[Football] Who’s not watching the World Cup?

[BN41Albion]

The irony, I suppose, is that the 1978 World Cup was the most corrupt of all. You and I were probably too young to know it.

It was said that the cries of the tortured prisoners in the facility opposite the main stadium were drowned out by the crowd.

Was the tournament awarded to Argentina before the junta staged the coup, out of interest?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Was the tournament awarded to Argentina before the junta staged the coup, out of interest?

Yes. They took control in 1976.

 

[Eeyore]

Was the tournament awarded to Argentina before the junta staged the coup, out of interest?

Well, exactly, but an inconvenient statement for many our age who were sucked in by the kits and ticker tape. Not to mention it was held in the Argentinian winter.

Anyone who boycotted that World Cup would have done so comfortably in the knowledge that Scotland won it.

 

[Swansman]

Yes. They took control in 1976.

Well the US-backed junta that was in charge when the World Cup was played was indeed installed in 1976, but there was another military junta (with Ongania as the leader) in charge when they were awarded the cup in 1966.

 

[Weststander]

The irony, I suppose, is that the 1978 World Cup was the most corrupt of all. You and I were probably too young to know it.

It was said that the cries of the tortured prisoners in the facility opposite the main stadium were drowned out by the crowd.

I remember it well for the football, but found out about the murderous junta later.

 

[Eeyore]

Well the US-backed junta that was in charge when the World Cup was played was indeed installed in 1976, but there was another military junta (with Ongania as the leader) in charge when they were awarded the cup in 1966.

There was another US backed Junta in Chile at the time. But we didn't mind them as they helped us out during the Falklands War in 1982.

 

[Swansman]

There was another US backed Junta in Chile at the time. But we didn't mind them as they helped us out during the Falklands War in 1982.

Yes, there was also American-run fascist military dictatorships in Brazil, Ecuador, Bolivia, Paraguay and Uruguay at that time (and then I'm only mentioning the South American ones...). Of course the west didnt mind... just normal American foreign politics: install fascists and kill leftists/socialists and then say "see! socialism doesnt work" and watch all the monkeybrains out there repeat it for generations.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Well, exactly, but an inconvenient statement for many our age who were sucked in by the kits and ticker tape. Not to mention it was held in the Argentinian winter.

Valid points if the reason for not watching is human rights. In purely football terms though Argentina had football heritage which added to the glamour of the tournament.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Any of our boycotting posters doing the same for Englands tour of Pakistan?

 

[Hugo Rune]

There was another US backed Junta in Chile at the time. But we didn't mind them as they helped us out during the Falklands War in 1982.

Indeed. When we were ‘doing business’ with them, they were filling helicopters with socialists, flying them out into the middle of the pacific and dumping them.

 

[goldstone]

This World Cup is just not keeping me interested. Will definitely watch all England's games, but apart from that I've only watched bits and pieces of one or two games. Doesn't have the "WOW" factor.

 

[goldstone]

This may have been posted elsewhere, but can't be bothered to search.

That silly player rating thingy which the BBC has online. Have you noticed that every time a Brighton player appears in a match, even if only as a sub, he gets voted MOM? Is this an NSC campaign?

 

[Eeyore]

Any of our boycotting posters doing the same for Englands tour of Pakistan?

Gary Neville, who I have a lot of time for, gives a good summary.



The tour to Pakistan is a fair point. But the issue of the happening of the tour, and subsequent treatment of workers, is not present.

But I think Neville kind of covers it anyway.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Any of our boycotting posters doing the same for Englands tour of Pakistan?

I’m not boycotting (just a bit bored if it). However, I think this argument is a little unfair on those that are. People choose their own battles and don’t really have to explain themselves. It is not really for us to judge if for instance someone is LGBTQ (or has family or friends who are) and has a particular issue with Qatar as opposed to Pakistan. I think this line of argument on NSC is usually called whataboutery.

 

[Stato]

One seemingly under discussed bit of Fifa lunacy in the awarding of this World Cup to Qatar is legacy. Qatar is the smallest country in terms of both area and population ever to host the World Cup. In area terms the difference is stark. England, the second smallest nation to host is over ten times the size of Qatar's 11,586sqkm.

In population terms the next smallest is Uruguay which currently has a population of approx 3.5 million. Uruguay's tournament was the first ever, held in 1930, had only 13 teams after three withdrew and had 18 matches in 3 venues, all played in Montevideo. This year's has 32 teams and 64 matches. Qatar's current population of 2.8 million increased in size by approx. 69% between the announcement of the World Cup award in 2010 and this year. 88% of it's population is migrant workers.

The country has a football league with two divisions, the top one of which has 12 teams. Average attendances are hard to find, but are reported as being between 2,000 and 10,000 per match. Although what little evidence I can find would suggest this to be an overestimate*. Taking the mean average would suggest that there may be a total of approximately 36,000 people attending each round of six games in the league. (Somewhere near the same number that attend a round of National League fixtures in England). The eight stadiums built to host this tournament can, between them, accommodate over 400,000 people. That is over ten times the number of people currently attending football.

Reasons given for fans not attending matches include climate, lack of time, unsuitable atmospheres for females and the presence of paid fans. The latter factor reported by 69% of respondents in a 2014 Qatari Government survey suggests that, among the tiny number of fans attending, there are a significant number doing so because they were being paid to. https://web.archive.org/web/2015100...re-reluctant-attend-football-matches-stadiums. Presumably this practice, if still in operation will cease after the World Cup is over.

Qatar's government has, during a climate crisis, built eight massive white elephants and the accompanying infrastructure to be used just for this World Cup. This is what happened to one of Brazil's stadiums built for 2014: https://www.businessinsider.com/300-million-world-cup-stadium-is-nearly-abandoned-2018-6?r=US&IR=T. This is in Brazil's seventh largest city, that has a population of over 2 million. After the World Cup is over and a lot of the migrant workers do not have reason to remain, Qatar's population could revert to a similar number as Manuas' and they will have 8 (eight) of these stadiums.

Making mention of the National League brings to mind Darlington, who are now 13th in the National League North twenty years after George Reynolds said that they would be making the Premier League within 5 years. The stadium that Reynolds saddled them with is now the home to the local rugby club:



This World Cup was, in effect, awarded to George Reynolds and when it is over, the Fifa travelling circus will move on and leave Qatar looking like a nineties teenage old fooball fan had gone crazy on Sim City. Mind you, the current state of the world often makes me think that somewhere there is a teenager who has started sending in floods, fires, hurricanes, Brexit, Trump, Putin, Covid etc. because he's become bored with his world-making video game.

* - One Twitter user reports last's season's average attendance as 672, which would be about a seventh of the number attending National League games and a hundreth of the capacity now available.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

To me, the world cup has done the exact opposite of Sportswashing. It's brought into light things about Qatar that I was not overly aware of.

Sports-mucked?

 

[Stato]

Gary Neville, who I have a lot of time for, gives a good summary.



The tour to Pakistan is a fair point. But the issue of the happening of the tour, and subsequent treatment of workers, is not present.

But I think Neville kind of covers it anyway.

Neville makes a lot of salient points and I agree with a lot of what he says about the double standards. However, I had a giggle whilst listening to him speak for so long without hardly a pause for breath, because in the back of my mind, I could just hear Jaap Stam reiterating his infamous description of him and his brother.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I’m not boycotting (just a bit bored if it). However, I think this argument is a little unfair on those that are. People choose their own battles and don’t really have to explain themselves. It is not really for us to judge if for instance someone is LGBTQ (or has family or friends who are) and has a particular issue with Qatar as opposed to Pakistan. I think this line of argument on NSC is usually called whataboutery.

Pakistan treat the LGBT+ community appallingly - I think it is a fair question to ask why there isn't such uproar over a tour there, is it due to it not being as trendy ?

 

[drew]

One seemingly under discussed bit of Fifa lunacy in the awarding of this World Cup to Qatar is legacy. Qatar is the smallest country in terms of both area and population ever to host the World Cup. In area terms the difference is stark. England, the second smallest nation to host is over ten times the size of Qatar's 11,586sqkm.

In population terms the next smallest is Uruguay which currently has a population of approx 3.5 million. Uruguay's tournament was the first ever, held in 1930, had only 13 teams after three withdrew and had 18 matches in 3 venues, all played in Montevideo. This year's has 32 teams and 64 matches. Qatar's current population of 2.8 million increased in size by approx. 69% between the announcement of the World Cup award in 2010 and this year. 88% of it's population is migrant workers.

The country has a football league with two divisions, the top one of which has 12 teams. Average attendances are hard to find, but are reported as being between 2,000 and 10,000 per match. Although what little evidence I can find would suggest this to be an overestimate*. Taking the mean average would suggest that there may be a total of approximately 36,000 people attending each round of six games in the league. (Somewhere near the same number that attend a round of National League fixtures in England). The eight stadiums built to host this tournament can, between them, accommodate over 400,000 people. That is over ten times the number of people currently attending football.

Reasons given for fans not attending matches include climate, lack of time, unsuitable atmospheres for females and the presence of paid fans. The latter factor reported by 69% of respondents in a 2014 Qatari Government survey suggests that, among the tiny number of fans attending, there are a significant number doing so because they were being paid to. https://web.archive.org/web/2015100...re-reluctant-attend-football-matches-stadiums. Presumably this practice, if still in operation will cease after the World Cup is over.

Qatar's government has, during a climate crisis, built eight massive white elephants and the accompanying infrastructure to be used just for this World Cup. This is what happened to one of Brazil's stadiums built for 2014: https://www.businessinsider.com/300-million-world-cup-stadium-is-nearly-abandoned-2018-6?r=US&IR=T. This is in Brazil's seventh largest city, that has a population of over 2 million. After the World Cup is over and a lot of the migrant workers do not have reason to remain, Qatar's population could revert to a similar number as Manuas' and they will have 8 (eight) of these stadiums.

Making mention of the National League brings to mind Darlington, who are now 13th in the National League North twenty years after George Reynolds said that they would be making the Premier League within 5 years. The stadium that Reynolds saddled them with is now the home to the local rugby club:



This World Cup was, in effect, awarded to George Reynolds and when it is over, the Fifa travelling circus will move on and leave Qatar looking like a nineties teenage old fooball fan had gone crazy on Sim City. Mind you, the current state of the world often makes me think that somewhere there is a teenager who has started sending in floods, fires, hurricanes, Brexit, Trump, Putin, Covid etc. because he's become bored with his world-making video game.

* - One Twitter user reports last's season's average attendance as 672, which would be about a seventh of the number attending National League games and a hundreth of the capacity now available.

At the end of the day, Qatar wanted to sportswash so they bought the world cup. They did it buy spending and investing in those countries whose votes they needed. Whether some Fifa officials trousered some dosh, who knows, we can only speculate. Why Platini decided this was the best place we'll never know.

Having said all that, Qatar might now be regretting putting themselves in the spotlight and all the attention is has brought regarding their 'laws'.

 

[drew]

I’m not boycotting (just a bit bored if it). However, I think this argument is a little unfair on those that are. People choose their own battles and don’t really have to explain themselves. It is not really for us to judge if for instance someone is LGBTQ (or has family or friends who are) and has a particular issue with Qatar as opposed to Pakistan. I think this line of argument on NSC is usually called whataboutery.

You're right, they don't need to explain themselves but doesn't that go out the window as soon as they announce they are boycotting on a public forum! And once they have made a moral stand it's only fair that they can be challenged about other similar situations and whether they are consistant?