[News] Two shootings in north London - 17yo girl dead

[Falmer Flutter ©]

Is 'missing the point' on here now an official passtime?

You think this "prevailing attitude" is exclusive to inner-city kids and to kids of this generation? Nope, you've completely lost me.

 

[alfredmizen]

Silly comments ? Distraction ? distraction from what Alf ? There are a lot less guns in the UK than there are in America, thats effectively what I said, you disagree on principle because you have to be contrary or are you going to argue the numbers ?

no mate , you said we dont have easy access to guns , i contradicted you , admittedly wevdont have as easy access as america , you never mentioned numbers etc , then in response you started asking childishly cryptic questions like "why would that be ?" in short , grow up.

 

[vegster]

no mate , you said we dont have easy access to guns , i contradicted you , admittedly wevdont have as easy access as america , you never mentioned numbers etc , then in response you started asking childishly cryptic questions like "why would that be ?" in short , grow up.

I'm struggling to see your point as it's as flimsy as usual. I and another poster were comparing NYC to ourselves and we don't have as easy access to guns in the UK. You have just admitted it yourself, so why do you persist on arguing ? Yes, why would it be that "you could get a gun if you wanted one ". So just to clarify so you can get it clearly in your head, in an earlier post I said " It's harder to gain access to guns in the UK than it is NYC " and you have managed to agree and disagree with that sentence, you are amazing.

 

[Hungry Joe]

You think this "prevailing attitude" is exclusive to inner-city kids and to kids of this generation? Nope, you've completely lost me.

The point is about the skewed idea of what they think they can realistically earn and the chances of them actually succeeding in these fields to do so. The majority were from ethnic minorities and deprived backgrounds. How else are they going to think they can get rich quick when they realise they haven't got a chance of being the next Danny Rose or Stormzy? Join a gang, sell some drugs etc. The fact that he was a nuclear physicist is beside the point, he could have been anything other than those chosen professions and they wouldn't have been any different. They genuinely thought he was a) joking and b) on shit money. Surely that's a concern? He was specifically asked to do this tough gig because, apart from being a physicist, he was relatively young, a bit of a hipster and also played in a band, so the teachers hoped the kids would relate to him....no chance. Clearer?

 

[Questions]

Maybe, just maybe, there was no gang violence, because there were no gangs?

“ Old Teds coming over tonight with his bloody gang again”, said Horace as he leant on the farm gate.

 

[Questions]

Strange that no one has mentioned that this comment is an echo of a statement made by a Metropolitan Police Assistant Commissioner less than two weeks ago,and quoted extensively on news media.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-43491155/police-are-black-knife-deaths-being-ignored

"Knife deaths aren't causing the outrage they should because the majority of victims come from black communities, a top UK officer says.
Twenty-six people have been murdered with knives this year so far in London – the majority from black communities.
Martin Hewitt, Met Police Assistant Commissioner, is calling for more efforts to prevent this."

That’s what sprung to mind when I first read his post. It maybe was a rhetorical question. Nobody is that crass are they ? I admit to never having taken in any of his posts before.

 

[Eeyore]

Black on Black . Who really cares ?

I've never really totally said what I thought about your views on race issues. I don't need to now.

The girl was an innocent bystander.

If you knew that, well.

 

[Questions]

I'm struggling to see your point as it's as flimsy as usual. I and another poster were comparing NYC to ourselves and we don't have as easy access to guns in the UK. You have just admitted it yourself, so why do you persist on arguing ? Yes, why would it be that "you could get a gun if you wanted one ". So just to clarify so you can get it clearly in your head, in an earlier post I said " It's harder to gain access to guns in the UK than it is NYC " and you have managed to agree and disagree with that sentence, you are amazing.

He’s found a friend to argue with I see.

 

[vegster]

He’s found a friend to argue with I see.

I think it's ADHD.... Not on my part might I add.

 

[seagullsslimjim]

And another murder tonight in Hackney...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-43649193

A man in his early 20s has died after being stabbed in east London, the Metropolitan Police say.

Police said a man with stab wounds had approached officers in Link Street, Hackney, just before 20:00 BST.

He was given first aid, but was pronounced dead at the scene about 25 minutes later.

 

[The Clamp]

Whilst it may not be as difficult to source a gun in this country as in the US there are some fundamental differences. For basics in the US, you walk into Walmart and buy exactly what you want. In the UK you get what you're given. Likelyhood is it will be a cheap Russian copy, will fire 3/10 times, will not have the right ammo, will probably have been used in one or more crimes previously and will be loaned to you by an utter psychopath.So no, it doesn't surprise me Alfremizen can get hold of one.

 

[Crackpot]

And another murder tonight in Hackney...

And on it goes. Happened yesterday,then today,and probably tomorrow too. Rinse and repeat, ad infinitum.

To deal with the problem it must be correctly diagnosed.If accuracy is being avoided because of political correctness,then little will change.

 

[Gwylan]

The point is about the skewed idea of what they think they can realistically earn and the chances of them actually succeeding in these fields to do so. The majority were from ethnic minorities and deprived backgrounds. How else are they going to think they can get rich quick when they realise they haven't got a chance of being the next Danny Rose or Stormzy? Join a gang, sell some drugs etc. The fact that he was a nuclear physicist is beside the point, he could have been anything other than those chosen professions and they wouldn't have been any different. They genuinely thought he was a) joking and b) on shit money. Surely that's a concern? He was specifically asked to do this tough gig because, apart from being a physicist, he was relatively young, a bit of a hipster and also played in a band, so the teachers hoped the kids would relate to him....no chance. Clearer?

And that mirrors my experiences too. I've done a few projects with kids and that's the prevailing attitude.

I'm not convinced that it's always been the case: I don't recall a single person from my classes at primary or secondary school saying they wanted to be footballer or pop star when they were old. In fact, I quite specifically recall in my final year at primary school, that the boy who was, by some distance, the best footballer saying that he had no thoughts of playing professionally as he knew he wouldn't be good enough and he had to get a proper job (he became an accountant).

If someone at any of my schools had any glamorous plans, he or she kept very quiet about them.

 

[Hungry Joe]

And that mirrors my experiences too. I've done a few projects with kids and that's the prevailing attitude.

I'm not convinced that it's always been the case: I don't recall a single person from my classes at primary or secondary school saying they wanted to be footballer or pop star when they were old. In fact, I quite specifically recall in my final year at primary school, that the boy who was, by some distance, the best footballer saying that he had no thoughts of playing professionally as he knew he wouldn't be good enough and he had to get a proper job (he became an accountant).

If someone at any of my schools had any glamorous plans, he or she kept very quiet about them.

Indeed. My best mate I mentioned earlier who lives in Tottenham taught his whole working life in London schools before taking early retirement. When he says that he 'lost the kids' I listened because I knew just how popular and respected he was with his pupils. By the time he felt he couldn't take it anymore he said the ones who actually listened, took on-board advice, had something of game plan outside 'wanting to be famous' (even when they had no discernible talent) were the very odd exception, especially amongst the boys, but increasingly amongst the girls too. One of his ex-pupils ended up pulling a knife on him at his local bus stop. Just imagine that, utterly soul-destroying.

And you're right about it being an increasingly modern way of thinking, which is not exclusive to, but is more prevalent in deprived inner city schools. I've noticed the increase in this sense of entitlement from school leavers coming into my workplace too, usually from people who don't have the education or skills to back any of it up. The media has a lot to answer for in this regard, but I just don't know what all the reasons or answers are. My brother is also a teacher but in a 'good' Sussex school whose intake is a real mix of middle class and working class kids. He's been teaching for over 30 years now and says pretty much the same, so god knows how teachers, support workers etc cope in inner cities. Anyone who thinks this is just us getting older and becoming out of touch is sadly sticking their heads in the sand. It's a real problem and it is linked with the increasing violence and general anti-social behaviour in this country.

 

[daveinprague]

A lot of this is being fueled by gangs, and the selling of drugs. I doubt if the people supplying drugs to the gangs care too much. I doubt they are the same colour as the kids in these gangs either.
Theres also the influence from the USA, that being in a gang is somehow glamorous.

 

[Two Professors]

A lot of this is being fueled by gangs, and the selling of drugs. I doubt if the people supplying drugs to the gangs care too much. I doubt they are the same colour as the kids in these gangs either.
Theres also the influence from the USA, that being in a gang is somehow glamorous.

Indeed.And most of the weapons are provided by white gunsmiths,like the recent case in Kitts Green.

 

[FIVESTEPS]

A relation of a friend, there son got involved in some gang trouble and was promptly shipped off to boarding school in Nairobi Kenya.

 

[Eeyore]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43653291

David Lammy on the BBC.

Police concerns over eastern European gangs.

 

[Titanic]

Seven murders in a week in London... have we heard anything from the Mayor Sadiq Khan? Has he made an public statements, interviews, visited communities or bereaved families?

I would have expected him to be 'front and centre' on this. It seem a bit odd to me.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Seven murders in a week in London... have we heard anything from the Mayor Sadiq Khan? Has he made an public statements, interviews, visited communities or bereaved families?

I would have expected him to be 'front and centre' on this. It seem a bit odd to me.

Seven murders in a week in London... have we heard anything from everyone’s favourite mod [MENTION=36]Titanic[/MENTION]? If he distastefully trying to make political capital out of bereaved families?

Yes. Sadly I expected him to be 'front and centre' on this. Does not seem a bit odd to me.