[Misc] Twelve months paid leave for the male menopause

[GT49er]

I've taken time off work for depression. Work was contributing to my condition. I and my family are very glad I did because if I hadn't there is no guarantee that I would be here now.

Not sure if in your eyes that makes me a snowflake as your posts suggest but thankfully that attitude is out of step with with current thinking around mental health.

I guess to answer your question, if work is adding to clinical depression then yes everybody experiencing this should be able to take time off.

I guess the thrust of your post is that people can take time off on whim, but of course it requires a visit to the doctors and a diagnosis of a serious condition.

I would suggest the midlife crisis jibe is a poor attempt to undermine the severity and seriousness of the depression you mentioned in the previous sentence and it does you a disservice.

I never said people can take time off at whim! They (quite rightly) can't!

The symptoms described, however, are exactly what thousands of people feel simply because of the pressures of their job - but there's mortgages to be paid, kids to be fed, so you go back into work, week after week after week after bloody miserable week! I did! Yes, for sick leave (above a week, I think?) you need a doctor's certificate - even with these though, your sick leave can lead to a disciplinary hearing and ultimately dismissal on the grounds of inefficiency due to ill health. It happens all the time, in the Civil Service for example

 

[nicko31]

Rather belittling to call it the “male menopause”

It’s called the Andropause and is the drop in testosterone some men experience. Can cause a variety of symptoms.

Plus I very much doubt many work places will grant many men the year off.

Load of cobblers.

Murdoch press again, sigh...

 

[BadFish]

I never said people can take time off at whim! They (quite rightly) can't!

The symptoms described, however, are exactly what thousands of people feel simply because of the pressures of their job - but there's mortgages to be paid, kids to be fed, so you go back into work, week after week after week after bloody miserable week! I did! Yes, for sick leave (above a week, I think?) you need a doctor's certificate - even with these though, your sick leave can lead to a disciplinary hearing and ultimately dismissal on the grounds of inefficiency due to ill health. It happens all the time, in the Civil Service for example

Makes me thankful for organisations like this one trying to do things better. Pity those who are creating a better system and those using it have to be labelled snowflakes.

I am sorry you didn't get the support you needed in your job. I wish things were better for you.

 

[JBizzle]

Webpage Archive is all you need. An exert from the article:

"East Midlands Ambulance Service will take into account the experiences of male members of staff who are suffering from menopause-like symptoms such as mood swings and irritability, a lack of enthusiasm or energy, and finding it hard to sleep. Measures will also include providing extra uniforms and changing shift patterns.
Written guidance hosted online by the NHS employment body states that male staff should be provided with portable fans and heaters and be able to claim time off if they need it."

Like it or not, there is a whiff of snowflake! And frankly, the symptoms described are those suffered by thousands of men (and women) stuck in a job they absolutely hate, despairing as every Monday morning comes roumd again. Many suffer from this for years.

This thread has snowflake all over it, but as usual its from those hypersensitive right-wingers getting upset about something in the mid-distance that that has no impact on them, but makes them feel sad about the way of the world these days.

How this even merited a thread is beyond me other than the usual frothing headline grabbing. My view, FWIW, good on them. Male mental health is far too easily dismissed with a casual "man up", so having that support is a good thing whether it's needed or not.

 

[GT49er]

This thread has snowflake all over it, but as usual its from those hypersensitive right-wingers getting upset about something in the mid-distance that that has no impact on them, but makes them feel sad about the way of the world these days.

How this even merited a thread is beyond me other than the usual frothing headline grabbing. My view, FWIW, good on them. Male mental health is far too easily dismissed with a casual "man up", so having that support is a good thing whether it's needed or not.

"................ mood swings and irritability, a lack of enthusiasm or energy, and finding it hard to sleep."

Those common things that happen every day to thousands of people are mental health now these days? Geez - god help us all!

 

[BadFish]

The article creates the whiff of snowflake because there's perhaps an agenda to do so. The actual guidance from East Midlands Ambulance Service (some of which I've pasted below) is a bit more than that and shows them to be a good employer and also not one that will enable people to take the p*ss. It's a chunk of text, but clears up any implication this is anything but a measured response to a genuine issue and one which supports employees and employers. From reading this and from what I know professionally I very much doubt anyone can just go and claim to be experiencing symptoms and get time off and if they do that's a failing of an individual manager, not of a policy. Yes, mood swings and irritability are symptoms, but those alone won't get anyone time off:

"Some of the severe complications associated with the andropause include an increased risk of cardiovascular problems and potentially osteoporosis better known as brittle bone.

If it is suspected that a male is encountering the andropause, he must seek advice from his GP who will then undertake a blood test to ascertain the levels of testosterone in the blood. The test will also rule out other factors that are also associated with low testosterone before giving the definitive outcome of possible andropause.

When managing attendance, consideration needs to be given to any issues related to andropause including the signs, symptoms and side effects of the treatment being received. The Line Manager will need to ensure that the male member of staff is not put at a detriment either by capability discussions or applying attendance sanctions outside of the reasonable adjustments agreed by the Trust, Occupational Health and the individual.

Line managers need to be supportive and maintain awareness so that men are not embarrassed to approach him/her to discuss how the andropause is affecting their health and role at work. The symptoms can interfere with everyday life and happiness, so it’s important that support is put in place so that the male is confident to look for medical advice to find the underlying cause and work out what can be done to resolve the issue. The male should not be placed in a position of embarrassment where they are expected to suffer in silence but to have the support offered to be able to identify the issue is real.

Remember that perception of the individual is a reality to them so do not dismiss what they are saying. Regular, informal conversations between manager and employee may enable discussion of changes in health, including issues relating to the andropause. It may be valuable simply to acknowledge this is a normal stage of life and that adjustments can easily be made. Such conversations can identify the support mechanisms such as PAM Assist that can help and encourage them to discuss any relevant health concerns also to ensure they consult with their GP.

General health and wellbeing discussions should naturally form part of the discussion in one to ones or the PDR process and managers should maintain confidentiality when addressing health information associated with the andropause.

Reasonable adjustments should be considered for all males that disclose that they are experiencing the andropause. Reasonable adjustments should be made on a case by case basis as no 2 cases will be identical. If in doubt, please refer to the HRA/Senior HR or HRBP for further advice and support. The advice from occupational health can also be used to assist implementing any changes or potential reasonable adjustment.

Flexible working – may be considered for staff experiencing debilitating symptoms. Shift patterns and start/finish times may be adjusted temporarily to enable staff to work productively. Flexibility should be given for staff needing to attend medical appointments associated with andropause symptoms and also for men seeking advice relating to the andropause. Phased returns may be supported for staff suffering with severe impairment. This will be particularly beneficial for those who are taking medication for the condition."

And so it goes on. I fail to see where there's an issue.

Thanks for this slice of sanity among the Murdoch press madness.

 

[Gabbafella]

Depression, loss of sex drive, erectile dysfunction, emotional issues......sounds very much like marriage.

 

[AmexRuislip]

Rather belittling to call it the “male menopause”

It’s called the Andropause and is the drop in testosterone some men experience. Can cause a variety of symptoms.

Plus I very much doubt many work places will grant many men the year off.

Load of cobblers.

Some of the symptoms that come under the male menopause, are akin to prostrate cancer and its side effects.
Fortunately for me I haven't had anything so severe.
Whereas some of the guys I chat to at rhe PC meet ups talk of hot flushes, sore nipples and general tiredness, all from HRT.

 

[rogersix]

Calm down dear

Just pointing out another reason the NHS doesn’t have the resources it needs. There are many, many others of course. Some justified, others less so. I would suggest that this falls into the latter category.

As for why I care? I just like to make some people aware that, yes, the current bunch of Tories are crap, but there other factors that can stretch the NHS to breaking point.

Absolute peak woody!

 

[Greg Bobkin]

"................ mood swings and irritability, a lack of enthusiasm or energy, and finding it hard to sleep."

Those common things that happen every day to thousands of people are mental health now these days? Geez - god help us all!

Or just EMPLOYERS help us all...

Mental health (the symptoms of which include those that you've listed above) is obviously a MASSIVE thing in this day and age. It's funny (but clearly NOT funny) that a lot of right-wingers – many of whom are probably RAGING at this story – were positively frothing at the gash a week or two ago about what Ava Evans said in response to Geoff Norcott's comments about male suicide. But now when an organisation seems to want to do something about it – and look after its employees – they go against what they were getting angry about before and the old 'snowflake' trope comes out.

As I've said before, some people aren't happy unless they are complaining about something. Anything, seemingly. Whether it has ANY bearing on their life or not

 

[Weststander]

Where do I sign up?

 

[basque seagull]

Calm down dear

Just pointing out another reason the NHS doesn’t have the resources it needs. There are many, many others of course. Some justified, others less so. I would suggest that this falls into the latter category.

As for why I care? I just like to make some people aware that, yes, the current bunch of Tories are crap, but there other factors that can stretch the NHS to breaking point.

"That’s the standard technique of privatization: defund, make sure things don’t work, people get angry, you hand it over to private capital."
Noam Chomsky,

 

[Klaas]

Well'quick'woody (and GT 49er) in 'Didn't bother to read something properly and getting knickers in a twist over right wing media sound byte' shock!

WQW must hold the record for threads that have been roundly mocked on here.

 

[wellquickwoody]

Well'quick'woody (and GT 49er) in 'Didn't bother to read something properly shocker

Care to elaborate? Or shall I just treat it as a very poor attempt to deflect from the actual topic and chuck random insults around?

 

[worthingweird]

I'm actually suffering with something similar due to Prostate cancer, the treatment includes lowering your testosterone levels, the hot flushes are weird to say the least, i'm carrying on though...

 

[BadFish]

Well'quick'woody (and GT 49er) in 'Didn't bother to read something properly and getting knickers in a twist over right wing media sound byte' shock!

WQW must hold the record for threads that have been roundly mocked on here.

Some people just love to be outraged by stuff.
Some newspapers just love to make people outraged.
Its Murdoch's preferred combination.

 

[pastafarian]

Rather belittling to call it the “male menopause”

It’s called the Andropause and is the drop in testosterone some men experience. Can cause a variety of symptoms.

Plus I very much doubt many work places will grant many men the year off.

Load of cobblers.

prob best you get facts right before saying its the drop in testosterone

The "male menopause" (sometimes called the andropause) is an unhelpful term sometimes used in the media.
This label is misleading because it suggests the symptoms are the result of a sudden drop in testosterone in middle age, similar to what occurs in the female menopause. This is not true.

Although testosterone levels fall as men age, the decline is steady at about 1% a year from around the age of 30 to 40, and this is unlikely to cause any problems in itself.

A testosterone deficiency that develops later in life, also known as late-onset hypogonadism, can sometimes be responsible for these symptoms, but in many cases the symptoms are nothing to do with hormones.

The 'male menopause'

Read about "male menopause", where some men develop depression, loss of sex drive, erectile dysfunction and other physical and emotional symptoms when they reach their late 40s to early 50s.

www.nhs.uk

 

[pastafarian]

Quick side note, had a groupworkplace awareness session few weeks ago on the male menopause,, it was interesting to note the males in the training where quite interested to learn what on earth the male menopause was, the whole thing descended into chaos though because every female in the training refused to recognize that the male menopause was a thing and was instead something invented by men for male patriarchy or something.

clearly cant please all people ll of the time

 

[The Clamp]

Quick side note, had a groupworkplace awareness session few weeks ago on the male menopause,, it was interesting to note the males in the training where quite interested to learn what on earth the male menopause was, the whole thing descended into chaos though because every female in the training refused to recognize that the male menopause was a thing and was instead something invented by men for male patriarchy or something.

clearly cant please all people ll of the time

Oh you had a session at work. I bow to your extensive knowledge

 

[Cotton Socks]

Oh you had a session at work. I bow to your extensive knowledge

That's a bit harsh. Does your knowledge extend to critical evaluation of peer reviewed journals? I only know about it as been posted here!