[Politics] Woodrow Wilson

[Sid and the Sharknados]

Although a quick rattle through American history will throw up nonsense like Watergate, McCarthyism, and politicians on both sides making a speech to an audience in one state or city and then another totally contradicting it the next day somewhere else. Or people like Woodrow Wilson who make Trump seem committed to racial equality.

So no, not like this. But shit in an interesting variety of different ways.

Again, the idiocy of applying 21st. century judgements on people who were around 100-150 years ago, or more. Woodrow Wilson's ideas on race, whatever they were, would have been shared by pretty much everybody else. He probably never considered legalising homosexuality either, so he was obviously a vicious homophobe and should be vilified for it. And a woman's place was in the home, bringing up the children and supporting her husband - so obviously all males were sexists and therefore despicable.
Stupid, isn't it - they were just ordinary people, living in the world as it was at the time, but no, some people simply can't avoid judging the common man of years past by the social and moral standards which are current today, but weren't then.

Have you ever actually read anything about Wilson's policies regarding race and how they compared to his predecessors?

Edit: this is well off topic, for which I apologise to everybody. I'll leave it there unless anybody wants to quote that on a more appropriate thread. My point, for what it's worth, is that there have been plenty of presidents and politicians who have made things worse in America and the world one way or another over the years. We're not uniquely blessed to live in an age of shits, liers and hypocrites.

I'll leave the Donald Trump tread as the Donald Trump thread then, for those that are interested in discussing the disgusting man.

Alright then, on a thread specially made for discussing the matter.

What is your objection to comparing Woodrow Wilson's record on race to his predecessors in the White House?

 

[Chicken Run]

Woodrow Wilson sounds like a New Home Builder Company

 

[Stat Brother]

Go on admit it my drivel don't look so bad now, does it?

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

Go on admit it my drivel don't look so bad now, does it?

If somebody's going to describe something I've written as "idiocy" and "stupid", I'd like some sort of justification for it.

I'm just shocked nobody's had a reason in the past to start a thread discussing American Presidents who died 100years ago. I do appreciate that it probably comes across as insane.

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

 

[Peacehaven Wild Kids]

View attachment 175474

First thing I thought of

 

[Crawley Dingo]

Wasn't just Woodrow Wilson it was the whole DNC until welfare and the Southern strategy to smear republicans as racists.

Google up Klanbake 1924 Democrat Convention.

 

[Zeberdi]

Well first you start this on the Ukraine thread, then the Trump thread - So let’s have a whataboutery debate about one of the most racist Democrat Presidents in history, who in 1912 deeply segregated America, implemented policies that are now completely sociably unacceptable - as is in 2024, Trump’s misogynistic behaviour towards women and racist attitudes towards non-white Americans, refugees and immigrants are a matter of public record and likewise, today, completely sociably unacceptable.

Perhaps we should revisit McCarthyism too in the light of Russia’s attempt to influence American elections in favour of Trump and start rounding up Republicans suspected of dog whistling to Putin?

Times have changed - but in some respects not necessarily for the better.

 

[Bakero]

Wasn't just Woodrow Wilson it was the whole DNC until welfare and the Southern strategy to smear republicans as racists.

Google up Klanbake 1924 Democrat Convention.

The Southern Strategy to smear Republicans? Wasn't the Southern Strategy a Republican plan to exploit racial tensions to their advantage?

 

[Albion my Albion]

Woodrow Wilson

World War I catapulted the United States from traditional isolationism to international involvement in a major European conflict. Woodrow Wilson envisaged a permanent American imprint on democracy in world affairs through participation in the League of Nations. Amid these defining events, Wilson suffered a major ischemic stroke on October 2, 1919, which left him incapacitated. What was probably his fourth and most devastating stroke was diagnosed and treated by his friend and personal physician, Admiral Cary Grayson. Grayson, who had tremendous personal and professional loyalty to Wilson, kept the severity of the stroke hidden from Congress, the American people, and even the president himself. During a cabinet briefing, Grayson formally refused to sign a document of disability and was reluctant to address the subject of presidential succession. Wilson was essentially incapacitated and hemiplegic, yet he remained an active president and all messages were relayed directly through his wife, Edith. Patient-physician confidentiality superseded national security amid the backdrop of friendship and political power on the eve of a pivotal juncture in the history of American foreign policy. It was in part because of the absence of Woodrow Wilson's vocal and unwavering support that the United States did not join the League of Nations and distanced itself from the international stage. The League of Nations would later prove powerless without American support and was unable to thwart the rise and advance of Adolf Hitler. Only after World War II did the United States assume its global leadership role and realize Wilson's visionary, yet contentious, groundwork for a Pax Americana. The authors describe Woodrow Wilson's stroke, the historical implications of his health decline, and its impact on United States foreign policy.

Woodrow Wilson's hidden stroke of 1919: the impact of patient-physician confidentiality on United States foreign policy - PubMed

World War I catapulted the United States from traditional isolationism to international involvement in a major European conflict. Woodrow Wilson envisaged a permanent American imprint on democracy in world affairs through participation in the League of Nations. Amid these defining events, Wilson...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Go on admit it my drivel don't look so bad now, does it?

WW hated cyclists though.

 

[Sid and the Sharknados]

Well first you start this on the Ukraine thread, then the Trump thread

I'm just going to address this first - I replied to a post about American politics on the Ukraine thread, and included a reference to Wilson as an example of how plenty of presidents in the past have actively and deliberately made things worse in ways that directly affected millions of people. This is clearly off topic and inappropriate for that thread, so I attempted to move it to the Trump thread which is broadly an appropriate place to discuss American politics.

So let’s have a whataboutery debate about one of the most racist Democrat Presidents in history, who in 1912 deeply segregated America, implemented policies that are now completely sociably unacceptable - as is in 2024, Trump’s misogynistic behaviour towards women and racist attitudes towards non-white Americans, refugees and immigrants are a matter of public record and likewise, today, completely sociably unacceptable.

Perhaps we should revisit McCarthyism too in the light of Russia’s attempt to influence American elections in favour of Trump and start rounding up Republicans suspected of dog whistling to Putin?

Times have changed - but in some respects not necessarily for the better.

This isn't whataboutery. I'm not claiming Trump is OK because people in the past were arseholes too. I'm pointing out that the problems we face now with social media and the Internet and factionalism in our politics are the modern manifestation of problems that have existed throughout history.

It's not fair to hold people in the past to historic standards, but this isn't relevant because Wilson's policies (in addition to many other politicians we could throw in from all sides) weren't just unacceptable by modern standards, they were controversial and criticised by many people at the time.

 

[perth seagull]

Arguably the worst US President of the 20th century, and possibly of all time.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Arguably the worst US President of the 20th century, and possibly of all time.

There is a lot of competition for the particular title.