[Albion] Why Are We So Wasteful?

[b.w.2.]

Definitely and especially right now, in an economic crisis. Do we really want to do a Bolton? A Portsmouth?

There is a middle ground. This argument always gets me. Like you can only spend zero or enough to go bust. Believe it or not, the amount you spend lies somewhere on a continuum. Also, if your recruitment is good, you can save and make a lot of money. See Brentford or Peterborough.


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[b.w.2.]

Hahaha! Ask Newcastle fans what they think of Mike Ashley’s investment over the past four seasons.

Villa are a massive club. They can afford a higher wage structure than us, they have owners with bigger pockets. They have spent £200m in three windows. They can afford the risk.

We tried it with Locadia and did a Sheffield United. Tony isn’t a fool.

And therein lies lesson 2. Don’t spend around 15 million on dross repeatedly (Locadia, AJ, etc): buy ONE player instead of 3 or 4 wasters.


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[Swansman]

Definitely and especially right now, in an economic crisis. Do we really want to do a Bolton? A Portsmouth?

This.

And I stand by my opinion that people saying "we need to invest more" surely are free to do so themselves, I doubt TB would say no to any donor offering the club £100m or so. To demand that he should invest more money from his own wallet than he already is is a very weird behaviour and they urgently need to be taught some manners. Tony is not asset stripping or making tons of millions from this club, he is giving it money, people have no right to ask for more. If they say the club "should" invest more money, they could at least stop their pathetic toe tapping and tell it like it really is - they would prefer Tony to go and some richer guy to take over

The "Potter out" and "everyone is shit" stuff dont bother me half as much as the ones saying "Tony needs to invest more money". I think its ****ish beyond belief. They should go with one of the three other options: invest the money yourself or be honest and say you want TB out or just shut the **** up and be happy that someone is already splashing a lot of cash on your club because very few football clubs out there is lucky enough to have someone like TB.

 

[brighton_tom]

Bar a handful of strikers in the league most are wasteful. Im sure United fans would describe Martial as wasteful, and Chelsea the same with Abraham, Aubameyang has been wasteful this season. Its not uncommon. If Maupay was a more clinical player & therefor had scored 15-20 last season, and already be on 10-15 this season then he'd probably be with a bigger club. This season the wastefulness seems to be more apparent because we started creating lots of chances. Hopefully some increased confidence and a little less tinkering from GP will help things. To help the conversion rate i'd love to see us bring in a specialist strikers coach.

 

[Wardy's twin]

It seems only Bissouma is prepared to get a shot away early.everyone else has to control it , take another touch , look up , wait and...oh no it's blocked.

and Mac Alister...

 

[Skaville]

And therein lies lesson 2. Don’t spend around 15 million on dross repeatedly (Locadia, AJ, etc): buy ONE player instead of 3 or 4 wasters.


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Like Haller? Pepe? Brewster? Alexis Sanchez? Spending big doesn’t guarantee success.

Villa signed a whole bunch of players, not just Watkins.

 

[Murray 17]

The 100m thing is a bit misleading though isn't it?
Either we scrap the wage policy and add £10 - £20m to 5 other player's wages and blow the £100m that way. Or we **** up 4 years of building a team ethos, by just rewarding the new Messiah.

TB probably believes if we can keep the squad together we would be in good shape to return before parachute payments end.
Balancing that against breaking club wage policy for one player?
I get why the club's policy is the way it is.

It's always been my opinion that wages is the difference.

If we paid another 20-30k/week on a quality, or 2 quality players near the end of their contracts, we could get a couple of proven players in (not sick notes).

If that means 2 or 3 of our current squad ask for a pay rise, then let them. Dunk is usually the one people quote. I very much doubt he would get much more than we are paying him, if he went elsewhere. 2 years ago I would have dreaded losing him, but he has not maintained that form in the last season or so.

All clubs have higher earners, and lower earners.

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[Wardy's twin]

Bar a handful of strikers in the league most are wasteful. Im sure United fans would describe Martial as wasteful, and Chelsea the same with Abraham, Aubameyang has been wasteful this season. Its not uncommon. If Maupay was a more clinical player & therefor had scored 15-20 last season, and already be on 10-15 this season then he'd probably be with a bigger club. This season the wastefulness seems to be more apparent because we started creating lots of chances. Hopefully some increased confidence and a little less tinkering from GP will help things. To help the conversion rate i'd love to see us bring in a specialist strikers coach.

I just posted a video about an ice skating pair (yes different sport and circumstances) where the man is throwing the woman and catching her , no room for error maybe its a mind set thing

 

[Skaville]

This.

And I stand by my opinion that people saying "we need to invest more" surely are free to do so themselves, I doubt TB would say no to any donor offering the club £100m or so. To demand that he should invest more money from his own wallet than he already is is a very weird behaviour and they urgently need to be taught some manners. Tony is not asset stripping or making tons of millions from this club, he is giving it money, people have no right to ask for more. If they say the club "should" invest more money, they could at least stop their pathetic toe tapping and tell it like it really is - they would prefer Tony to go and some richer guy to take over

The "Potter out" and "everyone is shit" stuff dont bother me half as much as the ones saying "Tony needs to invest more money". I think its ****ish beyond belief. They should go with one of the three other options: invest the money yourself or be honest and say you want TB out or just shut the **** up and be happy that someone is already splashing a lot of cash on your club because very few football clubs out there is lucky enough to have someone like TB.

Exactly. We’re playing decent football, investing in young emerging players and largely holding our own in the Premier League. We’re Brighton and Hove Albion. If you want substantially more than this surely it’s time to give up watching football or support another club because you’ll get no happiness here.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

It is a gamble either way. I believe we should invest. It appears 19 out of 20 Prem chairman agree with me.

Take Newcastle as an example. They are clearly an awful team, but they have more points than us. If they survive it will be down to investment. Callum Wilson is a major reason why they may just survive. Without him relegation guaranteed for them.

Another example. Brewster went to Sheffield United. They invested about the same as Newcastle did in Wilson. He (Brewster) has zero goals. The roll of the dice for them has so far failed. But they did invest.

Finally, Villa invested well. Including a higher amount in Maupay’s old buddy Watkins. They are now where we want to be. End of argument.


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End of argument

Villa
Watkins is not even the main reason Villa are where they are. He has one more Prem goal than Maupay, I think.
Having Grealish/Traore/El ghazi chipping in with a further 14 or so is a bigger factor. Any idea how many goals our next 3 have?
Villa Spent £80m in the last window on transfer fees alone.
They also brought in Ross Barclay on top of having a pretty decent value squad in the first place.
Villa's overall investment (particularly wages) far outstrips ours.

Newcastle
Newcastle are going the wrong way at the moment, 4 losses after their draw with Liverpool.
They have scored 4 fewer goals than us over all.
Goal difference is -7 on us.
Callum Wilson has scored one more goal than Maupay and their next 3 goal scorers have managed just 4 goals

I wouldn't see them as an example of this strategy working, just yet.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

It's always been my opinion that wages is the difference.

If we paid another 20-30k/week on a quality, or 2 quality players near the end of their contracts, we could get a couple of proven players in (not sick notes).

If that means 2 or 3 of our current squad ask for a pay rise, then let them. Dunk is usually the one people quote. I very much doubt he would get much more than we are paying him, if he went elsewhere. 2 years ago I would have dreaded losing him, but he has not maintained that form in the last season or so.

All clubs have higher earners, and lower earners.

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Stats back up the argument that the Prem table pretty closely reflects the wages.
The occasional anomaly indicates this theory is open to some variation, but yes widely i agree with it.

I disagree with the idea of bringing in players at the end of their contracts though.
These players aren't the ones making the difference in the table position vs Wage bill argument.
Most of these players are barely appearing in the top 6 teams they made their name at and are now looking for a final pay day elsewhere.

That isn't what's needed IMO.

 

[Hugo Rune]

Newcastle
Newcastle are going the wrong way at the moment, 4 losses after their draw with Liverpool.
They have scored 4 fewer goals than us over all.
Goal difference is -7 on us.
Callum Wilson has scored one more goal than Maupay and their next 3 goal scorers have managed just 4 goals

I wouldn't see them as an example of this strategy working, just yet.

I counted up how many points Newcastle had gained on Wilson’s goals, be they winners or equalisers. It was 13. Great on the plus side in that the investment is paying off but if he gets injured, they are in risk of finishing below Sheff Utd because they have no other realistic goal threat. They also bank on Wilson taking the few big chances he is presented with, recently, he has been missing them.

 

[ewe2]

Let’s face it......If we had a goal scorer........He would not be with us long.....

 

[Skaville]

There is a middle ground. This argument always gets me. Like you can only spend zero or enough to go bust. Believe it or not, the amount you spend lies somewhere on a continuum. Also, if your recruitment is good, you can save and make a lot of money. See Brentford or Peterborough.


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The true irony of this post is we are trying to follow a similar model to Brentford and Peterborough, signing young up and coming players (look at our u23 investment and the lines of Zeqirii, Lamptey, Caicedo) or undervalued cheaper options (Andone or a non striking option did be Veltman) to compete. The trouble is it’s bloody hard to do at an elite level and it takes time for players to come good.

Further irony in is being linked to Ivan Toney in the summer. I wonder what NSC would have made of us signing a player from league 1?

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Why it is that professional footballers don’t consider getting their bodies over the ball when striking a bouncing or bobbling ball?


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[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Yesterday was a case in point but come on you stat people, do the stats back up the title to this thread? It just seems to me that we get our selves some great opportunities to score and then fluff our lines.I thought we’d turned a corner against Leeds but now I’m not so sure, we won’t get the same number of opportunities against PL opponents as we did against Blackpool so we have to start converting these chances. My mojo after Leeds took a right bashing yesterday.

Fulham will prove a far tougher nut to crack than Leeds crummy defence ever did. IMHO all your mojo has done is re-set itself to roughly where it should be

 

[Charity Shield 1910]

The players we have just whack it towards goal and trust to luck. Sciring goals is however about putting the ball where keeper will find it hard to reach on target. To do that they have to find space and look up when shooting or already have clocked where the keeper is when shooting. Yes it's natural but they could work on it in training. Personally I'd have Maupay do nothing else but finishing practice for 9 hours a day. He is a good player, save that he can't hit a cows backside with a banjo. Oh for a Peter Ward, Gary Nelson, Bobby Zamora, John Byrne or Micky Small. Ward, Zamora and Byrne would have scored for fun in this side. 4 goals from open play with this Brighton midfield just isn't anywhere near good enough. Every game Maupay misses a sitter. Get him on the training ground for hours on end practicing his finishing, and if it doesn't improve, then sell him and get a replacement.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

I do blame Potter. Has he heard of shooting practice? Andy Cole built finishing into his muscle memory by practicing finishing over and over again.

If we are not going to invest in a new target man (we should) then all our strikers, and those Potter incorrectly claims are strikers, should not stop practicing their finishing.

There is ZERO evidence any of our squad do this.


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Or zero evidence of them not practising this?


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[Thunder Bolt]

The players we have just whack it towards goal and trust to luck. Sciring goals is however about putting the ball where keeper will find it hard to reach on target. To do that they have to find space and look up when shooting or already have clocked where the keeper is when shooting. Yes it's natural but they could work on it in training. Personally I'd have Maupay do nothing else but finishing practice for 9 hours a day. He is a good player, save that he can't hit a cows backside with a banjo. Oh for a Peter Ward, Gary Nelson, Bobby Zamora, John Byrne or Micky Small. Ward, Zamora and Byrne would have scored for fun in this side. 4 goals from open play with this Brighton midfield just isn't anywhere near good enough. Every game Maupay misses a sitter. Get him on the training ground for hours on end practicing his finishing, and if it doesn't improve, then sell him and get a replacement.

Maupay scored 9 goals last season,and is already on 7 this time. That is a good return in the PL.

Your observations are disingenuous at best.

 

[Charity Shield 1910]

Or zero evidence of them not practising this?


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I'm sure they do, but how much? Maupay should be practicing his shooting from 8a.m. to 6.30pm every day in training. Well he would be if I was manager. A bit of Brian Clough direct speaking/action really is what is needed now. Then, if he still doesn't improve, sell and replace him.