiacs were using the market fall on Friday to back up the idiocy of those who voted leave........

Funny that after a couple of days the Remainers were predicting doom, now the economy has recovered a bit we can look at the affect after 5 years. Maybe the kneejerkers should have waited longer in the first place before dribbling at the initial reaction.

Just like those that voted leave not all those that voted remain will be of the exact same opinion. I was responding to a specific comment .... the problem with the entire campaign by both sides is that it's be based on assumption and theory as nobody really knows what the outcome of all of this will be. Anyone suggesting they do has either been taken in by the propaganda (whichever side they support) or is a complete fool

 

[larus]

Yes I do and certainly Scotland will leave the UK if that's what it takes. Apparently the 350 million promised to the NHS was lie.... nice one.

I voted remain and would do again.

Please tell me what's happened to the emergency £30bln budget threatened in the event of an exit vote? Both sides LIED, but you sdeem to be very selective in which lies you disapprove of.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Germany lost over 7 million people during WW2 as well, swept on by a evil nationalistic cause that wasn't ultimately in their interest. I remember visiting a German war cemetery in northern France as a child, as well as Commonwealth and American ones. I think wars and conflicts are very sad and nobody really wins them in my opinion.

 

[Giraffe]

Voted leave, still leave. To say you would change your mind now would be incredibly weak minded and unintelligent. Ask the question in ten years time when you can properly judge the outcome.

 

[Baldseagull]

that was not the point I was trying to make, we still had to go over there and save them
imagine if we had not done that

So it was not in Britains self interests at all?

 

[Baldseagull]

Would that be the ships at mers el kebir youre referring to , that the French refused to surrender to us , and were going to be given to the Germans by the Vichy regime ?

Yes, but the French believed they would not have been used by Germany. We could not take the chance, and we had to do it of course, but imagine if the situation were reversed. How would you feel about the French?

 

[Easy 10]

So if we had a referendum to bin the NHS, or stick with it, which way would you go?
We can all see the benefit of having an organisation that has saved countless lives, but it is quite expensive and I am sure we could go it alone, a lot of people would be ****ed now but it would be better in the long run if we all had private health care, surely?

I'd 100% stick with it, but it needs reform. The NHS is not underfunded, but those funds are being channelled away from where they need to go.

Example. The company I work for recruited a COO for an NHS trust recently. They were billed £8,500 for advertising the position in the Sunday Times, then a £9,000 retainer, a £9,000 shortlist fee, and a £9,500 completion fee. So that's £36,000 of NHS money spent on getting someone in the door. The candidate was placed on an initial salary of £140k plus numerous perks (car etc). You can be sure someone in that position will be creaming it in bonuses as well. And that's just ONE example - we've placed loads of these executive penpushers, and I'm sure we're not the only company doing it either.

The NHS is AWASH with money, don't let anyone tell you any different. Its simply scandalous how that money is actually spent.

 

[greyseagull]

I voted LEAVE; I'm very pleased I did; I would do the same again.

The FTSE 100 is back almost to where it was last Thursday. The £ is recovering. So much for all the doom-mongers.

As for £350m more going to the NHS. The organisation needs to control its current costs, not be given even more money to fritter away.

And does anyone really believe that Scotland or Northern Ireland will leave the UK so that they can be controlled by a bunch of unelected bureaucrats in Brussels?

The UK hasn't left the EU yet. The UK still has access to the single market amongst other things from the EU. What happened in the immediate aftermath was the shock of the result. The actual consequences will be felt when Article 50 is triggered and we eventually leave the EU, whenever that happens.

 

[alfredmizen]

Yes, but the French believed they would not have been used by Germany. We could not take the chance, and we had to do it of course, but imagine if the situation were reversed. How would you feel about the French?

Yes, because the Germans would have listened to the Vichy regime

 

[alfredmizen]

So it was not in Britains self interests at all?

The Germans offered us an armistice, they would have europe, we would keep the empire, we turned them down.

 

[CHAPPERS]

I'd 100% stick with it, but it needs reform. The NHS is not underfunded, but those funds are being channelled away from where they need to go.

Example. The company I work for recruited a COO for an NHS trust recently. They were billed £8,500 for advertising the position in the Sunday Times, then a £9,000 retainer, a £9,000 shortlist fee, and a £9,500 completion fee. So that's £36,000 of NHS money spent on getting someone in the door. The candidate was placed on an initial salary of £140k plus numerous perks (car etc). You can be sure someone in that position will be creaming it in bonuses as well. And that's just ONE example - we've placed loads of these executive penpushers, and I'm sure we're not the only company doing it either.

The NHS is AWASH with money, don't let anyone tell you any different. Its simply scandalous how that money is actually spent.

Liam Fox was on the radio earlier suggesting something completely different. He stated, quite rightly, that if people weren't so unhealthy (and it's only getting worse) then the NHS wouldn't be spending such vast amounts of money on medecine, which is the real cost to the taxpayer.

 

[Baldseagull]

A little bit more of a clue than you , judging by youre post immediately after this one.

No, no clue at all. You have Jeremy Clarkson view of WW2, you want to play top trumps European armies, and suggest that no one else in Europe gave as much in terms of dead soldiers to resist Hitler, which is bollox. The French declared war on Germany at the same time as we did, and given that they are next door neighbours, it was clear where the shit was going to go down. We fought mainly away from our country, the French knew their towns and villages could become battle grounds.
You think we bailed them out, and in 1944 you could say that we did, but for 4 years before that, all they saw of Brits was bombers over their coastline. 4 years.