BrightonCottager
Well-known member
I thought firefighters retired at 50?
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[Politics] UK state pension age will soon need to rise to 71, say experts
- Thread starter Mustafa II
- Start date
- Aug 24, 2020
- 7,103
Scale it up. Save more lives. Share your experience of firefighting with thousands of others on Youtube.
Become an 'expert, experienced' fireman on Youtube.
What is the worst that can happen? You don't make any money. So what? Think up of the upside.
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,828
Governments borrow money all the time so they could borrow to pay the pensions if they wanted to. It’s purely a political choice. It was a political choice to abolish slavery for which they borrowed money to compensate the slave owners in this country. Not the slaves of course, they got their freedom but no money. The money was borrowed to pay off the rich slave owners to get the act through Parliament. This Act was passed in 1833 (Wiki) and the money was finally paid off in 2015.
So rather than blame baby boomers like me, ask yourself why Parliament won’t pay the pensions. They have never invested in pension funds and have always funded pensions from the existing workforce. It is their short sightedness that has led us to this and has been known about for a very long time.
So rather than blame baby boomers like me, ask yourself why Parliament won’t pay the pensions. They have never invested in pension funds and have always funded pensions from the existing workforce. It is their short sightedness that has led us to this and has been known about for a very long time.
Seat Stealer
Active member
- Jun 23, 2012
- 318
Whats youtube?
- Aug 24, 2020
- 7,103
Google it. Go on google, enter 'Youtube' and hit enter.
On a serious note, isn't it a tragedy that when old gits like us (I'm the same age as you), leave to retire, a wealth of experience, know-how etc, walk out the door?
Not sure where you got that from??
And central government also places a limit on the amount a local authority can raise council taxes (without holding a local referendum). 4.99% again this year (less if they don't have social care responsibilities) - so, below inflation.
BrightonCottager
Well-known member
I used to work for a large Government agency and when a colleague (who was about 58) left on an early release scheme his boss (an ambitious younger person in their late 30s) actually said out loud , "Oh I wish we could plug a USB stick into your brain, to download all your knowledge."
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,017
was looking at some government and think tank data. it was murky finding simple numbers. interesting here the graph shows funding per person, that halved in the shires. browsing the doc linked, page 17 shows large increases in social care spending. and a total number far higher than i remember seeing. concluding local goverment is a proper mess.
East Staffs Gull
Well-known member
I fully understand the sentiment, but having a dependence on people who have retained all this experience and knowledge in their head, without having previously passed it on or documented it, is not good management. Effective management would not permit such dependencies.
BenGarfield
Active member
Indeed, but only partially true, as I have pointed out many times on this site, I know to the exasperation of many, tax and national insurance contributions don`t fund any government expenditure. The basic assumptions made in the Guardian artilce are wrong. The national exchequer doesnt operate like a household. As a currency issuer, the government can issue as much money as it likes, it can never run out of money, nor does it need to "borrow". It creates new money when it spends and destroys money when it taxes. Bonds are issued as a tool for monetary policy, and to provide funds for investors many of whom are pension funds, so in a sense all private pensions are state pensions too. It would make more sense to scrap the issue of bonds altogether., and have a generous state pension for everyone. The only limit on government expenditure is inflation. One of the roles of taxation and Natonal Insurance is to help curb demand when inflation is too high. I see no need, therefore to raise the pension age.
- Aug 24, 2020
- 7,103
That sounds great, and it would be the ideal, but in my experience, that has never happened. When I was a contract test analyst in over 20 end clients, from wholesale and investment banking, to pensions, software houses and greenfield tech startups, it didn't happen like that. They all thought they knew best, and so only paid lip service to knowledge transfer from the hired help.
A few of those clients are no longer with us, including HBOS, Equitable Life and Northern Rock.
Doonhamer7
Well-known member
- Jun 17, 2016
- 1,454
like all newspaper articles it needs to read taking into the bias that the journalist has spun on it.
a few observations, when my company had a final salary pension scheme (so this would be c2000) I remembered chatting to one of the trustees who said that for our pension fund stats were that if you retired at 62 you were paid out a pension for an average of 10.5 years. If you retired at 65 it was less than 3years. Now this may have been influenced by the number of blue collared workers we had at the offshore yards up in Scotland. So if we have to work to 71 we will probably see a payout of a couple of years tops.
I remember chatting to an hr manager about 10years ago (at a very large life assurance company) he said they were already planning for the first case of white collared workers not being fit enough for their jobs as there was no longer forced retirement allowed. We’d probably have to see lots of performance management on the older staff to force them out so there was no age discrimination charges bought.
White collared jobs may not be as physically draining but the expectations get higher by the year so stress (the silent killer) rises bringing lower life expectations.
all western govts know immigration isn’t popular (see Brexit) but they have to do it to bring in younger workers to pay for an ageing population. Angela Merkel knew this was going to be a big issue in Germany thus why there were a couple of million of Turks allowed in to Germany (they didn’t have former colonies to attract from) this in turn has had a knock on effect which worryingly has attributed to the rise of the AfD. similar issues as populist right wing parties have driven anti-immigrations in Netherlands and Scandavia. The more closed societies of South Korea, Japan, and China have a very immediate problem as they have population regrowths of as low as 1.2 kids per woman (2.1 is needed to sustain a population).
so overall we have a big issue that no democracy knows how to solve!
the government itself advises you need a pension of £50k (assuming no mortgage) as a couple to have a comfortable life, that is probably well beyond those without dual income final salary pensions
a few observations, when my company had a final salary pension scheme (so this would be c2000) I remembered chatting to one of the trustees who said that for our pension fund stats were that if you retired at 62 you were paid out a pension for an average of 10.5 years. If you retired at 65 it was less than 3years. Now this may have been influenced by the number of blue collared workers we had at the offshore yards up in Scotland. So if we have to work to 71 we will probably see a payout of a couple of years tops.
I remember chatting to an hr manager about 10years ago (at a very large life assurance company) he said they were already planning for the first case of white collared workers not being fit enough for their jobs as there was no longer forced retirement allowed. We’d probably have to see lots of performance management on the older staff to force them out so there was no age discrimination charges bought.
White collared jobs may not be as physically draining but the expectations get higher by the year so stress (the silent killer) rises bringing lower life expectations.
all western govts know immigration isn’t popular (see Brexit) but they have to do it to bring in younger workers to pay for an ageing population. Angela Merkel knew this was going to be a big issue in Germany thus why there were a couple of million of Turks allowed in to Germany (they didn’t have former colonies to attract from) this in turn has had a knock on effect which worryingly has attributed to the rise of the AfD. similar issues as populist right wing parties have driven anti-immigrations in Netherlands and Scandavia. The more closed societies of South Korea, Japan, and China have a very immediate problem as they have population regrowths of as low as 1.2 kids per woman (2.1 is needed to sustain a population).
so overall we have a big issue that no democracy knows how to solve!
the government itself advises you need a pension of £50k (assuming no mortgage) as a couple to have a comfortable life, that is probably well beyond those without dual income final salary pensions
Nicks
Well-known member
I worked in the crane industry as an Appointed Person with 40 years experience.
I finished my last contract in July, six months before official retirement.
I took the summer off and went to the States to watch the Albion , done all the away European games then got bored so got myself a little driving job delivering prescriptions for a pharmacy 3 days a week.
Completely opposite to working on site etc.
All the knowledge I could share would be wasted as all most companies want these days is a bloke with a ticket who is willing to bend a few rules to get the job done sadly.
I done 4 years in Hinkley Point C and the amount of near misses and accidents occurring in there will only get greater sadly as they are desperate for men in that place. In the end it cost me my job as I wasn't afraid to speak my mind .
Yes. Global issue in the 1st world.
Globally, 10% of the population are over 65 (and that includes countries like Bangladesh where everyone is 15). By 2050 that will be 16% and by 2100 it will top 25%.
In Japan, for example, 1 in 10 are over 80. And 30% are over 65. With a very low birth rate, they are in a far worse state than us.
This is not a question of the rich hoarding the wealth, it's global aging and it is a bloody time bomb.
I’m just frantically saving and plan on stashing that somehere and then I’ll go on benefits at about 60.
HalfaSeatOn
Well-known member
Talk of means testing but at what level? Eye opening levels of retirement income for moderate/comfortable living standards
www.retirementlivingstandards.org.uk
Home - PLSA - Retirement Living Standards
Home - The Retirement Living Standards have been developed to help us to picture what kind of lifestyle we could have in retirement.
Still saving for the canal boat?
Still saving for the canal boat?
I am. Though I think I’ll get a place on dry land for the winters. Maybe a static home somewhere?
My research on living aboard suggests it can be quite hard in winter. Plus, do I want to be living on a boat as I creep into my dotage? Could be tricky.
Tom Hark Preston Park
Will Post For Cash
- Jul 6, 2003
- 72,344
UK state pension age will soon need to rise to 71, say experts
Research on life expectancy and birth rates shows that ill health makes status quo unsustainablewww.theguardian.com
Yet another reminder of how good the boomers have it, and how the younger generations will receive blow after blow.
That'll be the generation that had very little in the 60s and 70s, when HASAW was non-existent, sick pay rarely a benefit for lower paid workers, where you'd do any job so long as you didn't have to sign on, and the generation that innovated for the betterment of today. We all offer something and no doubt the next generations may look back and think we had it easy, we didn't. I left school at fifteen, a combination of being a bit stupid and family financial necessity.