[Albion] We have the worst record for both attacking and defending set pieces this season

[Hotchilidog]

Personally, I would be happy if we never took a long corner again. What we are very very good at is football, so come on RDZ if they put two out wide to stop the short corner we should put 3.

Does nobody remember the 1970s, when Liverpool never ever took a long corner ?

It does take BIG BALLS though and if RDZ has proven anything this season

I agree. just get the ball back into open play and create chances that way.

We do need to sort out our defending from corners and free kicks though. The spatial awareness in these situations tends to be very poor indeed, and it is noteworthingly bad.

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

Hear me out, I've got this radical idea that should sort it, we could have, er, 2 players standing over the ball for the element of surprise. That should do it....

 

[Ali_rrr]

Whilst these numbers are bad, we have had some glaring misses from set pieces this year. Free headers sailing over the bar for the majority and a couple of good saves.

Weirdly, under Hyypia we seemed to be decent at them.


Regardless, I know who I would rather have in charge.

 

[albionalex]

Do penalties count as set pieces?

No

 

[Sepulveda]

We do need to sort out our defending from corners and free kicks though. The spatial awareness in these situations tends to be very poor indeed, and it is noteworthingly bad.

You're not very good at defending in your own box in general (maybe it's more apparent to me as a Juve fan.) Sitting back isn't really De Zerbi's style - I guess it wasn't Potter's either - and it's very difficult to have a team that can play multiple styles the way Man City can do at times, but defending the box is an extremely useful ability to have for any team.

 

[sagaman]

I really fail to see what Nick Stanley delivers

Think it ridiculously complacent not to be able to defend or attack well from corners and other dead ball situations

 

[Super Steve Earle]

We clearly need a set piece expert.

Actually, whilst I don't advocate for people losing their jobs, perhaps we need a new set piece expert. After all, Pascal puts our corners all around the goal, high and low crosses, yet used the same arm in the air signal for all of them.

 

[Javeaseagull]

I stopped getting excited at corners in the Goldstone days.

 

[Johnny RoastBeef]

Despite our shocking set piece performance last season, nothing has improved.

So, Why are we the worst in the Premier League at set pieces?

Let me start by acknowledging that we are currently the League's top scorers from open play this season. So this isn't a complaint, just a genuine enquiry into our profligacy at set pieces.

As far as I can tell from a quick Google search, statistically every goal scored is worth roughly a single point. So having the worst return from set pieces in the league is a significant handicap.

This season, despite being the league's top scorers, we've scored 0 goals from set pieces. Liverpool already have 4.

I've used Liverpool as a comparison as they were last season's best from set pieces, with 17 set piece goals, compared to our 6.

I'm going under the assumption that most set piece goals are the result of headers from corners or indirect free kicks or directly from a shot from a free kick.

Looking at goals direct from free kicks, here are our stats since joining the Premier League.

2017/18 0
2018/19 0
2019/20 2 (Lewis Dunk, Pascal Gross)
2020/21 1 (Lewis Dunk)
2021/22 0
2022/23 1 (Alexis Mac Allister)

As a team, 4 goals direct from free kicks in 6 seasons is a poor return. James Ward-Prowse, on his own, has scored 13 goals direct from free kicks over the same period.

Another reason for our low output could be that we don't score enough headers from corners or indirect free kicks. We currently have the shortest average squad height, at just 1.77m (5'9"), but that doesn't explain why West Ham nearly doubled our set piece output last season with an average height of just 1 cm more.

So is it our deadball delivery?

No. In fact, last season Pascal Gross was the most accurate corner taker in the league.

Gross found a teammate with 41% of his corners last season.

Compare that with the league's next best, James W.P. 24%, Trent A.A. 32% and Mason Mount 35.4%.

Does the blame lie with our aerial ability?

Last season we scored a total of 10 headed goals, Liverpool only scored 13. So that doesn't really explain an 11 goal difference in goals scored from set pieces between us.

So the reason for our lack of goals could be a lack of quality in the chances we are creating from set pieces.

Nick Stanley has been our set piece coach since he was promoted from the role of Lead Performance Analyst at the club. The set piece coach was a new position at the club created in 2019 under Graham Potter and Stanley has since continued in that role under De Zerbi.

But has our set piece goal output got better or worse under his guidance? Probably worse.

This is our yearly output in the Premier League:

2017/18 5 set piece goals scored under Hughton
2018/19 14 (Hughton)
2019/20. 12 (Stanley, Potter)
2020/21 7 (Stanley, Potter)
2021/22. 8 (Stanley, Potter)
2022/23 6 (Stanley, De Zerbi)

But was the departure of Shane Duffy a reason for our down turn in set piece goals?

Not significantly, this was Shane's headed goal output for the 3 premier league seasons he was with us.

2017/18 0
2018/19 3
2019/20 1

This is Webster's since that time,

2020/21 1
2021/22 1
2022/23 0

Perhaps Shane won more headers in the opponents box and caused more opportunities for others to react to second balls, but I don't have any stats to back this up.

So in conclusion, In my opinion, I'd say that we don't score enough set piece goals for one, two or all three of the following reasons.

1.) We are poor at shooting from direct free kicks, which is odd because Pascal is so accurate with his dead ball delivery, but probably lacks the power to beat the keeper from distance.

2.) Our players are smaller and unable to compete when matched up against stronger opponents. Not a lot we can do about that other than be smarter with our routines.

3.) Our set pieces routines are simply not as effective as other teams, which would be down to the set piece coach, Nick Stanley.

Whatever the reason, in a world of marginal gains, where every goal is statistically worth a point, we seem to be missing out on a large area of untapped potential.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Despite our shocking set piece performance last season, nothing has improved.

So, Why are we the worst in the Premier League at set pieces?

Let me start by acknowledging that we are currently the League's top scorers from open play this season. So this isn't a complaint, just a genuine enquiry into our profligacy at set pieces.

As far as I can tell from a quick Google search, statistically every goal scored is worth roughly a single point. So having the worst return from set pieces in the league is a significant handicap.

This season, despite being the league's top scorers, we've scored 0 goals from set pieces. Liverpool already have 4.

I've used Liverpool as a comparison as they were last season's best from set pieces, with 17 set piece goals, compared to our 6.

I'm going under the assumption that most set piece goals are the result of headers from corners or indirect free kicks or directly from a shot from a free kick.

Looking at goals direct from free kicks, here are our stats since joining the Premier League.

2017/18 0
2018/19 0
2019/20 2 (Lewis Dunk, Pascal Gross)
2020/21 1 (Lewis Dunk)
2021/22 0
2022/23 1 (Alexis Mac Allister)

As a team, 4 goals direct from free kicks in 6 seasons is a poor return. James Ward-Prowse, on his own, has scored 13 goals direct from free kicks over the same period.

Another reason for our low output could be that we don't score enough headers from corners or indirect free kicks. We currently have the shortest average squad height, at just 1.77m (5'9"), but that doesn't explain why West Ham nearly doubled our set piece output last season with an average height of just 1 cm more.

So is it our deadball delivery?

No. In fact, last season Pascal Gross was the most accurate corner taker in the league.

Gross found a teammate with 41% of his corners last season.

Compare that with the league's next best, James W.P. 24%, Trent A.A. 32% and Mason Mount 35.4%.

Does the blame lie with our aerial ability?

Last season we scored a total of 10 headed goals, Liverpool only scored 13. So that doesn't really explain an 11 goal difference in goals scored from set pieces between us.

So the reason for our lack of goals could be a lack of quality in the chances we are creating from set pieces.

Nick Stanley has been our set piece coach since he was promoted from the role of Lead Performance Analyst at the club. The set piece coach was a new position at the club created in 2019 under Graham Potter and Stanley has since continued in that role under De Zerbi.

But has our set piece goal output got better or worse under his guidance? Probably worse.

This is our yearly output in the Premier League:

2017/18 5 set piece goals scored under Hughton
2018/19 14 (Hughton)
2019/20. 12 (Stanley, Potter)
2020/21 7 (Stanley, Potter)
2021/22. 8 (Stanley, Potter)
2022/23 6 (Stanley, De Zerbi)

But was the departure of Shane Duffy a reason for our down turn in set piece goals?

Not significantly, this was Shane's headed goal output for the 3 premier league seasons he was with us.

2017/18 0
2018/19 3
2019/20 1

This is Webster's since that time,

2020/21 1
2021/22 1
2022/23 0

Perhaps Shane won more headers in the opponents box and caused more opportunities for others to react to second balls, but I don't have any stats to back this up.

So in conclusion, In my opinion, I'd say that we don't score enough set piece goals for one, two or all three of the following reasons.

1.) We are poor at shooting from direct free kicks, which is odd because Pascal is so accurate with his dead ball delivery, but probably lacks the power to beat the keeper from distance.

2.) Our players are smaller and unable to compete when matched up against stronger opponents. Not a lot we can do about that other than be smarter with our routines.

3.) Our set pieces routines are simply not as effective as other teams, which would be down to the set piece coach, Nick Stanley.

Whatever the reason, in a world of marginal gains, where every goal is statistically worth a point, we seem to be missing out on a large area of untapped potential.

Good research.

Just some thoughts to add, Gilmour seems to be moving into the taking role and as we saw at the weekend has a powerful cross. Gross is accurate, but maybe a little floaty by PL standards.

You can't get past the conclusion also that we've missed sitter after sitter from corners over the last few seasons and really it's the centre backs with questions to answer. Dunk's post kicking miss and Igor's bad miss against Athens were two recent examples of what we've seen continually for years. A real area we can improve.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

We have the worst record for both attacking and defending set pieces this season​

Oh no!!
Anyway...

 

[um bongo molongo]

Our delivery is poor - Gross a bit floaty and March a bit inconsistent. Gilmour looks like he might be better. We then seem to have an odd thing where our CBs seem unable to get headers on target (Dunk had a great chance vs ‘Muff). Defensively I think we just have a few too many players who either short/slight or just not great in the air to be good at defending them (Mitoma, March, Buonanotte, Gilmour etc)

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I don't see the issue to be about player height.

Who is the best attacking header of the ball in our team? Clearly Mitoma. MacAllister was good and got a few headers. Burn was utter crap in the air despite being massive. OK he got one at the weekend. It's movement that gets you headed goals as much as height, that and having the courage to attack the ball and the skill to keep it down

 

[Commander]

I was talking about this the other day. I wonder if it just a time thing. To play the way we do from the back we must have to consistently practice it for hours on end, day after day, week after week. Maybe there just aren’t enough hours in a training session to do the same for set pieces. I can’t remember too many sides that were devastating at set pieces that were also brilliant footballing sides. I’d rather it this way around.

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

Dunk should definitely have scored on Sunday. Heading just wide seems to be something we excel at

 

[chaileyjem]

That said - we've not missed a penalty now for 18 months and have scored 9 in a row in the Premier League.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Good research.

Just some thoughts to add, Gilmour seems to be moving into the taking role and as we saw at the weekend has a powerful cross. Gross is accurate, but maybe a little floaty by PL standards.

You can't get past the conclusion also that we've missed sitter after sitter from corners over the last few seasons and really it's the centre backs with questions to answer. Dunk's post kicking miss and Igor's bad miss against Athens were two recent examples of what we've seen continually for years. A real area we can improve.

Igor's miss was horrible. Un-marked, inside the far post, yet still put it wide. You can have Lionel Messi setting the chances up, but if you continually miss the target it's going to be hard to improve.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Igor's miss was horrible. Un-marked, inside the far post, yet still put it wide. You can have Lionel Messi setting the chances up, but if you continually miss the target it's going to be hard to improve.

It was horrible.

I'm a big a Dunk fan as anyone, but his success rate over the years has been well below par. If he was getting the 5 or 6 a season he should have been with the number of quality deliveries in the box, I believe he'd have received England recognition much earlier.

And Webby, who again I like, is the worst of the lot. Everything goes up and over.

 

[The Fits]

If you put Gilmour on every set piece we score more goals. I'm certain of that.

 

[dazzer6666]

I don't see the issue to be about player height.

Who is the best attacking header of the ball in our team? Clearly Mitoma. MacAllister was good and got a few headers. Burn was utter crap in the air despite being massive. OK he got one at the weekend. It's movement that gets you headed goals as much as height, that and having the courage to attack the ball and the skill to keep it down

Mac often got a header in, but hardly ever got it on target. Can remember more glaring misses from them that good attempts on goal.