[Politics] Which British Prime Minister had the most profund effect on your life?

[Blue3]

Wrong. I could've just used my passport until recently but visas are now required to live and work in Europe just in case that small point passed you by.

I assume It will be affecting my cousin and her family as they work Monday to Friday one in Malta and two in Paris flying home at weekends to their Uk homes obviously Covid has restricted much of this but how this will work for them moving forward must be a worry

 

[beorhthelm]

I think this is a good place to mention that the Thatcher practice of defunding and crippling an entity to ensure it fails, to make privatisation more palatable, has not gone away.

its amazing how someone long dead is still apparently controlling policy.

 

[Baldseagull]

Gosh, you must have a Masters in hindsight?

I am struggling to find anything in the list that could only be seen with hindsight, and not foresight.

 

[Baldseagull]

its amazing how someone long dead is still apparently controlling policy.

Just a policy borrowed from her time, it doesn't mean her ghost is controlling it, any more than Goebbels was running the Brexit campaign, there was just a lot of borrowing of his methods.

 

[beorhthelm]

Just a policy borrowed from her time, it doesn't mean her ghost is controlling it, any more than Goebbels was running the Brexit campaign, there was just a lot of borrowing of his methods.

well done, you Godwin'd the thread.

 

[WATFORD zero]

He was late introducing lockdowns (3 times)
Didn't prioritise Carehomes
Late introducing testing
Late introducing quarantine for entries to the UK
Still waiting for a working track and trace
Put out numerous contracts out to suppliers with no history of anything except links to his Government
Put early orders in for vaccines

He decided to campaign to Leave the EU purely for his own career
He decided to push ahead with it in the middle of a Pandemic
He introduced a border between NI and the rest of the UK
He negotiated a 'deal' that is unimplementable
He has no plan for getting us out of this unsustainable position that he has now put us in
The economy continues to crash as a result of his deal
The economic impact of what he has done hasn't even started
Has just pushed through a law to allow us to trade with countries undertaking genocide (last night)

Gosh, you must have a Masters in hindsight?

I guess that if you totally ignore what the WTO were saying, other governments were doing and Sage were advising, like Johnson did, you may be able to make a case for hindsight for 2 out of the first 3 (maybe, if you think Johnson was right despite any evidence to the contrary, all 3).

But the rest of the list required no absolutely no hindsight whatsoever

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I am sorry but what you have written above is quite simply factually incorrect. We negotiated the deal with AZ whilst still operating under the rules and regulations of the EU. Exactly the same as Hungary, a full EU member who did and continue to do the same.

There is no doubt that the EU have cocked up badly on vaccines, but leaving the EU has had no effect on the UK's ability to order vaccines independently. This the third time this has been pointed out in the last couple of pages of posts. To state otherwise is quite simply a lie

Equally what you have written is at best misleading.

All EU members - and the UK as we were in the transition stage - were given the option to sign up to the centralised EU bargaining function. We didn't and went our own way but all the EU members did. The EU then arranged, very slowly, deals with the two main manufacturers - Pfizer and Astra Zeneca. From that point the members that signed up - i.e. ALL of them - couldn't do their own deals with those two specific manufacturers. Hungary signed up but the deals they have done have been with the Russian and Chinese vaccine companies - not Pfizer and Astra Zeneca. Now feel free to pop over to Hungary and have one of those vaccines but I know I wouldn't risk them.

The only fly in the ointment for the EU is that Germany has independently purchased 300k vaccines - something a number of other member states have challenged but when the EU were asked ( by The Guardian among others ) if it was against the rules their response was "No Comment" .... hardly surprising that the EU wouldn't want to put its most powerful member ( and highest funder ) in the frame for breaking the rules.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Equally what you have written is at best misleading.

All EU members - and the UK as we were in the transition stage - were given the option to sign up to the centralised EU bargaining function. We didn't and went our own way but all the EU members did. The EU then arranged, very slowly, deals with the two main manufacturers - Pfizer and Astra Zeneca. From that point the members that signed up - i.e. ALL of them - couldn't do their own deals with those two specific manufacturers. Hungary signed up but the deals they have done have been with the Russian and Chinese vaccine companies - not Pfizer and Astra Zeneca. Now feel free to pop over to Hungary and have one of those vaccines but I know I wouldn't risk them.

The only fly in the ointment for the EU is that Germany has independently purchased 300k vaccines - something a number of other member states have challenged but when the EU were asked ( by The Guardian among others ) if it was against the rules their response was "No Comment" .... hardly surprising that the EU wouldn't want to put its most powerful member ( and highest funder ) in the frame for breaking the rules.

But what I wrote is factually correct, so I can't see how it can possibly be misleading. Brexit had absolutely no effect on our ability to do what we've done and nothing you have written above changes that

(shouldn't we be having this discussion of the Brexit thread ? I've copied this post over, so we can continue there )

 

[Tokyohands]

I assume It will be affecting my cousin and her family as they work Monday to Friday one in Malta and two in Paris flying home at weekends to their Uk homes obviously Covid has restricted much of this but how this will work for them moving forward must be a worry

Ugh that does sound messy. I believe it won't affect you if you were living and working in the EU prior to December 2020 so they should be OK? I don't know the details for their situation I'm afraid but not having the option to easily be able to live and work there is bloody annoying for me, as I was hoping to do so and hoping my kids would be able to do so at some point in the future, even if it was just for us in retirement. Still, life's good over here so I'll enjoy what I have and wish your cousins family all the best with it.

 

[highflyer]

its amazing how someone long dead is still apparently controlling policy.

You don't think her legacy lives on and is directly impacting our lives?

Attlee is long dead, but I think the creation of the NHS has some bearing on how we live our lives today?

Of course, it's never just one individual - these are figureheads for much larger groups of people working together to advnce specific ideas and ideologies. So talking about the influence of Thatcher is just shorthand for talking about the influence of the major shift in politics and culture that she was one part of. There were many many other total ********s involved in making that happen!

 

[beorhthelm]

You don't think her legacy lives on and is directly impacting our lives?

of course it does. theres a difference between legacy and claims of direct policy.

and its not even true, an imagined policy when health funding goes up every year.

 

[highflyer]

of course it does. theres a difference between legacy and claims of direct policy.

and its not even true, an imagined policy when health funding goes up every year.

'direct policy' isn't developed and passed in a vacuum.

The Overton Window dictates what can, and cannot, be considered and what is likely to pass through the process of creating legislation.

Thatcher (and cohorts) shifted the Overton Window on economic policy, and that has yet to come back to anywhere near where it was before her reign. It has, finally, started to shift though in last few years and this pandemic has thrown politics up in the air. We don't yet know how the pieces will fall but I doubt we'll go back to where we were
.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

There have been some interesting posts on this thread but nearly all of them have assumed that it's title was "Who is your favourite prime minister?" or possibly "Which prime minister do you hate the most?"

It was neither of those things so I will stick with my original thought that the PM who had the most profound effect on my life was probably Churchill. Attlee (a crucial contributor to Churchill's wartime achievements incidentally) comes second, Thatcher is in there too as is B. Johnson.

 

[maffew]

Milk Snatcher for sure.

Followed by Cameron/Boris

 

[e77]

Another way of looking at it is Thatcher succeeded under her own terms. Same could probably be said of Blair and certainly neither ever lost a General Election.

Cameron wanted to stay in the EU but held a referendum to settle an argument in the Conservative party, lost and it cost him his job. Regardless of your views on Brexit that is fairly poor politics by him.

Too early to say for Boris Johnson. Will need a bit of perspective that only time can bring if the success of the vaccination wipes away the memory of his early dithering.

 

[Rovert_Fugazi]

Thatcher/Major bankrupted us and made us homeless, but for the help of Sanctuary Housing Association.

 

[nicko31]

Did someone, somewhere, say he personally introduced Covid

He was late introducing lockdowns (3 times)
Late introducing testing
Didn't prioritise Carehomes
Late introducing quarantine for entries to the UK
Still waiting for a working track and trace
Put out numerous contracts out to suppliers with no history of anything except links to his Government
Put early orders in for vaccines

He decided to campaign to Leave the EU purely for his own career
He decided to push ahead with it in the middle of a Pandemic
He introduced a border between NI and the rest of the UK
He negotiated a 'deal' that is unimplementable
He has no plan for getting us out of this unsustainable position that he has now put us in
The economy continues to crash as a result of his deal
The economic impact of what he has done hasn't even started
Has just pushed through a law to allow us to trade with countries undertaking genocide (last night)

You're right though, he didn't personally introduce Covid

But then again, no surprise you're backing him in your post.

Blair had his moments, so did Thatcher but....

Johnson will be a scar on this country for decades to come and the final reckoning could well be the break up of the UK, Brexit may not end up being his legacy after all

He was always going to be a disaster, its just very very unfortunate that he happened to be at the helm when Covid came along.

But when a country endorses a serial liar don't expect a happy ending...

 

[SeagullDubai]

Tory all the way for me, doesn't matter which one. Has allowed me to own my own home, work for myself, tell unions to go stuff themselves and has put food on the table without being told by socialists to share. It's all about me and my family you see, I don't want community or to be part of the greater good. I'll shop where I like, when I like and buy what I like. I don't give handouts nor would I expect them.
Righto, that should be just enough water thrown on the hot oil to see a few heads explode

But you still live in Coldean


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[SeagullDubai]

But what is the gap between the very rich and the very poor. Don't remember food banks back in the 70s!!

Not to mention the increase in the homeless and kids relying on free school meals. People will believe their own fantasies.


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[Jeremiah]

Winston Churchill - without him I probably wouldn't exist .