What is more important to you: fan affordability or reaching Premier League?

[BadFish]

Speaking personally, I absolutely loved the romance of going batshit at Cheltenham because we'd just equalised to 2-2. I go along for a day of football, I drink, I have a laugh with my mates and that is number 1, the football is a distant second to this. I'd rather be able to go and have a laugh a with my mates and watch my us get shafted than us be top of the league all season but me not be able to afford to go to any matches. Just my view innit. Ultimately if prices continue on their current trajectory I'll have to find a new team to follow lower down the pyramid, I wouldn't want to do this but it might be my only option if I want to continue actually attending football matches. But if I was driven to this I certainly wouldn't be returning when the club is struggling at some point, the club should be trying to hang on to people like me happy to attend through thick and thin not drive me out in preference to some rich banker who will **** off back to Stamford Bridge after a single poor season, because when people like me are gone, and they are gone then the club really will be in trouble.

Also, teams in this league like Barnsley have a turnover well below ours but have survived in this league for years, you seem to think we need to break the bank every season or it's not worth it.

Absolutely agree. It is not the game I miss now I cannot watch the albion. It is everything around the football, the day out, the laughs and the atmosphere. I can get a small part of that with AFL but it is not the same. On a purely selfish level i would prefer us to be in the Premier League as it would mean I would get to watch more games. However I think that it is far more important to keep and remember fans like your good self and make sure we don't lose them to other clubs. We, the fans are the clubs identity and it is we , the fans who will keep this club going when times are tough.

 

[BadFish]

And that's my point. Like I posted every thing you do in way of entertainment costs a lot of money. Go to one of the top theme parks and its bloody expensive instead go to the local park and it might even be free. Your choice. However if you wish to go to one of the top football matches in the country then expect to pay in line with other top attractions

Expecting it doesn't make it right though does it?

Players wages are outrageous by anyone's standard. Ticket prices are too high. If one comes down then the other comes down too. I would like to see MY club make a decision about what they can reasonably expect supporters (grass roots supporters, the ones that saved the club, the ones who will still be going when we are shit and need some loyalty) to pay. Then I would like them to work out what, based on all available income we can afford to pay in wages whilst still breaking even. Then I would like us to show the rest of the football world how the game should be run and provide a model that does not drive proper supporters away to form your FC Uniteds and does not drive clubs into the ground. If this means that we stay in the championship for years or even drop down the leagues it matters not to me. By far the most important thing to me is that the club is run correctly. IF we have to do this in the face of other clubs flouting Financial fair Play regulations and gambling administration on getting to the Premier League, so be it. All I care about is the MY club being run properly for the fans and for the community, not as a business but as a football club. We are Brighton and Hove Albion FC not Brighton and Hove Albion PLC.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Expecting it doesn't make it right though does it?

Players wages are outrageous by anyone's standard. Ticket prices are too high. If one comes down then the other comes down too. I would like to see MY club make a decision about what they can reasonably expect supporters (grass roots supporters, the ones that saved the club, the ones who will still be going when we are shit and need some loyalty) to pay. Then I would like them to work out what, based on all available income we can afford to pay in wages whilst still breaking even. Then I would like us to show the rest of the football world how the game should be run and provide a model that does not drive proper supporters away to form your FC Uniteds and does not drive clubs into the ground. If this means that we stay in the championship for years or even drop down the leagues it matters not to me. By far the most important thing to me is that the club is run correctly. IF we have to do this in the face of other clubs flouting Financial fair Play regulations and gambling administration on getting to the Premier League, so be it. All I care about is the MY club being run properly for the fans and for the community, not as a business but as a football club. We are Brighton and Hove Albion FC not Brighton and Hove Albion PLC.

Players wages are too high leading to the debts nearly all the clubs are in but as I've posted in relation to other forms of live entertainment it really isn't expensive.

The decision about what's reasonable to pay has been made, we're sold out most weeks!!! Pay less in wages, get relegated, get less income, pay less, get relegated and go on until we go bust! Bloom can not do it.

Oh and afraid to say we are customers of Brighton & Hove Albion FC Ltd owned by private individuals. We support the product of the ltd company, the football team, it's called reality. The product we wish to see comes at a cost, that cost has been subsidised by one single individual for a number of years now, who has provided a new stadium, a training centre for his employees to hopefully become a better product. To continue in this progression and under a set of new regulations he is not allowed to continue he frittering away of his own money. In time perhaps there will be a lowering of expectations from the employees regarding their salaries, who knows. Those that wish to support this will continue, those that feel they can't will drift away.

Why not show your disgust at every game by booing the overpaid players that represent your team? No thought not, but it is they who are bleeding the clubs dry or perhaps our expectation of success.

 

[BadFish]

Players wages are too high leading to the debts nearly all the clubs are in but as I've posted in relation to other forms of live entertainment it really isn't expensive.

The decision about what's reasonable to pay has been made, we're sold out most weeks!!! Pay less in wages, get relegated, get less income, pay less, get relegated and go on until we go bust! Bloom can not do it.

Oh and afraid to say we are customers of Brighton & Hove Albion FC Ltd owned by private individuals. We support the product of the ltd company, the football team, it's called reality. The product we wish to see comes at a cost, that cost has been subsidised by one single individual for a number of years now, who has provided a new stadium, a training centre for his employees to hopefully become a better product. To continue in this progression and under a set of new regulations he is not allowed to continue he frittering away of his own money. In time perhaps there will be a lowering of expectations from the employees regarding their salaries, who knows. Those that wish to support this will continue, those that feel they can't will drift away.

Why not show your disgust at every game by booing the overpaid players that represent your team? No thought not, but it is they who are bleeding the clubs dry or perhaps our expectation of success.

I think it id folly for a football club to allow fans that have fought for it and are loyal to it to walk away because on eday they might just need that loyalty and passion again.

I accept your reality, however I disagree with it and would like it to be different. I would also like our club to do things differently to other clubs just because it is the right way to do things. Currently I don't think games are too expensive and I don't think we are paying our players too much.

I haveh no disgust about our players wages and don't go to games. My disgust is with the wages top players earn across europe and don't really follow this part of the game because of it. Because of this i don't want Brighton to 'sell out' in order to join the elite. German teams seem to manage to be in the elite while still providing affordable tickets, why can't we?

 

[countryman]

Being affordable is more important then success. What would be the point in watching us become successful if we can't afford to watch us when we are successful.

I don't care if we make a big money signing or not. As long as the team goes out on that pitch every week and puts their all in then I'll be happy.

And ffp should not be the clubs excuse to charge more. It should be their incentive to cut their costs.

 

[Brian Fantana]

The aim of the game is to be as successful on the pitch as possible. Lose sight of that and we may as well pack up now.

Obviously, it would be a shame if a large number of supporters were priced out of attending games (I certainly don't have a bottomless reserve of cash to spend on the Albion), but we should keep aspiring for the top flight, IMHO.

 

[BadFish]

The aim of the game is to be as successful on the pitch as possible. Lose sight of that and we may as well pack up now.

Obviously, it would be a shame if a large number of supporters were priced out of attending games (I certainly don't have a bottomless reserve of cash to spend on the Albion), but we should keep aspiring for the top flight, IMHO.

I agree but i think we should try and get there AND take all our fans with us.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I think it id folly for a football club to allow fans that have fought for it and are loyal to it to walk away because on eday they might just need that loyalty and passion again.

I accept your reality, however I disagree with it and would like it to be different. I would also like our club to do things differently to other clubs just because it is the right way to do things. Currently I don't think games are too expensive and I don't think we are paying our players too much.

But its fantasy to believe the club can act in any other way.

All of us that fought for the club did so in the belief one day we would have a new ground back in Sussex. We succeeded but along with that come expectation. We exceeded that expectation whilst losing huge sums of money at Withdean. Our very existence was again in doubt when the delays in getting Falmer dragged on.

If the owners of the club at the time decided to build a much smaller ground in keeping with perhaps a less visionary expectation, the vast majority of our supporters would have been horrified at the lack of ambition. A small ground capable of being a L1/L2 ground infinitum would have been seen as disastrous. Instead the board proposed to build a large state of the art unique ground showing huge ambition. This has been vindicated by the need to expand almost immediately.

A lot of the "cost" forgetting TB has been met by the sponsorship deals the club has negotiated since moving to the Amex. Without this our costs would be much much higher. It shouldn't be forgotten that all the extra sponsorship/corporate/non match day events effectively subsidise our match day prices. Without all the extras the expectation from many of us supporters would still be the same. This would result in higher prices or lower expectations.

 

[BadFish]

But its fantasy to believe the club can act in any other way.

All of us that fought for the club did so in the belief one day we would have a new ground back in Sussex. We succeeded but along with that come expectation. We exceeded that expectation whilst losing huge sums of money at Withdean. Our very existence was again in doubt when the delays in getting Falmer dragged on.

If the owners of the club at the time decided to build a much smaller ground in keeping with perhaps a less visionary expectation, the vast majority of our supporters would have been horrified at the lack of ambition. A small ground capable of being a L1/L2 ground infinitum would have been seen as disastrous. Instead the board proposed to build a large state of the art unique ground showing huge ambition. This has been vindicated by the need to expand almost immediately.

A lot of the "cost" forgetting TB has been met by the sponsorship deals the club has negotiated since moving to the Amex. Without this our costs would be much much higher. It shouldn't be forgotten that all the extra sponsorship/corporate/non match day events effectively subsidise our match day prices. Without all the extras the expectation from many of us supporters would still be the same. This would result in higher prices or lower expectations.

It is not fantasy. In my opinion the club should make it policy to consider the price of tickets when setting their budgets and not allow fans to be priced out in favour or new fans who are prepared to pay more (the germans seem to be enjoying success based on a similar philosphy). Once this philosophy is in place and a pledge taken to put the fans and the health of the club at the top of our priorities then we can see how far we can go. Withour crowds, facilities and chairman i don't see why we can't go far and keep our loyal fans coming to the amex. After all they/you/we deserve it.

To be honest i think we are discussing at cross purposes here. You are looking at how to succeed in the current reality of football and you are quite right. I am hoping that the club try something a little different and acknowledge the work of the fans over the last 15 years.

 

[The Birdman]

I am on the fence on this one If we are in premiership I could always sell my ticket for some games I can't make and that would subsidise the season ticket however I don't want silly prices but I know we would have to spend more for premiership. It's all about the quality we are watching .

 

[Wozza]

We're cheaper than you
We're cheaper than yoooooooou
We're Brighton & Hove Albion
We're cheaper than you!

(Um, Premier League for me)

 

[dougdeep]

This has to be one of the best threads for quite a while on NSC. There have been some very good points made. The club can never please everyone on this matter but hopefully someone there will remember that if it wasn't for fans campaigning and spending hours of their own time fighting for the cause, there would be no Amex.

 

[drew]

I think it is folly for a football club to allow fans that have fought for it and are loyal to it to walk away because on eday they might just need that loyalty and passion again.

I accept your reality, however I disagree with it and would like it to be different. I would also like our club to do things differently to other clubs just because it is the right way to do things. Currently I don't think games are too expensive and I don't think we are paying our players too much.

I haveh no disgust about our players wages and don't go to games. My disgust is with the wages top players earn across europe and don't really follow this part of the game because of it. Because of this i don't want Brighton to 'sell out' in order to join the elite. German teams seem to manage to be in the elite while still providing affordable tickets, why can't we?

Being affordable is more important then success. What would be the point in watching us become successful if we can't afford to watch us when we are successful.

I don't care if we make a big money signing or not. As long as the team goes out on that pitch every week and puts their all in then I'll be happy.

And ffp should not be the clubs excuse to charge more. It should be their incentive to cut their costs.

You seem to have very low aspirations. If there was no hope of success what effect would that have on crowds and how soon after a demise in crowds would you then see financial problems as the club could not afford to run a stadium like the Amex. You might be content to watch the decline of the club just so you can get in cheap but the fact that the club sells out is evidence that the pricing is for the moment at the right level. Obviously I would prefer to pay less, I would prefer if they let me in for free and fed me a pie and pint but that ain't going to happen. I pay about a total of £28 per match for league games for both myself and my daughter for WSU seats and I have no doubt that is reasonable for what we have seen and what facilities we get.

As for FFP, it's here for us, it's here for clubs in European competitions and no doubt it won't be long before it is the EPL and it will filter down. When this happens we might see a change in the spiralling wages of players at the top however if the revenue streams for TV rights continue to rise then FFP will only benefit the clubs getting the lions share of that TV money and the gulf between them and the rest of us will increase.

 

[Vegas Seagull]

I'd happily play in League 1/2 if it meant better ticket prices, I go along to the football to have a laugh and spend time with mates and I can do that at Accrington just as easily as I can Old Trafford.

I hope we increase prices to ensure that poor people like you, who don't love the Albion, are forced elsewhere

 

[BadFish]

You seem to have very low aspirations. If there was no hope of success what effect would that have on crowds and how soon after a demise in crowds would you then see financial problems as the club could not afford to run a stadium like the Amex. You might be content to watch the decline of the club just so you can get in cheap but the fact that the club sells out is evidence that the pricing is for the moment at the right level. Obviously I would prefer to pay less, I would prefer if they let me in for free and fed me a pie and pint but that ain't going to happen. I pay about a total of £28 per match for league games for both myself and my daughter for WSU seats and I have no doubt that is reasonable for what we have seen and what facilities we get.

As for FFP, it's here for us, it's here for clubs in European competitions and no doubt it won't be long before it is the EPL and it will filter down. When this happens we might see a change in the spiralling wages of players at the top however if the revenue streams for TV rights continue to rise then FFP will only benefit the clubs getting the lions share of that TV money and the gulf between them and the rest of us will increase.

Admission prices don't really affect me, as I said it would be better for me personally to be in the Premier League as I would get to see more games. The questions is about keeping it afordable or getting to the Premier league. Personally I don't think we should sell out affordability in order to get to the Premier League. Aside from anything else I don't think we need to (although it would be nice to get rid of that debt). Currently I agree that prices are very reasonable but my answer is that i would like things to stay that way.

As for aspirations? I think I have very high aspirations as I would like a club that is run as a club for the fans and keeps them at the top of their priorities. I aspire to this being done while the team enjoy success on the field as well. Much higher aspirations than buying success and over spending to get into the Premier League (I know you have not suggested this but it is the natural opposite of the way i would like things to be done).

I also accept that this in its entirety is very unlikely to be taken on as a plan but the closer we get to it the happier I will be.

 

[martyn20]

Talking about the Brighton crowd as a whole the fact is, despite the cost, there will be more people willing to come on matchdays if the team are successful, in the PL or the Championship we will have a full stadium, after a couple of years in the lower leagues we will see the place half full, that's a fact.
If you are happy to have a fun day out with your mates and 10,000 others ok, the other 20000 of us want our team to have success at the highest level.
Of course ticket prices, and player/agent wages are totally out of control but that's the reality of the 13/14 football season and all Brighton can do is live with that or we will not be able to compete.

 

[Arkwright]

The one thing I don't understand is surely you can have both Premier Football and keep the season ticket prices the same.

Is it four fewer home games so yes match day tickets would go up in price but season ticket prices held. The increase in TV, sponsorship, executive seats, advertising merchandise, ect will bring in additional monies required.

Why do prices need to change? This would keep it affordable for season ticket holders as we are use to paying the current price and save the Albion from losing support to Lewes. Good will is priceless.

 

[Wilko]

Interesting chatting to my mate last night who is a pompey season ticket holder. He has just got a cheap season ticket for Fratton park, they are also making all pints £3 or under and cheap food. They have made really cheap tickets available for kids make sure they continue to follow their local team.

He said he cannot wait for the new season. Football is not all about what league you are in.

 

[Braders]

The one thing I don't understand is surely you can have both Premier Football and keep the season ticket prices the same.

Is it four fewer home games so yes match day tickets would go up in price but season ticket prices held. The increase in TV, sponsorship, executive seats, advertising merchandise, ect will bring in additional monies required.

Why do prices need to change? This would keep it affordable for season ticket holders as we are use to paying the current price and save the Albion from losing support to Lewes. Good will is priceless.

100% agree , however sadly it will never happen

 

[B.W.]

Expecting it doesn't make it right though does it?

Players wages are outrageous by anyone's standard. Ticket prices are too high. If one comes down then the other comes down too. I would like to see MY club make a decision about what they can reasonably expect supporters (grass roots supporters, the ones that saved the club, the ones who will still be going when we are shit and need some loyalty) to pay. Then I would like them to work out what, based on all available income we can afford to pay in wages whilst still breaking even. Then I would like us to show the rest of the football world how the game should be run and provide a model that does not drive proper supporters away to form your FC Uniteds and does not drive clubs into the ground. If this means that we stay in the championship for years or even drop down the leagues it matters not to me. By far the most important thing to me is that the club is run correctly. IF we have to do this in the face of other clubs flouting Financial fair Play regulations and gambling administration on getting to the Premier League, so be it. All I care about is the MY club being run properly for the fans and for the community, not as a business but as a football club. We are Brighton and Hove Albion FC not Brighton and Hove Albion PLC.

Yes, but it's not all about you, or other fans like me who have supported the Albion for 35+ years. The club must play at the highest possible level to maximise revenues from fans of all types, including butterflies. The butterflies would fly away if we followed your plan.