Trump

[Thunder Bolt]

You lot believe all the fake news, I on the other hand, get my information from, checks notes, what Trump says.

Yup

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

pushing useless drugs and psychotic "treatments".

The tragedy is that, in fact, Hydroxychloroquine HAS proved to be useful in a couple studies ad I know a few Doctors personally who tell me they are prescribing it for their most vulnerable patients.

The tragedy is that Trump has turned it into a political issue rather than a purely medical one.

I’m a Nurse practitioner and I can prescribe...I don’t have authority to issue scripts for unlicensed meds...I would advise they ask their GP.

 

[Weststander]

Which is a sad indictment of humanity as a species, frankly.

"Fairness and equality? **** that."

In agreement all the way with you on Trump, racism, etc.

But for me the binary "left" or "not left" choice made by Spence requires refinement. I'm probably centre-right on economics, but with emphasis in maximising tax take to an extent whilst encouraging enterprise, looking after the vulnerable, disabled, those suffering with mental illness, housing those who can't find decent homes. Corbyn/Momentum is not for me. I see other solutions.

At the same time I hate aggressive nationalism and all the other crap that comes with Trump.

I think many others feel the same, it really isn't you're either with the Left or Trump.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

In agreement all the way with you on Trump, racism, etc.

But for me the binary "left" or "not left" choice made by Spence requires refinement. I'm probably centre-right on economics, but with emphasis in maximising tax take to an extent whilst encouraging enterprise, looking after the vulnerable, disabled, those suffering with mental illness, housing those who can't find decent homes. Corbyn/Momentum is not for me. I see other solutions.

At the same time I hate aggressive nationalism and all the other crap that comes with Trump.

I think many others feel the same, it really isn't you're either with the Left or Trump.

I agree. Nobody seems to be centrist any more. It's all battle lines instead of trying to work together.

Divide and conquer.

 

[A1X]

In agreement all the way with you on Trump, racism, etc.

But for me the binary "left" or "not left" choice made by Spence requires refinement. I'm probably centre-right on economics, but with emphasis in maximising tax take to an extent whilst encouraging enterprise, looking after the vulnerable, disabled, those suffering with mental illness, housing those who can't find decent homes. Corbyn/Momentum is not for me. I see other solutions.

At the same time I hate aggressive nationalism and all the other crap that comes with Trump.

I think many others feel the same, it really isn't you're either with the Left or Trump.

I do agree with you on this.

I think my problem with the Spence point was I would be genuinely disturbed by anyone who actively hates the broad concepts of "the left" (notably the idea of fairness and equality), you can dislike the specific policy ideas of leftist politicians, obviously. By extension I would say similar about some aspects of "the right" (individual responsibility and prudent financial management, for example) as they are just sensible ideas. There's far too much binary thinking in this, if you dislike Johnson as a PM then you (in the eyes of many) are therefore totally signed up to everything Jeremy Corbyn has ever said and done (for example).

I guess this is why I'm one of those evil Centrists and get abuse from both sides on t'internet.

 

[sydney]

That they are, along with Antifa, a bunch of Marxist thugs and anarchists.

ooh look another local .....i wonder what the wizard of uckfield has to say in reply....

 

[BN41Albion]

In agreement all the way with you on Trump, racism, etc.

But for me the binary "left" or "not left" choice made by Spence requires refinement. I'm probably centre-right on economics, but with emphasis in maximising tax take to an extent whilst encouraging enterprise, looking after the vulnerable, disabled, those suffering with mental illness, housing those who can't find decent homes. Corbyn/Momentum is not for me. I see other solutions.

At the same time I hate aggressive nationalism and all the other crap that comes with Trump.

I think many others feel the same, it really isn't you're either with the Left or Trump.

This 100%

 

[father_and_son]

In agreement all the way with you on Trump, racism, etc.

But for me the binary "left" or "not left" choice made by Spence requires refinement. I'm probably centre-right on economics, but with emphasis in maximising tax take to an extent whilst encouraging enterprise, looking after the vulnerable, disabled, those suffering with mental illness, housing those who can't find decent homes. Corbyn/Momentum is not for me. I see other solutions.

At the same time I hate aggressive nationalism and all the other crap that comes with Trump.

I think many others feel the same, it really isn't you're either with the Left or Trump.

This.

I'd describe myself as Economically right of centre (small government, low-ish tax, etc) but Socially Liberal (universal health, global outlook, environmentally responsible, pro choice, etc). I'd struggle as much to find the right person to represent me in US as I do here, possibly even more so.

But having said that, if I was in the US right now, I'd be working very hard to be leaving. Virtually anywhere in the world looks more attractive than the US to me at the moment. Going to sh*t rather quickly and I don't see how they can stop that momentum now.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

In agreement all the way with you on Trump, racism, etc.

But for me the binary "left" or "not left" choice made by Spence requires refinement. I'm probably centre-right on economics, but with emphasis in maximising tax take to an extent whilst encouraging enterprise, looking after the vulnerable, disabled, those suffering with mental illness, housing those who can't find decent homes. Corbyn/Momentum is not for me. I see other solutions.

At the same time I hate aggressive nationalism and all the other crap that comes with Trump.

I think many others feel the same, it really isn't you're either with the Left or Trump.

I don't care a jot about left or right but instead whether the party in charge is honourable and mostly honest and genuinely acts in the interest of the nation rather than ( for example ) the kremlin.

 

[BN41Albion]

This.

I'd describe myself as Economically right of centre (small government, low-ish tax, etc) but Socially Liberal (universal health, global outlook, environmentally responsible, pro choice, etc). I'd struggle as much to find the right person to represent me in US as I do here, possibly even more so.

But having said that, if I was in the US right now, I'd be working very hard to be leaving. Virtually anywhere in the world looks more attractive than the US to me at the moment. Going to sh*t rather quickly and I don't see how they can stop that momentum now.

Only going to get worse as November draws closer and both continue to use the troubles politically. After November, god knows but I can only see it getting worse still

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

I do agree with you on this.

I think my problem with the Spence point was I would be genuinely disturbed by anyone who actively hates the broad concepts of "the left" (notably the idea of fairness and equality), you can dislike the specific policy ideas of leftist politicians, obviously. By extension I would say similar about some aspects of "the right" (individual responsibility and prudent financial management, for example) as they are just sensible ideas. There's far too much binary thinking in this, if you dislike Johnson as a PM then you (in the eyes of many) are therefore totally signed up to everything Jeremy Corbyn has ever said and done (for example).

I guess this is why I'm one of those evil Centrists and get abuse from both sides on t'internet.

If the Left were only about equity and fairness you’d be right.

They’re not. These days they’re obsessed with diversity and shouting down, de-platforming and raging against reason.

Defund the police in the U.K. because of the George Floyd murder by cop....fvcking great idea
Jordan Peterson mobbed because he won’t use artificial titles for gender preference
Unpopular voices MUST be heard ffs. How else can you challenge their worldview.

 

[father_and_son]

Only going to get worse as November draws closer and both continue to use the troubles politically. After November, god knows but I can only see it getting worse still

I'm looking at a longer timescale than that really.

I'd say the "End" started around the turn of the millennium/9-11 sort of time. Since then its been a steady decline leading to an 'end of the empire' type event. It won't be November or, indeed, anytime soon, but within my lifetime (and I'm 50, so not that long), USA as a world Superpower will end, possibly in an economic or social collapse, then I see a break up of the Union over the following 50 years, possibly North-South again or, most likely, EastCoast - Centre - WestCoast.

Won't be pretty and won't be pleasant to be involved in. Maybe not civil war but that will be an ever present threat.

Trump has accelerated this hugely, more so than the previous worst offender (GeorgeW - IMHO) and another 4 years would bring the end much sooner than it would be under Biden ... But it's still going to happen regardless, just a case of when.

 

[A1X]

If the Left were only about equity and fairness you’d be right.

They’re not. These days they’re obsessed with diversity and shouting down, de-platforming and raging against reason.

Defund the police in the U.K. because of the George Floyd murder by cop....fvcking great idea
Jordan Peterson mobbed because he won’t use artificial titles for gender preference
Unpopular voices MUST be heard ffs. How else can you challenge their worldview.

This is my point exactly. Taking the actions of a few people on the left and painting them as the activities of everyone on the left.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

This is my point exactly. Taking the actions of a few people on the left and painting them as the activities of everyone on the left.

Yes..sorry my post wasn't clear..I wasn’t decrying you...I was decrying “leftist groups” and “activists”

 

[Weststander]

I do agree with you on this.

I think my problem with the Spence point was I would be genuinely disturbed by anyone who actively hates the broad concepts of "the left" (notably the idea of fairness and equality), you can dislike the specific policy ideas of leftist politicians, obviously. By extension I would say similar about some aspects of "the right" (individual responsibility and prudent financial management, for example) as they are just sensible ideas. There's far too much binary thinking in this, if you dislike Johnson as a PM then you (in the eyes of many) are therefore totally signed up to everything Jeremy Corbyn has ever said and done (for example).

I guess this is why I'm one of those evil Centrists and get abuse from both sides on t'internet.

Couldn't agree more.

The vast majority of folk politically are independent minded, having a range of views and (optimistically) are socially minded.

The baloney of either you're with us or against us on all issues of the entrenched ends of the political spectrum, get a reaction from me of disdain and if anything I move to the centre.

 

[schmunk]

I'd describe myself as Economically right of centre (small government, low-ish tax, etc) but Socially Liberal (universal health, global outlook, environmentally responsible, pro choice, etc). I'd struggle as much to find the right person to represent me in US as I do here, possibly even more so.

Regrettably, your social and economic aspirations are largely incompatible - if you want to have a comprehensive healthcare service, a wide trade network, strong environmental regulation, etc., you need to have a large and expensive government/state to provide it.

Balance is required, but this has not been forthcoming in the US or the UK in the past few years...

 

[Mellotron]

Yes..sorry my post wasn't clear..I wasn’t decrying you...I was decrying “leftist groups” and “activists”

I think what you're referring to is pretty far left. The right will show these idiots and go "look, this is what everyone on the left is like".

I believe the vast majority of centre-left people don't support cancel culture etc. I know I don't, nor do many of my friends who are majority left wing.

 

[sydney]

If the Left were only about equity and fairness you’d be right.

They’re not. These days they’re obsessed with diversity and shouting down, de-platforming and raging against reason.

Defund the police in the U.K. because of the George Floyd murder by cop....fvcking great idea
Jordan Peterson mobbed because he won’t use artificial titles for gender preference
Unpopular voices MUST be heard ffs. How else can you challenge their worldview.

they are a product of the new school curriculum or lack of it , we had a locum teacher from lancashire in year 4 of secondary , he taught us about the Moors , The Ottoman Empire and the crusades , apparently it was extra ciricular and he was let go after 6 weeks , i will always remember it , it actually twerked my interest in history and if i bumped into him now i would give him a hug , buy him a pint , cut him a fatty and thank him for educating me ........because i think we in the west have been badly let down by our education system , but not as bad as the USA.

 

[Madafwo]

Yup

The first and only thing I thought of when I saw this was Headlong by Queen.

 

[sydney]

could be worse .....do they have conkers over there .....ouwwwchhh....!!