[News] US Supreme Court strikes down New York law on gun carrying rights.

[Neville's Breakfast]

I listen to a number of US podcasts at either end of the spectrum politically. Just some points.

1. The New York law relates to handguns. Not ARs or similar, as such unsure how this links into the wider debate involving school shootings etc.

2. Stats are spun by both sides of the debate. A common one is to include suicides where a gun is used.

3. Shootings tend to be prevalent in areas of socio-economic deprivation. In short gang related. Given that the guns aren't going away the only solution is to work on the poverty. Gun crime isn't so much of a problem in more affluent areas.

4. Most gun reform won't prevent mass shootings. You can only legally restrict guns and this can only affect those who get them legally. If I'm planning a heist I'm not bothered by parking restrictions whilst I'm holding up the bank.

We don't get the issue of guns in the US - it's a deep issue which is largely about how the state and the citizen squares off against the federal state. It's also heavily politicised. Gang violence is huge but gun rights are largely argued in the context of school shootings which are less frequent.

The US govt can get the guns back but it can look into the symptoms of these situations where guns kill.

Aren’t several of those points the excuses for inaction that have brought them to where they are ? The school shootings are not necessarily in poorer areas and they are frequent by global standards. A quick Google brought me to this ;

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/school-shootings-by-country

19 Countries with the Most School Shootings (total incidents Jan 2009-May 2018 - CNN):

United States — 288
Mexico — 8
South Africa — 6
India — 5
Nigeria & Pakistan — 4
Afghanistan — 3
Brazil, Canada, France — 2
Azerbaijan, China, Estonia, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Kenya, Russia, & Turkey — 1

Australia controlled guns in the 1990s after a number of massacres. It hasn’t had an incident since. America is a massive outlier in that table above. The evidence seems overwhelming.

 

[American Seagle]

Aren’t several of those points the excuses for inaction that have brought them to where they are ? The school shootings are not necessarily in poorer areas and they are frequent by global standards. A quick Google brought me to this ;

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/school-shootings-by-country

19 Countries with the Most School Shootings (total incidents Jan 2009-May 2018 - CNN):

United States — 288
Mexico — 8
South Africa — 6
India — 5
Nigeria & Pakistan — 4
Afghanistan — 3
Brazil, Canada, France — 2
Azerbaijan, China, Estonia, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Kenya, Russia, & Turkey — 1

Australia controlled guns in the 1990s after a number of massacres. It hasn’t had an incident since. America is a massive outlier in that table above. The evidence seems overwhelming.

This is the most depressing thing.
I am a if it is broken we should fix it type of person. As it stands you only need look at the statistics, no politics at all, just the statistics to see that the 2nd amendment is broken. Whether that be in its current interpretation (scary given the rogue nature of the current Supreme court) or in its existence. Something needs to be done to fix it and I just hope that the people in power come around the the obviousness of the situation and act before something even more gruesome occurs.
Unfortunately, my faith that they will act in our best interests, or at all, has been reduced to almost nothing over the last handful of years.

 

[Swansman]

Up to them really. It’s their country.

"Up to them"... well, how many times did the US interfer in foreign politics? How much are they spending on influencing people in various countries through exporting concepts and culture? How often have they changed the government of a foreign country? Unfortunately anything they do also affects the world. Can't have that nonsense of trying to make the rest of the world a mini-America while we're not supposed to give a shit about what being part of their hideous culture really means.

They've done a good job on us all though. If they were Arabs, Slavs or some kind of Africans running their country in the same way, people would shake their heads, mutter something about primitive terrorists, land of brutes, crazy religious ****tards or something in that manner... but as it is America, they'll - as always - get out of jail free card only getting some throw away comments on how it is a stupid country etc. In a month or two we'll be kneeling in front of Uncle Biden and the holy world saviours USA so they can deal with one or other third world country that we find a little strange and threatening.

All of it bollocks IMO. They're trying to change our societies and our cultures through various means, and people should think about what that really means in the long run. We're already fat, we've already sold our state assets to profiteering greedy capitalists, we've already adapted to their vanity culture with our kids starving themselves or going under the knife to look like your average plastic yankee superstar, we're adapting to their drug culture... where does it end? It is just a matter of time before this school shooting stuff becomes monthly stuff in our countries as well.

Should shut down all interaction with this parasitic tumor of a country. Then it would be "up to them". As it stands, anything going on over there is just a sneak peek into our own futures.

 

[American Seagle]

"Up to them"... well, how many times did the US interfer in foreign politics? How much are they spending on influencing people in various countries through exporting concepts and culture? How often have they changed the government of a foreign country? Unfortunately anything they do also affects the world. Can't have that nonsense of trying to make the rest of the world a mini-America while we're not supposed to give a shit about what being part of their hideous culture really means.

They've done a good job on us all though. If they were Arabs, Slavs or some kind of Africans running their country in the same way, people would shake their heads, mutter something about primitive terrorists, land of brutes, crazy religious ****tards or something in that manner... but as it is America, they'll - as always - get out of jail free card only getting some throw away comments on how it is a stupid country etc. In a month or two we'll be kneeling in front of Uncle Biden and the holy world saviours USA so they can deal with one or other third world country that we find a little strange and threatening.

All of it bollocks IMO. They're trying to change our societies and our cultures through various means, and people should think about what that really means in the long run. We're already fat, we've already sold our state assets to profiteering greedy capitalists, we've already adapted to their vanity culture with our kids starving themselves or going under the knife to look like your average plastic yankee superstar, we're adapting to their drug culture... where does it end? It is just a matter of time before this school shooting stuff becomes monthly stuff in our countries as well.

Should shut down all interaction with this parasitic tumor of a country. Then it would be "up to them". As it stands, anything going on over there is just a sneak peek into our own futures.

You should really make a distinction between the politics and politicians of a country and it's people.

 

[scamander]

Aren’t several of those points the excuses for inaction that have brought them to where they are ? The school shootings are not necessarily in poorer areas and they are frequent by global standards. A quick Google brought me to this ;

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/school-shootings-by-country

19 Countries with the Most School Shootings (total incidents Jan 2009-May 2018 - CNN):

United States — 288
Mexico — 8
South Africa — 6
India — 5
Nigeria & Pakistan — 4
Afghanistan — 3
Brazil, Canada, France — 2
Azerbaijan, China, Estonia, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Kenya, Russia, & Turkey — 1

Australia controlled guns in the 1990s after a number of massacres. It hasn’t had an incident since. America is a massive outlier in that table above. The evidence seems overwhelming.

I wasn't referring to schools as being in the poorer areas. Apologies as I wasn't clear on that, it's the largely unreported on tv gun crime which is in the poorer areas.

I'm not sure pointing out what I have supports inaction. It's more the case of their not being a viable solution which can be legislated.

Sadly the only change which can make a difference is a change of attitude. I hear a lot about reforms but what is actually workable? The US will not change the second amendment and even if they could, who is going to start getting those guns back.

The point is that there isn't a quick fix politically on this. Gun crime (and mass shootings) are generally the result of getting guns illegally.

That said I'd be interested to know what people on here think could work?

 

[nicko31]

Aren’t several of those points the excuses for inaction that have brought them to where they are ? The school shootings are not necessarily in poorer areas and they are frequent by global standards. A quick Google brought me to this ;

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/school-shootings-by-country

19 Countries with the Most School Shootings (total incidents Jan 2009-May 2018 - CNN):

United States — 288
Mexico — 8
South Africa — 6
India — 5
Nigeria & Pakistan — 4
Afghanistan — 3
Brazil, Canada, France — 2
Azerbaijan, China, Estonia, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Kenya, Russia, & Turkey — 1

Australia controlled guns in the 1990s after a number of massacres. It hasn’t had an incident since. America is a massive outlier in that table above. The evidence seems overwhelming.

They don't like being told they are a bit dumb...

https://twitter.com/RepMTG/status/1539751476507066369

 

[Cheeky Monkey]

Oh slay can you see...

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

There's no hope for that country.

The only way anything is likely to change is if one of the supreme court or a senior politician is shot and killed. But, even then, I doubt it would be enough of an issue to even contemplate thinking about gun reform/control.

It would change nothing. If the whole of congress was machine gunned to death it would change nothing, other, perhaps, than ensure that all congressfolk are armed at all times. You can't **** with a birthright, and many Americans think we are fools to allow police to be armed (sometimes) and citizens not.

 

[bluenitsuj]

Americans. Enough said.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Australia controlled guns in the 1990s after a number of massacres. It hasn’t had an incident since. America is a massive outlier in that table above. The evidence seems overwhelming.

That's not because we don't have guns anymore. We have more guns now than we ever did.

When Howard undertook the gun buy back policy people just handed in their old guns to get the money to buy newer guns.

Now the number of people who own guns is less but the amount of guns every gun owner has has increased.

We just have a better mental health system in place is probably more the reason why.

 

[FatSuperman]

In 2020 there were 45,222 gun related deaths in the USA with a population of 330 million.In Europe, the E.U. estimate that there are 6,700 gun related deaths each year. The population of Europe is 748 million.

I’ll leave it there.

Only in America do people think it's ok for schools to teach kids how to use 'bulletproof blankets', and where 'bulletproof backpacks' are commonplace

 

[lasvegan]

The liberals on the court quite like the idea of a firing squad though…

https://www.thedenverchannel.com/ne...-with-inmate-who-wants-to-die-by-firing-squad

 

[Gabbafella]

No sympathy for this ****ed up, backwards country.

 

[beorhthelm]

if someone shots a pregnant woman and the fetus dies, is that a homicide?

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

Some of the more left leaning States have started to fight back against the recent SCOTUS decisions on loosening gun restrictions and banning abortion.

New York State has just acted to ban the carrying of hand guns in public places such as subways, hospitals and stadiums. They have also passed the Equal Rights Amendment which guarantees the rights to abortion and contraception and prohibits the government from discriminating again anyone based on a list of qualifications.

Enshrining the right to abortion in the Constitution will take longer

I imagine that these changes could well be challenged again in SCOTUS but at least its a start

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/01/nyregion/ny-guns-abortion-supreme-court.html?campaign_id=60&emc=edit_na_20220701&instance_id=0&nl=breaking-news&ref=cta&regi_id=56564702&segment_id=97449&user_id=4180feebac29b9e10fe3e6db6d77bd2c

 

[Stat Brother]

Some of the more left leaning States have started to fight back against the recent SCOTUS decisions on loosening gun restrictions and banning abortion.

New York State has just acted to ban the carrying of hand guns in public places such as subways, hospitals and stadiums. They have also passed the Equal Rights Amendment which guarantees the rights to abortion and contraception and prohibits the government from discriminating again anyone based on a list of qualifications.

Enshrining the right to abortion in the Constitution will take longer

I imagine that these changes could well be challenged again in SCOTUS but at least its a start

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/01/nyregion/ny-guns-abortion-supreme-court.html?campaign_id=60&emc=edit_na_20220701&instance_id=0&nl=breaking-news&ref=cta®i_id=56564702&segment_id=97449&user_id=4180feebac29b9e10fe3e6db6d77bd2c

Against the law to carry a hand gun in a hospital.

First step to communism.

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

Against the law to carry a hand gun in a hospital.

First step to communism.

Probably necessary when the patient finds out it's cost $50,000 to sort out his ingrowing toe nail

 

[Stat Brother]

Probably necessary when the patient finds out it's cost $50,000 to sort out his ingrowing toe nail

At least the victim won't have to scream:-

"Don't call an ambulance, I can't afford it"

 

[AmexRuislip]

[tweet]1544002469511979008[/tweet]

 

[driddles]

[tweet]1544002469511979008[/tweet]

It's a big one, 6 dead so far, 31 injured, suspect at large... Niece just came back from Highland Park yesterday, thank God she didn't stay for the parade.