[Travel] Train price rises

[Simster]

Brexit = High RPI = Steep fare increase

Wonder how many Brexiteers actually commute, 52%? I doubt it...

I'm a remainer but that is a tiresome argument. In case you hadn't noticed, rail fairs consistently go up at a higher rate than inflation, regardless of what that rate actually is.

 

[HH Brighton]

Go on then I'll have a nibble. If anyone thinks that the Southern rail staff are to blame for this railway mess then you are either deluded or not able to grasp the basics. 100 million profit by Go Ahead group in 2016 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-37253789 and the government cosy little deal with Southern Rail tells you all you need to know.

 

[nicko31]

I'm a remainer but that is a tiresome argument. In case you hadn't noticed, rail fairs consistently go up at a higher rate than inflation, regardless of what that rate actually is.

RPI 3.9%
Inflation 3.1%

Looks about right

 

[The Merry Prankster]

How else are inflation-busting pay rises going to be paid for?

By sacking guards AND they'll still be enough left over for massive bonuses to management. Hurrah!!

 

[Diablo]

I'm a remainer but that is a tiresome argument. In case you hadn't noticed, rail fairs consistently go up at a higher rate than inflation, regardless of what that rate actually is.

rail fares go up higher than inflation mainly because costs associated with railways( Labour costs/strikes etc ) go up higher than the average inflation rate which includes things that have gone down in relative terms.

Nothing to do with Fairs!!

 

[beorhthelm]

Very odd knee-jerk reaction to blame the staff rather than the management.

was it blame the staff or a statement of reality? if employees are given a rise around about inflation, and the costs maintenance, new construction and stock also go up by similar amount, doesn't it stand to reason that prices also need to rise by inflation? thus fueling the vicious cycle.

the question is how much do we think we should subsidise those the travel to work by rail. i'm always surprised at how little reflection there is on the substantial subsidy for relatively well off workers going off to London. The stories you hear of some bod paying 7k or so to commute in from Swindon or some such place overlook that they are doing so for a very high salary.

 

[Blackadder]

£73 a week gets you unlimited travel on the entire rail network in Germany, that's good value.

https://www.bahn.com/en/view/offers/bahncard/bahncard.shtml

Having been to Berlin and Munich in the last couple of years, I was amazed at the transport deals on offer.

The deal you mention is incredible. You could be, say, a Dortmund fan who commutes daily to Dusseldorf. Then at the weekend, go to an away game at Munich or Hamburg and not give a toss about the travel costs, paying about £15 for your safe standing spot. What's not to like?

 

[ROSM]

was it blame the staff or a statement of reality? if employees are given a rise around about inflation, and the costs maintenance, new construction and stock also go up by similar amount, doesn't it stand to reason that prices also need to rise by inflation? thus fueling the vicious cycle.

the question is how much do we think we should subsidise those the travel to work by rail. i'm always surprised at how little reflection there is on the substantial subsidy for relatively well off workers going off to London. The stories you hear of some bod paying 7k or so to commute in from Swindon or some such place overllook that they are probably doing so for a very high salary.

Labour costs including director salaries make up c25% of every pound spent on tickets.

So blaming staff is at best a niche argument here

 

[beorhthelm]

Go on then I'll have a nibble. If anyone thinks that the Southern rail staff are to blame for this railway mess then you are either deluded or not able to grasp the basics. 100 million profit by Go Ahead group in 2016 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-37253789 and the government cosy little deal with Southern Rail tells you all you need to know.

tells us very little if we dont read past the headline. how much profit is made from Southern vs other operations? (clue - stated loss making operation, their profits come from about two of a dozen subdivisions).

we could nationalise it all, have the old levels of investment in rolling stock and maintenance (which was poor for decades), for half the fare price and the tax payer pick up the bills. im not sure that what people actually want though.

 

[kjgood]

The two links below tell an interesting story regarding the state of trains in Wales (Not everyone lives in the south east)

http://orr.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0010/25102/arriva-trains-wales-factsheet-1617.pdf

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/welsh-trains-oldest-britain-cardiff-11893510

I found it enlitening to hear about the excellent and cheap service being delivered in Germany considering that Arriva Trains Wales Limited is owned by Deutsche Bahn AG. The attached reports show rolling stock averages 27 years old and is the oldest in the UK, complaints up, delays up, cancellations up, electrification of the main line from Paddington to Swansea cancelled, however a nice 3.3% increase in fares. Standing room only between Brighton to London goes on everywhere else, try standing on a platform aiming at Cardiff most days and then two carraige trains appear, its like the London Underground at rush hour. And please dont get me started about when its International rugby weekends!!!!!!!!

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

rail fares go up higher than inflation mainly because costs associated with railways( Labour costs/strikes etc ) go up higher than the average inflation rate which includes things that have gone down in relative terms.

Nothing to do with Fairs!!

It's a merry-go-round

 

[studio150]

Portslade anytime return to London Bridge now £56.10 that's almost 2 away PL match tickets

Not the best bargain you are ever going to get.

 

[Superphil]

The train i got from brighton to london bridge no longer runs. It used to connect with the west coast train to lb at haywards heath but as there are only 12 carriage units and they can no longer connect en route then the brighton portion has been cancelled. I now have the choice of train to victoria and tube or change en route and stand for the majority of my journey.

Sounds like a massive improvement in services there

Why don’t you get one of the direct to LB trains? Or have they all been cancelled?

 

[e77]

Tory ones can push them through knowing there's electoral downside for them - Sussex and Surrey voters (Brighton aside) will vote Conservative no matter how high the rise, and Labour governments can push such rises through for the same reason.

Not so much anymore. Labour got it's first councillor in Worthing in four decades last year and East Worthing and Shoreham is down to a 5,000 majority. Labour would fancy Crawley and Hastings next time round while the Lib Dems have Eastbourne and no doubt have ambitions in Lewes.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

When it costs you more than £5,000 a year just to get to work, then you really need to take a long hard look at your life/work/finance balance.

 

[ROSM]

Why don’t you get one of the direct to LB trains? Or have they all been cancelled?

The direct brighton to london bridge trains are now at

5.47
6.00
7.32

The last one gets in too late for me to be at my desk, the first one leaves before my first bus gets to brighton station and the second one would mean being on a bus at 5.25 in the morning

 

[Hampster Gull]

£73 a week gets you unlimited travel on the entire rail network in Germany, that's good value.

https://www.bahn.com/en/view/offers/bahncard/bahncard.shtml

The Germans subsidise their rail industry by €17bn, us by €4bn, or something like that. Someone ends up paying, in their case the tax payer subsidises the rail user more than we do

 

[ROSM]

The Germans subsidise their rail industry by €17bn, us by €4bn, or something like that. Someone ends up paying, in their case the tax payer subsidises the rail user more than we do

They do indeed. They see a rail network as a key infrastructure that underpins their economy and improves the life of their citizens

Its a hugely cultural thing.

 

[Hampster Gull]

They do indeed. They see a rail network as a key infrastructure that underpins their economy and improves the life of their citizens

Its a hugely cultural thing.

Indeed it is, but I was responding to how cheap rail travel was in Germany, which It isn’t necessarily, it’s just a cross subsidy from non using taxpayers to rail users. We should re-join the EU and become more european in attitude

 

[beorhthelm]

When it costs you more than £5,000 a year just to get to work, then you really need to take a long hard look at your life/work/finance balance.

i know i did... costs a lot more to live in London, then theres the quality of local services and schools, being in the country rather than city centre etc.