[Albion] What are we? Weak, Cowards, Comfortable, Arrogant, Flaky, Spineless or Fragile?

[Stato]

Our mentality is unforgivable.

2-1 V Forest at home. We aren’t ruthless enough to get the third or hold onto our lead. Yes Forest are alright but good teams with character get 3 points with 15 minutes to go or win it in the last 10 minutes V 10 men
2-0 up V Wolves at home until 88 minutes. Draw 2-2.
1-0 up V Liverpool and lose it in 3 minutes (a bit harsh I know but 2 goals in 3 minutes)
1-0 up at home to utter dogshit Southampton. 1-1 and could have lost.
2-0 up away to Leicester until 86 minutes. Bart plays a shit ball into the middle of the pitch. We don’t keep it, five players don’t pick up one of theirs and we know the rest….

You missed: Came from 1 down to beat City and from 2 down to beat Spurs, held on against Bournemouth having played half an hour with 10 men, held on at St James Park, scored a late winner v Man Utd, got a draw away at Arsenal after being 1-0 down. It's a very competitive league and every team is going to have ups and downs. We have a very talented, but also very young squad and we have been without some leaders at crucial times, but you don't get the full picture of a team that sits in seventh if you cherry pick the negative.

We have a wonderful opportunity this season. Our rivals (Newcastle, Villa, Spurs) not able to strengthen because of FFP, yet we can and spend £200m. City could get docked points. West Ham are shit. We have the players to get CL imo. Yet we are throwing it away.

Everybody in the league is our rival. Where the teams you mention haven't strengthened, others have. The incredible money spent by Chelsea over the last few seasons did not provide instant success, but it seems to have bedded in and is helping this year. On a smaller scale see also Nottingham Forest and Bournemouth.

Teams with smaller budgets and squads could finish above us – Bournemouth, Brentford, Fulham. Fair play to them – they get the maximum from their players. It looks like they ahve stronger and better football managers sadly. Hurzelar doesn’t seem to have the gravitas needed and the players are all too comfortable.

Bournemouth, Brentford and Fulham all have higher net spends than we do over the last five years. They all have managers with experience in the division. Hurzeler is 15 games into his first EPL season. His win percentage is 44.44%. Frank's EPL record is 34.88%. Iraola's is 37.73%. Silva's is 35.48%. Fab's record could get worse, it could get better. It could stay the same. If it stays the same he will be the Brighton manager with the highest EPL win percentage. RDZ's was 37.14%.

We are a work in progress. A lot of new signings have joined a new coaching team and quite a few have had injury issues at the beginning of their Albion careers. As you have suggested, we have no right to win EPL matches and things are as good as they have ever been. However, it will always be a massive challenge and there will always be times when we feel frustrated by results. It's hard to cope with losing points in moments, but it was also hard when we dominated matches, but couldn't score. Let's face it. It will always be hard. The only thing we can do, whenever there are knock backs, is follow Micky Adams sage advice and keep the faith.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

True, but we can’t hide behind that forever.

They had a preseason and we’re 4 months in

And they are 7th

 

[dazzer6666]

When we have a wobble the super fans gather on the hill patronising the rest and talking utter bollocks.
Our manager made the same mistake against Wolves and didn’t learn from it. I’m not sure what we are holding out for with this guy so it had better be worth it.

He didn’t make a mistake imo…..Igor did. Manager can’t legislate for a player brain-fart

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

And they are 7th

True, could’ve been second though

 

[Milano]

It's 90% on the manager for me (I do NOT want him sacked though). He didn't need to bring on Igor. It was far too negative and just hands the oppo the initative.
Fabian panicked IMO and it spread to the team. I question his subs big time:
1) Stop taking Pedro off on 70 mins. (Why he took JP off and left EF on was strange) JP didn't look happy about it either.
2) Stop changing our CM pairing in EVERY game. We lost control of the midfield when Ayari went off. Can our players not last 90 mins anymore?
3) Coach the players to keep the ball, and not by going backwards all the time. Igor lost the ball because he was trying to go home with it and just turned into trouble, he had passes on that were forward. I've noticed JPvH did the same in the last 10 mins too. Again, it hands the oppo momentum. I feel he needs to find a balance of not going stupid gung-ho like vs Wolves but also not retreating into a shell like yesterday. We used to be one of the best in the league at keeping the ball, what's happened?
4) If he can't trust Baleba not to pick up a 2nd yellow then don't start him. I'm of the opinion that we need Carlos more at the end of games. However given my point 2 above then if he can't be trusted then he needs a spell on the bench.

 

[dazzer6666]

It's 90% on the manager for me (I do NOT want him sacked though). He didn't need to bring on Igor. It was far too negative and just hands the oppo the initative.
Fabian panicked IMO and it spread to the team. I question his subs big time:
1) Stop taking Pedro off on 70 mins. (Why he took JP off and left EF on was strange) JP didn't look happy about it either.
2) Stop changing our CM pairing in EVERY game. We lost control of the midfield when Ayari went off. Can our players not last 90 mins anymore?
3) Coach the players to keep the ball, and not by going backwards all the time. Igor lost the ball because he was trying to go home with it and just turned into trouble, he had passes on that were forward. I've noticed JPvH did the same in the last 10 mins too. Again, it hands the oppo momentum. I feel he needs to find a balance of not going stupid gung-ho like vs Wolves but also not retreating into a shell like yesterday. We used to be one of the best in the league at keeping the ball, what's happened?
4) If he can't trust Baleba not to pick up a 2nd yellow then don't start him. I'm of the opinion that we need Carlos more at the end of games. However given my point 2 above then if he can't be trusted then he needs a spell on the bench.

1. Pedro wasn’t having a great game, Evan holds the ball up better
2. Ayari looked absolutely knackered. No - for those doing the most pressing, 90 mins is likely too much, particularly when you need to take cumulative load and periodicity into account
3. Igor made a bad decision, simple.
4. I’d rather have Baleba for 45 mins than not at all, but Wieffer needs game time to adapt so balancing the two is critical

IMO, anyway

 

[Balders]

I'm really struggling with this narrative that FH's subs changed the game and meant we lost confidence in a game we had controlled. The point most are missing is that we controlled the game for 81 mins until RVN made aggressive changes - instead of playing Vardy up top as a loan striker, he popped Daka on to play two up top - FH's response after they got their first was to shore up the back line to protect our lead by playing 5 at the back - a tactic that has happened numerous times by many top managers! How dare Leicester change things up and go "gun-ho" to get something out of the game, it worked but we had to respond.

I also think Mavididi coming on after 62mins changed things - he was far better than the hapless Ayew for 62mins.

So going to 5 at the back (standard tactic) and introducing Igor (who has been great for weeks) who made the error for the equalizer, is the perfect narrative for those that have this obsession for having someone or something to blame without looking at the bigger picture .....

 

[pigmanovich]

I also think Mavididi coming on after 62mins changed things - he was far better than the hapless Ayew for 62mins.

Predictable - I trawled social media before the game and most Leicester fans were unhappy to see Ayew start over Mavididi.

 

[Lifelong Supporter]

I'm really struggling with this narrative that FH's subs changed the game and meant we lost confidence in a game we had controlled. The point most are missing is that we controlled the game for 81 mins until RVN made aggressive changes - instead of playing Vardy up top as a loan striker, he popped Daka on to play two up top - FH's response after they got their first was to shore up the back line to protect our lead by playing 5 at the back - a tactic that has happened numerous times by many top managers! How dare Leicester change things up and go "gun-ho" to get something out of the game, it worked but we had to respond.

I also think Mavididi coming on after 62mins changed things - he was far better than the hapless Ayew for 62mins.

So going to 5 at the back (standard tactic) and introducing Igor (who has been great for weeks) who made the error for the equalizer, is the perfect narrative for those that have this obsession for having someone or something to blame without looking at the bigger picture .....

This is how Match of the Day seemed to see it. They were not critical of us so much as positive towards RVN and his substitutes. Once the first goal went in with 10 or so minutes left inclu. injury and with Leicester as the home team, it was always on the cards that they would have another chance.

Bringing on an in form defender in an attempt to shore up the back was an obvious tactic and the right one.

One wants to try and ignore the media and the commentators who imply it is all over when it is not. Plenty of goals are being scored at the end of games when players tire and with the extended periods of 'injury' time. You win some and you lose some.

Too much thinking and analysing of this will make it became an obsession. At least we got into a position of apparent dominance. That positive seems to have been largely ignored. Lamptey's contract is up at the end of the season. He is an exciting and versatile player who is always hard working. I would be sad to see him go.

 

[zefarelly]

we shouldn't be using Igor as a scapegoat, he was surrounded by Leicester players hounding for the ball while our players stood there watching, he had no wjhere to go and no one to pass to

ok he could have hoofed it, but he'd have got berated for that as well.

the team had a massive brain fart, end of.

It is about time we learnt from this after however many identical situations in the last 10 minutes of games this season . . . And move on!

 

[Silverhatch]

We have two good centre halves on the pitch, three with Igor. Win the ball and ping it into channels or out of play. Regroup, get tight and keep them out. Playing tight triangles or dribbling out when a side has its tail up, on their patch is just f***ing stupid. As is committing five players in attack and then giving the ball to one defender. CONCENTRATE on winning. Not playing. Not the process. Just f***ing win.

 

[macbeth]

I'm really struggling with this narrative that FH's subs changed the game and meant we lost confidence in a game we had controlled. The point most are missing is that we controlled the game for 81 mins until RVN made aggressive changes - instead of playing Vardy up top as a loan striker, he popped Daka on to play two up top - FH's response after they got their first was to shore up the back line to protect our lead by playing 5 at the back - a tactic that has happened numerous times by many top managers! How dare Leicester change things up and go "gun-ho" to get something out of the game, it worked but we had to respond.

I also think Mavididi coming on after 62mins changed things - he was far better than the hapless Ayew for 62mins.

So going to 5 at the back (standard tactic) and introducing Igor (who has been great for weeks) who made the error for the equalizer, is the perfect narrative for those that have this obsession for having someone or something to blame without looking at the bigger picture .....

igor has not been great for weeks. he was at fault for southampton’s goal, played no small part in verbruggen’s error at fulham thanks to the hospital pass he gave him and there have been numerous instances of him defending like a traffic cone, like for salah’s goal at anfield, for example

 

[Commander]

All the ‘he didn’t need to bring on Igor’ brigade. Did you say that at the time? Because I certainly didn't, it seemed like the sensible thing to do when he did it.

It’s not FH’s fault that Igor made a stupid mistake- had he not done so and we’d won the game there is no way in hell there would be so many on here saying it was the wrong sub to make- you wouldn’t have even mentioned it.

Some of the bedwetting on this board today is absolutely cringeworthy. Pull yourselves together for God’s sake.

 

[Balders]

igor has not been great for weeks. he was at fault for southampton’s goal, played no small part in verbruggen’s error at fulham thanks to the hospital pass he gave him and there have been numerous instances of him defending like a traffic cone, like for salah’s goal at anfield, for example

So that's what you took from my post ;-) How was he at fault for Southampton's goal, we had a few goes at blocking/clearing it. Again no small part at Fulham - how was that a hospital pass and if it was why didn't Bart stick it in Row Z? I think you'll find it was Estupinan who was defending Salah's goal at Anfield.
Still if you are hell bent on having Igor as the scapegoat ;-)

 

[Seasider78]

The team is playing well but we are being punished for individual errors and poor decision making in key moments from players whether its the Weiffer 4 on 2 pass, Barts early gift against Fulham or Igor trying to channel his inner maldini in the 91st minute at this level you are punished.

I trust the squad and manager to learn and the right things will be happening behind the scenes to stop this but kicking ourselves for mistakes that would make us 3rd or 4th in PL rather than 7th is a pretty amazing place to be in as an Albion fan.

 

[Balders]

Igor's "hospital pass" at Fulham - honestly you can't make these things up.........

 

[dazzer6666]

I'm really struggling with this narrative that FH's subs changed the game and meant we lost confidence in a game we had controlled. The point most are missing is that we controlled the game for 81 mins until RVN made aggressive changes - instead of playing Vardy up top as a loan striker, he popped Daka on to play two up top - FH's response after they got their first was to shore up the back line to protect our lead by playing 5 at the back - a tactic that has happened numerous times by many top managers! How dare Leicester change things up and go "gun-ho" to get something out of the game, it worked but we had to respond.

I also think Mavididi coming on after 62mins changed things - he was far better than the hapless Ayew for 62mins.

So going to 5 at the back (standard tactic) and introducing Igor (who has been great for weeks) who made the error for the equalizer, is the perfect narrative for those that have this obsession for having someone or something to blame without looking at the bigger picture .....

This. Igor clears it, we see the game out and FH gets plaudits for 'game management'

 

[dazzer6666]

All the ‘he didn’t need to bring on Igor’ brigade. Did you say that at the time? Because I certainly didn't, it seemed like the sensible thing to do when he did it.

It’s not FH’s fault that Igor made a stupid mistake- had he not done so and we’d won the game there is no way in hell there would be so many on here saying it was the wrong sub to make- you wouldn’t have even mentioned it.

Some of the bedwetting on this board today is absolutely cringeworthy. Pull yourselves together for God’s sake.

Literally said this at the time. Bolster the defence, see the game out

 

[Seagull58]

Strange decision to take him off - are we going to do that everytime he gets a yellow?

Attwell was the ref. Already sent him off once for nothing and seems to have an agenda against us.

 

[Milano]

Literally said this at the time. Bolster the defence, see the game out

You don't have to add a CB and change to a back 5 to do this though. Bringing on another def CM (e.g. Moder) has the same affect but without disrupting the back 4. He didn't just bring on Igor, he changed our formation, in the 89th minute!! We weren't playing a top 4 side.