Trump

[dingodan]

I think most people's dislike of Trump is about what they hear coming out of his mouth. People don't need documented evidence of his wrong doings, they can see for themselves that he is a classless, bulling oaf who courts controversy and seeks to divide people. We don't need biased secondary evidence to show us this. We have the evidence of our ears and eyes. This is not double standards as Biden is not these things.

I have not seen a single person, poster on here or anywhere else suggest that Biden is anything more than the least worst of the two. He is not painted as some sort of saviour of the USA and by extension the free world. He is simply not the classes, bulling, devisive oaf that people see Trump as. All the guff about Russian and Chinese conspiracies is just a side show, one that in my opinion works in Trumps favour as is distracts the voter from his horrendous personality. To me this election comes down to a pretty simple choice: Divisive, bulling oaf V doddery old career, establishment politician.

I wish that this election was about politics and what is best for the Amercian people but I am not nieve enough to think it is the case. I watched the two debates betwen the candidates and it was notable how little policies were discussed. Lets face it, if it was about policies and working for the American people then Saunders would have made it much further in the race.

I don't think it is double standards at all, I think that lots of people just don't like Trump and for good reason. It is highly disingenuous to questions people's motives for disliking him given what they see and hear him say and do. As I have said, no-one is turning a blind eye to Biden's failings. Most people on balance just think that he is a bit better than Trump.

You hit the nail squarely on the head. But I would just point out a couple of things.

Everything above in bold is true.

Trump has not, in policy terms, been a bad President, on balance - in policy terms, he's been a fairly good President.

Trump has had his Presidency characterized as a failure, a disaster etc, because everything above in bold is true.

We can certainly agree to disagree on this or that particular policy issue, but he has been under attack not so much for what he has done, but for who he is and what he has said. What he has done and who he is have been conflated to suit those who hate him.

It's also the case that he has been characterized as a crook and a criminal because everything above in bold is true. There isn't actually any substantial evidence to back that up, people are willing to say it and believe it because they hate him and because everything above in bold is true.

Even with everything I've just said, I'm not that bothered, in many ways it's par for the course.

But. Biden is a crook. It's fair enough to say, well Biden is the lesser of two evils, but one is a shitty person, and the other is a charming (hardly but you know, more charming), corrupt Washington politician. If you have your standards the right way around you should probably prefer Trumps shitty personality over Biden's shady dealings, because this should be about more than just a personality contest. It should be about policy, It should be about acting lawfully, over pretty much everything else.

People seem to see this election as a good guy vs a piece of shit. No it's a corrupt Washington politician vs a piece of shit. Which is worse I guess is in the eye of the beholder, but I personally have a tremendous dislike for corrupt Washington politicians. For all of Trumps faults, of which there are many, he isn't one of them. Even if you don't agree, don't be blind to what Biden is just because you hate Trump. That does seem to me to be what the media have done.

I just hate the idea of people feeling like they don't care about what someone does and if they are shady and corrupt, as long as their delivery is good and they talk the talk and come across well on TV. That's the kind of attitude which lets the rot set in.

 

[Stato]

Anyone truly concerned about corruption in US politics would have been putting ideology aside and supporting Elizabeth Warren who actually has a plan rather than just a slogan. After she didn't win the nomination, they would be supporting the candidate with whom she has been having regular policy discussions: https://www.axios.com/warren-biden-influence-policies-76513650-bf21-4f32-8ca5-68802b35ebe9.html

 

[BadFish]

You hit the nail squarely on the head. But I would just point out a couple of things.

Everything above in bold is true.

Trump has not, in policy terms, been a bad President, on balance - in policy terms, he's been a fairly good President.

Trump has had his Presidency characterized as a failure, a disaster etc, because everything above in bold is true.

We can certainly agree to disagree on this or that particular policy issue, but he has been under attack not so much for what he has done, but for who he is and what he has said. What he has done and who he is have been conflated to suit those who hate him.

It's also the case that he has been characterized as a crook and a criminal because everything above in bold is true. There isn't actually any substantial evidence to back that up, people are willing to say it and believe it because they hate him and because everything above in bold is true.

Even with everything I've just said, I'm not that bothered, in many ways it's par for the course.

But. Biden is a crook. It's fair enough to say, well Biden is the lesser of two evils, but one is a shitty person, and the other is a charming (hardly but you know, more charming), corrupt Washington politician. If you have your standards the right way around you should probably prefer Trumps shitty personality over Biden's shady dealings, because this should be about more than just a personality contest. It should be about policy, It should be about acting lawfully, over pretty much everything else.

People seem to see this election as a good guy vs a piece of shit. No it's a corrupt Washington politician vs a piece of shit. Which is worse I guess is in the eye of the beholder, but I personally have a tremendous dislike for corrupt Washington politicians. Even if you don't agree, don't be blind to what Biden is just because you hate Trump. That does seem to me to be what the media have done.

I just hate the idea of people feeling like they don't care about what someone does and if they are shady and corrupt, as long as their delivery is good and they talk the talk and come across well on TV. That's the kind of attitude which lets the rot set in.

The rot has more than set in. Politics is broken IMHO.

I think you are being disingenuous by suggesting that people seem to think it is good guy V Piece of shit. Some do of course but it seems to me that most have their eyes wide open.

This election has never been about policy, it is about two shit candidates trying to persuade the electorate that they are less shit than the other.

I think the major stumbling block for Trump is that he has had 4 years of demonstrating to the American people and the world that he is a shit person and many are rightfully embarrassed by that. Only time will tell if enough people are embarrassed enough by that.

As a slight aside I was appalled to see that a friend of mine in Jacksonville was offering to ferry people to and frow from the polling station on election day. This is in the worlds greatest democracy and it is so damn hard to vote. Shameful.



Sent from my Redmi Note 7 using Tapatalk

 

[dingodan]

Glenn Greenwald has published his article TheIntercept refused to publish and he resigned over.

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/article-on-joe-and-hunter-biden-censored

 

[father_and_son]

This is in the worlds greatest democracy and it is so damn hard to vote.

Everything else you say is right except for this bit. There is nothing 'great' about a democratic process as undemocratic as America's. All about appearances, attack ads, lobbying, winners losing popular votes and partisanship. Nothing to do with the people getting representatives who will represent their interests.

 

[Weststander]

Absolutely this. Beggars belief that anyone can be pro Trump based on what comes out of his mouth. Take away people believing in fake news, conspiracies, etc, what comes out of his mouth and appears on his twitter feed on a daily basis should be enough to realise what an utter cvnt the man is.

I know many Brexiteers, Tories, supporters of other UK parties and the normally apolitical. Trump‘s thought of as a bully, a racist and a vile individual. Often with humour, his incompetence and oath like mannerisms are mocked, we’ve loved his cringeworthy press briefings.

One or two naively (very young at the time) were drawn to the Make America Great Again soundbite four or five years ago, as well as his anti establishment imagery, the outsider. Over time all that wore thin, they’re now embarrassed that they pinned their US colours to his mast.

 

[BadFish]

Everything else you say is right except for this bit. There is nothing 'great' about a democratic process as undemocratic as America's. All about appearances, attack ads, lobbying, winners losing popular votes and partisanship. Nothing to do with the people getting representatives who will represent their interests.

Quite right, I should have included inverted commas to highlight the slight sarcasm in my post

 

[KeithDublin]

There are awful lot of words in those two articles in order to say not much.

First article - we found them! (But don't say what is in them)

Second article - I resigned because I disagreed with my editor.

Also Glenn Greenwald is a total hack

 

[dingodan]

Also Glenn Greenwald is a total hack

Really? The guy is a legend among journalists.

You know what a hack is right? He is the exact opposite of a hack.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hack_writer

 

[dingodan]

[tweet]1321927288716480515[/tweet]

 

[KeithDublin]

Really? The guy is a legend among journalists.

You know what a hack is right? He is the exact opposite of a hack.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hack_writer

He's the worse thing that any human being can be: A libertarian

 

[dingodan]

He's the worse thing that any human being can be: A libertarian

Not sure where you got that from, most places describe him as a liberal. He used to write for The Guardian.

 

[Curious Orange]

Glenn Greenwald has published his article TheIntercept refused to publish and he resigned over.

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/article-on-joe-and-hunter-biden-censored

I reckon the editors refused to publish it because it was overly long, and didn't provide any new evidence actually linking Joe Biden with anything untoward.

His son sounds a bit dodgy though.

 

[dingodan]

I reckon the editors refused to publish it because it was overly long, and didn't provide any new evidence actually linking Joe Biden with anything untoward.

His son sounds a bit dodgy though.

Yeah, especially when his associates send each other messages like, 'Don't mention Joe being involved, it's only when u are face to face, I know u know that but they are paranoid'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...r-Biden-texts-emails-emerge-hours-debate.html

 

[Eeyore]

Red wave is coming

Fake news, lies, corruption, socialism, racism etc will see the democrats defeated heavily on November 3rd

Trump 2020

Thanks, you should have said.

 

[Curious Orange]

Yeah, especially when his associates send each other messages like, 'Don't mention Joe being involved, it's only when u are face to face, I know u know that but they are paranoid'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...r-Biden-texts-emails-emerge-hours-debate.html

It is pity the message exchanges that led up to that one aren't available, as while it sounds like it could be damaging, it could equally be nothing of the sort. Context is everything.

 

[Weststander]

I respect the objective Economist.

Click on the various tabs, the US is heading for a Democrat clean sweep of President, Senate and House.

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president

Which would leave the just The Supreme Court as potentially the last bastion protecting racists, homophobes and misogynists.

The Alt Right’s four year experiment is about to come crashing down.

 

[dingodan]

I respect the objective Economist.

Click on the various tabs, the US is heading for a Democrat clean sweep of President, Senate and House.

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president

Which would leave the just The Supreme Court as potentially the last bastion protecting racists, homophobes and misogynists.

The Alt Right’s four year experiment is about to come crashing down.

So, people on the right are racists, homophobes and misogynists?

Given that the left right political divide is around 50/50, and given that half of people clearly are not racists, homophobes and misogynists, have you ever considered that it might be you who is the bigot? Prejudiced against people for their political views and demonizing them and casting them as evil?

I know lot's of people on the political right and the political left, and yet I don't know a single racist, homophobe or misogynist. Infact I know black people, gay people and women who are on the political right.

Did you ever consider that you might actually be the one who is an extremist and a bigot, blinded by your own self righteousness and misplaced sense of moral superiority?

 

[peterward]

Red wave is coming

Fake news, lies, corruption, socialism, racism etc will see the democrats defeated heavily on November 3rd

Trump 2020

Democrats under Biden are not socialist, plus the others highlighted are the embodiment of Trumpism - Bullshit, corruption, racism and alternative reality news.

Youd better hope the public love Fake news, lies, corruption and racism, else its gonna be a red fart on Tuesday.

 

[peterward]

I respect the objective Economist.

Click on the various tabs, the US is heading for a Democrat clean sweep of President, Senate and House.

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president

Which would leave the just The Supreme Court as potentially the last bastion protecting racists, homophobes and misogynists.

The Alt Right’s four year experiment is about to come crashing down.

I respect the economist too, and always read it.....however it doesn't really count for much when it comes to polling - Its a very difficult science and a lot of pollers do differ by some margins - its hard and perhaps naive to pick one - the poll of polls maybe the best reflection? Biden wins 19 times out of 20 will only be based on their polling methodology, which if wrong will invalidate that model.