[Albion] Who will lead the EPL fightback against the Super League?

[Blue3]

The promoters of the new super league will be shaking in their boots at the thought of this happening - not! Money talks - and that'll be the only voice they hear!

Probably true but somthing has to done

 

[Lethargic]

One major question is why do people watch football, I'm talking about the cash cows sat on their sofas here not real fans, is it to watch a club or to watch the competition, for me a league of the same 12 teams will soon become soulless and empty, whether I supported one of the teams or not. I think there would be a initial high but as it settles down will people continue to watch or pay their subscriptions more importantly. I think this league will end up a bit WWE ie sports entertainment rather than a sport and eat itself.

Although this is deplorable I am hoping that in the long term this is a reset for football where it is not solely driven by money, but football and particularly the governing bodies have a way of kicking me in the nads.

 

[father_and_son]

But if FIFA do hold their threat of players playing in ESL not playing internationally, or not being registered by FIFA, would we be able to sell to those clubs?

Point 1... FIFA do not have the greatest track record of putting moral standards ahead of cold, hard cash. So, would I expect them to camp on the moral high ground over this? No.
Point 2... The only real loser here is UEFA and their CL product. But UEFA are just one voice within FIFA that FIFA have made it very clear doesn't matter too much to them. So would I expect UEFA to have any leverage? No

But... even if FIFA were to suddenly change their DNA and not follow the money, the ESL would desperately need the best talent in football to maintain their [self-declared] position at the top of the tower. Some players would choose not to sacrifice their international careers but most follow the lead of FIFA in putting cash ahead of morals and so yes... We would still do deals where players "transitioned" between the two differing registration bodies with the help of lots and lots of money for everyone involved.

There are plenty of European laws that stop unfair restrictions on people plying their trade (provided its legal) and FIFA would not be able to stop anyone crossing into the ESL (albeit, they may be able to stop them coming back).

 

[smeariestbat]

But if FIFA do hold their threat of players playing in ESL not playing internationally, or not being registered by FIFA, would we be able to sell to those clubs?

If I dont think Fifa would be allowed to ban the sale of players due to european trade laws...

They can threaten all they like, but there’s only so far they can legally go before encroaching on those players human and workers rights.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Let them go, insist they go, maintain the banning from international football.

But if FIFA do hold their threat of players playing in ESL not playing internationally, or not being registered by FIFA, would we be able to sell to those clubs?

Banning from international football is such a non-starter, no-one should hang anything on it it. There's only one federation that cares at the moment, UEFA, and there's only three countries currently impacted, with some others bothered by the CL implications.

But you try and ban Messi from the World Cup, and expect Argentina to shrug their shoulders? Or force Brazil to play without Ederson, Thiago, Firmino, Danilo, Arthur, Jesus?

And then expect the sponsors to be happy there is no Ronaldo, de Bruyne, Hazard, Kane, Benzema, Ramos, Modric, Dybala, Jorginho, Kroos, Salah, Griezman, van Dijk, Sterling, Suarez, Son, Pogba, Lukaku, Casemiro and so on?

Nah...

 

[father_and_son]

One major question is why do people watch football, I'm talking about the cash cows sat on their sofas here not real fans, is it to watch a club or to watch the competition, for me a league of the same 12 teams will soon become soulless and empty, whether I supported one of the teams or not. I think there would be a initial high but as it settles down will people continue to watch or pay their subscriptions more importantly. I think this league will end up a bit WWE ie sports entertainment rather than a sport and eat itself.

Although this is deplorable I am hoping that in the long term this is a reset for football where it is not solely driven by money, but football and particularly the governing bodies have a way of kicking me in the nads.

I get what you mean, but this is American businessmen trying to recreate a lucrative American sports model. I would say that 99.9% of non-US consumers of US sports do not follow teams outside of NFL, NBA or MLB. In fact, I'd suggest 99% couldn't name a team in each of the 3 sports who aren't in one of those leagues. This will be a franchise model where teams who, may previously have been English or Italian, will relocate not just to another city (Mk Dons) but to another country because the local connection will be broken and a stadium filled with whoever lives in the new city - not that 100k attending a game mean anything against the 100m watching on TV.

I think this is the reset and I think it will eat itself, but I can see where its heading in the meantime and it isn't based on 100+ years of English footballing history with close ties to the local population and culture. The Boston Manchester Uniteds here we come.

 

[Napper]

some interesting theories of how it could go above.

Suspect money wins. You will end up a with a super league but these clubs will still be in the premier league , miles ahead of everyone ( the way its going anyway ) .

The biggest hit will be clubs like ours who wont really have anything to aim for anymore ( and the fans of course )

 

[beorhthelm]

If I dont think Fifa would be allowed to ban the sale of players due to european trade laws...

They can threaten all they like, but there’s only so far they can legally go before encroaching on those players human and workers rights.

there are tons of other sports and other professions where registration under one authority limits options to work under another. FIFA could restrict players not under their registration system from playing in their structures. no restraint of trade or rights broken as its the players choice.

 

[Lethargic]

I get what you mean, but this is American businessmen trying to recreate a lucrative American sports model. I would say that 99.9% of non-US consumers of US sports do not follow teams outside of NFL, NBA or MLB. In fact, I'd suggest 99% couldn't name a team in each of the 3 sports who aren't in one of those leagues. This will be a franchise model where teams who, may previously have been English or Italian, will relocate not just to another city (Mk Dons) but to another country because the local connection will be broken and a stadium filled with whoever lives in the new city - not that 100k attending a game mean anything against the 100m watching on TV.

I think this is the reset and I think it will eat itself, but I can see where its heading in the meantime and it isn't based on 100+ years of English footballing history with close ties to the local population and culture. The Boston Manchester Uniteds here we come.

I see your point but as you say it's a very American model which has not really worked overseas, we saw some success with American Football but never big time football already has a market larger than the USA and if they go down this path by moving Franchise to the States then I believe most of the rest of the world will switch off.

Fully agree with you second statement a few years of shite but hopefully the remaining teams/leagues can sort their house out to reset here.

 

[smeariestbat]

there are tons of other sports and other professions where registration under one authority limits options to work under another. FIFA could restrict players not under their registration system from playing in their structures. no restraint of trade or rights broken as its the players choice.

In which case more power too them

 

[father_and_son]

I see your point but as you say it's a very American model which has not really worked overseas, we saw some success with American Football but never big time football already has a market larger than the USA and if they go down this path by moving Franchise to the States then I believe most of the rest of the world will switch off.

Fully agree with you second statement a few years of shite but hopefully the remaining teams/leagues can sort their house out to reset here.

The Americans tried to sell MLS to the world and no one bought it because European clubs are bigger, better and have all the international appeal already. So why not go out and buy those European clubs and just form a new league and own that instead?!

I used Boston Manchester United as an example, but I do think they will be playing the Kuala Lumpur Chelseas and Arsenal Beijing in the years to come. This is how it will stop the Asians (because lets not kid ourselves, Asia is the *only* market that matters right now) switching off.

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

Well - the PL title race is now between Leicester and West Ham - the remaining CL spots currently filled by Everton and Leeds

Sheff Utd get a reprieve as the the PL announce that there will be no relegation this season. Six teams will now be promoted from the Championship with the top four, Norwich, Watford, Swansea and Brentford currently in the automatic promotion spots with Bournemouth, Barnsley, Reading, Cardiff, Millwall, QPR, Middlesbrough, Stoke, and Luton currently in the play-off spots for the last two places.

Sevilla are romping away with La Liga with Villarreal, Betis and Sociedad currently in the top four. In Italy, Atalanta lead Napoli by 4 points while Lazio are two points further back and Roma 10 points behind the leaders.

 

[Doonhamer7]

Gartside I suspect from Bolton, he will lead the "why aren't we involved protest" as he didn't want relegation from the Premier League a while back

Seeing he died in 2016, he may struggle with saying anything

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

I get what you mean, but this is American businessmen trying to recreate a lucrative American sports model. I would say that 99.9% of non-US consumers of US sports do not follow teams outside of NFL, NBA or MLB. In fact, I'd suggest 99% couldn't name a team in each of the 3 sports who aren't in one of those leagues. This will be a franchise model where teams who, may previously have been English or Italian, will relocate not just to another city (Mk Dons) but to another country because the local connection will be broken and a stadium filled with whoever lives in the new city - not that 100k attending a game mean anything against the 100m watching on TV.

I think this is the reset and I think it will eat itself, but I can see where its heading in the meantime and it isn't based on 100+ years of English footballing history with close ties to the local population and culture. The Boston Manchester Uniteds here we come.

I agree - this is driven by the likes of -

- the Galzers, who also own the Tampa Bay Bucs,

- Fenway who also own the Boston Red Sox (also a NASCAR team, multiple other farm teams, and regional sports network),

- Kroenke who also own the LA Rams (who have moved several times), the Denver Nuggets (NBA), the Colorado Rockies (MLB), the Colorado Avalanche (NHL), numerous other teams, sports facilities, sports networks and radio stations,

- ENIC who also have stakes in Rangers, Slavia Prague, AEK Athens, Vicenza and FC Basel,

- Elliot Management

- the Agnellis

- With the Sheikh and the Russian Oligarch along for the ride.

The surprising inclusion is Real Madrid and even more so, Barcelona, which are both membership clubs - particularly Barcelona as the fans would be strident opponents of capitalist domination of football.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I get what you mean, but this is American businessmen trying to recreate a lucrative American sports model. I would say that 99.9% of non-US consumers of US sports do not follow teams outside of NFL, NBA or MLB. In fact, I'd suggest 99% couldn't name a team in each of the 3 sports who aren't in one of those leagues. This will be a franchise model where teams who, may previously have been English or Italian, will relocate not just to another city (Mk Dons) but to another country because the local connection will be broken and a stadium filled with whoever lives in the new city - not that 100k attending a game mean anything against the 100m watching on TV.

I think this is the reset and I think it will eat itself, but I can see where its heading in the meantime and it isn't based on 100+ years of English footballing history with close ties to the local population and culture. The Boston Manchester Uniteds here we come.

Of course the American model only works with the prospect draft, team salary caps, long fixed-term&salary contracts and player trading, all of which (save caps) seem impossible to implement in a european football context. But those three things mean that all clubs are able to compete on a rolling cycle. Without them only a few teams would ever be in a position to compete

 

[amexer]

Maybe wrong but I think rugby union players dont get selected for England if they sign for a French club

 

[Jim in the West]

Well - the PL title race is now between Leicester and West Ham - the remaining CL spots currently filled by Everton and Leeds

Sheff Utd get a reprieve as the the PL announce that there will be no relegation this season. Six teams will now be promoted from the Championship with the top four, Norwich, Watford, Swansea and Brentford currently in the automatic promotion spots with Bournemouth, Barnsley, Reading, Cardiff, Millwall, QPR, Middlesbrough, Stoke, and Luton currently in the play-off spots for the last two places.

Sevilla are romping away with La Liga with Villarreal, Betis and Sociedad currently in the top four. In Italy, Atalanta lead Napoli by 4 points while Lazio are two points further back and Roma 10 points behind the leaders.

Betis have already updated the La Liga table on their website to exclude Real, Barca and Atletico.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

Maybe wrong but I think rugby union players dont get selected for England if they sign for a French club

I believe it goes further than that and anyone playing their club rugby outside of England is not selected, I think New Zealand are the only other country to follow this self imposed rule. England RU adopted the policy in 2011 to try and keep the best players playing for English sides rather than chasing money abroad.

 

[amexer]

I believe it goes further than that and anyone playing their club rugby outside of England is not selected, I think New Zealand are the only other country to follow this self imposed rule. England RU adopted the policy in 2011 to try and keep the best players playing for English sides rather than chasing money abroad.

Good that proves legally possible. I hope EFA make it clear they will do that and would think it would have full backing of supporters.

 

[Acker79]

Why would it drop to Championship levels??

PL would still be the premium footballing product from the UK, so domestically still the main draw for Sky/BT subscriptions and internationally would only drop to second place - less money but not "go bust" low.

But the premier league is only the main draw because it is where the world's biggest English teams play. Sky/BT pay a premium because it gives them access to Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal, Tottenham, Chelsea, Man City. If they spend £10Bs to get the rights for those teams with the ESL, they've got their main draw right there. A premier league full of #teamslike Burnley, Brighton, Barnsley, Fulham, Norwich are not going to draw another £10Bs deal just because it's the biggest domestic league.

It's naive to think sky and BT are paying for it simply because it's the top division. There's a reason for the bias towards the big six in their coverage - it's what the audience want, that is where their audience interest lay. Those of us who want to see more coverage of our own teams are in the minority.