Union Jack or Union Flag???

[Benjyman1990]

I am starting to get annoyed with the Olympics commentators.. Throughout the whole 2 weeks they've been switching between Union Jack and Union Flag, its almost as if they're trying to change it to flag because its fairer on everyone who isn't named Jack!? Perhaps i'm just thinking into it too much...

Was also thinking, i wonder what the gas bill will be like for keeping that cauldron burning for 16 days, extortionate i'd imagine!!!

 

[Acker79]

There is a belief that it is only the union jack when on a boat and should be the union flag at all other times. On an episode of QI it was shown that it was referred to as the union jack before it was used on a boat, and that 'union jack' is acceptable regardless of its use.

Some people are still picky, but I believe either is acceptable.

EDIT: More accurate, sourced info in my next post below.

 

[7:18]

There is a belief that it is only the union jack when on a boat and should be the union flag at all other times. On an episode of QI it was shown that it was referred to as the union jack before it was used on a boat, and that 'union jack' is acceptable regardless of its use.

Some people are still picky, but I believe either is acceptable.

couldnt have put it better myself

 

[Benjyman1990]

Thanks for the incite.. I just wish they'd make up their bloody mind!!!

 

[Acker79]

The Union Jack or The Union Flag?

When the 'Union Jack' was first introduced in 1606, it was known simply as 'the British flag' or 'the flag of Britain', and was ordered to be flown at the main masthead of all ships, warships and merchant ships, of both England and Scotland.

The first use of the name 'Union' appears in 1625. There are various theories as how it became known as the 'Union Jack', but most of the evidence points to the name being derived from the use of the word 'jack' as a diminutive. This word was in use before 1600 to describe a small flag flown from the small mast mounted on the bowsprit, and by 1627 it appears that a small version of the Union flag was commonly flown in this position. For some years it was called just 'the Jack', or 'Jack flag', or 'the King's Jack', but by 1674, while formally referred to as 'His Majesty's Jack', it was commonly called the Union Jack, and this was officially acknowledged.

...

It is often stated that the Union Flag should only be described as the Union Jack when flown in the bows of a warship, but this is a relatively recent idea. From early in its life the Admiralty itself frequently referred to the flag as the Union Jack, whatever its use, and in 1902 an Admiralty Circular announced that Their Lordships had decided that either name could be used officially. Such use was given Parliamentary approval in 1908 when it was stated that "the Union Jack should be regarded as the National flag".​

 

[Seagull on the wing]

There is a belief that it is only the union jack when on a boat and should be the union flag at all other times. On an episode of QI it was shown that it was referred to as the union jack before it was used on a boat, and that 'union jack' is acceptable regardless of its use.

Some people are still picky, but I believe either is acceptable.

That is almost correct...it's a Union Jack when flown from the Jackstaff when a British Naval ship is in harbour...it is not flown at sea,when a ship is at war stations the White ensign is flown aft with a battle ensign on the mast. When not being used by the navy it is a Union Flag.

 

[Acker79]

That is almost correct...it's a Union Jack when flown from the Jackstaff when a British Naval ship is in harbour...it is not flown at sea,when a ship is at war stations the White ensign is flown aft with a battle ensign on the mast. When not being used by the navy it is a Union Flag.

Did you reply before reading my next post:

The Union Jack or The Union Flag?

When the 'Union Jack' was first introduced in 1606, it was known simply as 'the British flag' or 'the flag of Britain', and was ordered to be flown at the main masthead of all ships, warships and merchant ships, of both England and Scotland.

The first use of the name 'Union' appears in 1625. There are various theories as how it became known as the 'Union Jack', but most of the evidence points to the name being derived from the use of the word 'jack' as a diminutive. This word was in use before 1600 to describe a small flag flown from the small mast mounted on the bowsprit, and by 1627 it appears that a small version of the Union flag was commonly flown in this position. For some years it was called just 'the Jack', or 'Jack flag', or 'the King's Jack', but by 1674, while formally referred to as 'His Majesty's Jack', it was commonly called the Union Jack, and this was officially acknowledged.

...

It is often stated that the Union Flag should only be described as the Union Jack when flown in the bows of a warship, but this is a relatively recent idea. From early in its life the Admiralty itself frequently referred to the flag as the Union Jack, whatever its use, and in 1902 an Admiralty Circular announced that Their Lordships had decided that either name could be used officially. Such use was given Parliamentary approval in 1908 when it was stated that "the Union Jack should be regarded as the National flag".​

 

[Jam The Man]

The Union Jack or The Union Flag?

When the 'Union Jack' was first introduced in 1606, it was known simply as 'the British flag' or 'the flag of Britain', and was ordered to be flown at the main masthead of all ships, warships and merchant ships, of both England and Scotland.

The first use of the name 'Union' appears in 1625. There are various theories as how it became known as the 'Union Jack', but most of the evidence points to the name being derived from the use of the word 'jack' as a diminutive. This word was in use before 1600 to describe a small flag flown from the small mast mounted on the bowsprit, and by 1627 it appears that a small version of the Union flag was commonly flown in this position. For some years it was called just 'the Jack', or 'Jack flag', or 'the King's Jack', but by 1674, while formally referred to as 'His Majesty's Jack', it was commonly called the Union Jack, and this was officially acknowledged.

...

It is often stated that the Union Flag should only be described as the Union Jack when flown in the bows of a warship, but this is a relatively recent idea. From early in its life the Admiralty itself frequently referred to the flag as the Union Jack, whatever its use, and in 1902 an Admiralty Circular announced that Their Lordships had decided that either name could be used officially. Such use was given Parliamentary approval in 1908 when it was stated that "the Union Jack should be regarded as the National flag".​

I'm always amazed that so few people know the gist of this...

 

[pork pie]

Did you reply before reading my next post:

To my understanding, and certainly as I was told when I was young, the term "Union Jack" only applies when the "Union Flag" is flying from a Flag Pole. This would suggest that the Royal Navy reference has become more widely used over time.

 

[User removed 4]

The Union Jack or The Union Flag?

When the 'Union Jack' was first introduced in 1606, it was known simply as 'the British flag' or 'the flag of Britain', and was ordered to be flown at the main masthead of all ships, warships and merchant ships, of both England and Scotland.

The first use of the name 'Union' appears in 1625. There are various theories as how it became known as the 'Union Jack', but most of the evidence points to the name being derived from the use of the word 'jack' as a diminutive. This word was in use before 1600 to describe a small flag flown from the small mast mounted on the bowsprit, and by 1627 it appears that a small version of the Union flag was commonly flown in this position. For some years it was called just 'the Jack', or 'Jack flag', or 'the King's Jack', but by 1674, while formally referred to as 'His Majesty's Jack', it was commonly called the Union Jack, and this was officially acknowledged.

...

It is often stated that the Union Flag should only be described as the Union Jack when flown in the bows of a warship, but this is a relatively recent idea. From early in its life the Admiralty itself frequently referred to the flag as the Union Jack, whatever its use, and in 1902 an Admiralty Circular announced that Their Lordships had decided that either name could be used officially. Such use was given Parliamentary approval in 1908 when it was stated that "the Union Jack should be regarded as the National flag".​

If scotland and england didnt join until 1707, how come the flag is supposed to incorporate the saltire , and how come that it was ordered to be flown from all english AND scottish ships from 1606 ? a good hundred years before we joined up ?

 

[smeariestbat]

Was also thinking, i wonder what the gas bill will be like for keeping that cauldron burning for 16 days, extortionate i'd imagine!!![/B]

i was thinking this too, not very green or energy efficient!

 

[Acker79]

Well, using the single most reliable website on the internet, wickipedia: Union Flag - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The origins of the Union flag date back to 1603, when James VI of Scotland inherited the English and Irish thrones (as James I), thereby uniting the crowns of England, Scotland and Ireland in a personal union (which remained separate states). On 12 April 1606, a new flag to represent this regal union between England and Scotland was specified in a royal decree, according to which the flag of England (a red cross on a white background, known as St George's Cross), and the flag of Scotland (a white saltire on a blue background, known as the Saltire or St Andrew's Cross), would be joined together, forming the flag of Great Britain and first union flag.

The current design dates from the Union of Great Britain and Ireland in 1801.[3] The flag consists of the red cross of Saint George (patron saint of England), edged in white, superimposed on the Cross of St Patrick (patron saint of Ireland), which are superimposed on the Saltire of Saint Andrew (patron saint of Scotland).​

The flag itself started in 1606 as:

And it evolved to the union jack we know today, which was adopted 1801.

 

[Acker79]

To my understanding, and certainly as I was told when I was young, the term "Union Jack" only applies when the "Union Flag" is flying from a Flag Pole. This would suggest that the Royal Navy reference has become more widely used over time.

That used to be my understanding, too. But after QI, I think I rather trust the Flag Institute on this.

 

[Rugrat]

Now that's cleared up can somebody explain to me "Great Britain and Northern Ireland"? I thought NI was a part of GB

 

[Southover Street Seagull]

Now that's cleared up can somebody explain to me "Great Britain and Northern Ireland"? I thought NI was a part of GB

Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
The two islands of Britain and Ireland make up what's called the British Isles.
Britain or Great Britain is therefore separate from Northern Ireland which is in the island of Ireland.

 

[Acker79]

Now that's cleared up can somebody explain to me "Great Britain and Northern Ireland"? I thought NI was a part of GB

GB = England, Scotland and Wales.
UK = GB and NI.

The clump of land that makes up England Scotland and Wales is Great Britain, has been since the Roman invasion. Well, it was just Britain for a while, but then in the middle ages it became Great Britain again to distinguish it from Brittany, apparently. Since Northern Island is part of the clump of land always known as Ireland, we can't just claim it as part of Britain. It would be like including the Falklands in "Great Britain". It's a physically separate entity.

 

[Rugrat]

GB = England, Scotland and Wales.
UK = GB and NI.

The clump of land that makes up England Scotland and Wales is Great Britain, has been since the Roman invasion. Well, it was just Britain for a while, but then in the middle ages it became Great Britain again to distinguish it from Brittany, apparently. Since Northern Island is part of the clump of land always known as Ireland, we can't just claim it as part of Britain. It would be like including the Falklands in "Great Britain". It's a physically separate entity.

Thank you ... that's my little bit of learning today!

 

[daveinprague]

Was taught at RN Signals school that the Union Jack is the pole at the sharp end of the ship, that you fly the Union flag from when in harbour.

 

[34064 Fighter Command]

Absolutely. The flag is a piece of material, the 'jack' is the mast you hoist it up on...........

Therefore the Union 'Jack' is the Union Flag ONLY when it is flown from a jack mast. But it is still a flag ( on a mast ), not a 'jack' ( which is the mast itself ).

So I'll stick with Union Flag for now.

 

[Boris Yeltsin]

On a related note, did anyone else notice how many times the flag (whether it be the Union Jack or Union Flag) was hung or draped UPSIDE DOWN...