[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[Machiavelli]

The Guardian is very definitely "left leaning", but I wouldn't put it in the same "extreme" bucket with the Daily Mail. There are far more extreme left sources out there than the Guardian. The one watch-out with the Guardian is that some columnists *are* a long way left, but if you pay attention they are easy to spot. The bread-and-butter Guardian news service, however, is left-bias without being extreme.

The general gist of what you say is correct, though: we should all be consuming news from multiple sources, and those sources should be across the political spectrum. In the UK, that probably means The Guardian (left bias w/out being extreme), The Independent (closest to central, but slightly left), and The Times (right bias w/out being extreme).

See here https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politic.../07/how-left-or-right-wing-are-uks-newspapers - Guardian and The Times very similar results (one left, the other right) while the likes of Daily Mail are far further "extreme".

Thanks for that link.
Just to offer a different view, that doesn't establish any of what you claim it does. It merely reflects what those surveyed in an opinion poll think of the newspaper's overall views. I can assure you the way in which most of the academic political science community characterises left, right and centre doesn't involve much thought either.

 

[A1X]

TBH I think if you regard the Guardian as “extreme left” it says more about you than it does about the Guardian. And none of it great.

 

[St Leonards Seagull]

TBH I think if you regard the Guardian as “extreme left” it says more about you than it does about the Guardian. And none of it great.

I have to agree, I have a family member who thinks that the Guardian is extreme left and the mail is a centrist paper.
Given their views on the world, it concerns me they see themselves as centrist and it’s all a big Woke left wing conspiracy.

 

[jcdenton08]

I have to agree, I have a family member who thinks that the Guardian is extreme left and the mail is a centrist paper.
Given their views on the world, it concerns me they see themselves as centrist and it’s all a big Woke left wing conspiracy.

I’ve personally never met anyone who thinks the Daily Mail is centrist, ie not politically motivated with ideals from the left or right. It’s as far right as it gets without being a hate speech pamphlet circulated in far right extremist groups.

 

[St Leonards Seagull]

I’ve personally never met anyone who thinks the Daily Mail is centrist, ie not politically motivated with ideals from the left or right. It’s as far right as it gets without being a hate speech pamphlet circulated in far right extremist groups.

I was as surprised as you when it was discussed, there was absolutely no back tracking by them despite me trying to apply reason and logic.
It’s fair to say we find it particularly difficult to discuss political issues as they generally descend into me being called a lefty, woke, communist, which is sad as healthy political discussion is good and I never try to start name calling as that helps widen political divides.
I always try to see from others point of view and understand how they form their views, I’ve really struggled in this case, which is sad as it’s a particularly close family member.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Matt Hancock says they have been doctored, but also that she signed an NDA.
It's all very murky.

The messages were given up for the enquiry it seems.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

12ft |

12ft.io

This should bury Hancock etc for good.

 

[clapham_gull]

The messages were given up for the enquiry it seems.

She damaged herself as a journalist by doing it like this especially in the eyes of her peers.

It's a very very odd thing to do. Her future sources are going to be very wary of handing over anything now.

She must have also pissed off her paymasters (she is a presenter on Murdoch's TalkTV) by passing over the messages to a rival newspaper.

 

[nicko31]

She damaged herself as a journalist by doing it like this especially in the eyes of her peers.

It's a very very odd thing to do. Her future sources are going to be very wary of handing over anything now.

She must have also pissed off her paymasters (she is a presenter on Murdoch's TalkTV) by passing over the messages to a rival newspaper.

Just heard Oakshite on the Today programme, its clear she passed info to the Telegraph for financial gain.

What was Hancock doing employing a clear lockdown sceptic, doesn't he remember her form in the past? Must be off his brain.

Can't stand the bloke, but he should sue her. You can't just deliberately go round breaching NDAs as it suits your agenda and the greedy mouths of the non dom press.

 

[Machiavelli]

Just heard Oakshite on the Today programme, its clear she passed info to the Telegraph for financial gain.

What was Hancock doing employing a clear lockdown sceptic, doesn't he remember her form in the past? Must be off his brain.

Can't stand the bloke, but he should sue her. You can't just deliberately go round breaching NDAs as it suits your agenda and the greedy mouths of the non dom press.

I differ on your first point. As vile and greedy as she is, I suspect she's extremely comfortable financially. That lot, however, have a fierce ideological agenda and have oh so many channels through which to dispense it to all those that are so willing to lap it up. As just one example: teachers are lazy; there will be plenty around the country echoing that phrase today.

 

[Bakero]

Eton Maths

 

[Hugo Rune]

Eton Maths

We all know that Johnson doesn’t do detail but no surprise that he’s a bit of a thick c***.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Just heard Oakshite on the Today programme, its clear she passed info to the Telegraph for financial gain.

What was Hancock doing employing a clear lockdown sceptic, doesn't he remember her form in the past? Must be off his brain.

Can't stand the bloke, but he should sue her. You can't just deliberately go round breaching NDAs as it suits your agenda and the greedy mouths of the non dom press.

I'd rather have this all on the public and Hancocks feelings hurt, I'm don't think I'm in the minority.

He's been caught out lying and here is the proof, he was on a power trip.

The inquiry will be a whitewash.

 

[JBizzle]

Eton Maths

Silly people. You don't go to Eton for an education or to learn useless things like maths, you go there so you can say you went to Eton and daddy can then get you a nice job at his Hedge Fund Management company / Newspaper etc

If you're lucky, a career in politics will follow if you're really struggling to demonstrate any talent. People like it when you speak good

 

[nicko31]

I'd rather have this all on the public and Hancocks feelings hurt, I'm don't think I'm in the minority.

He's been caught out lying and here is the proof, he was on a power trip.

The enquiry will be a whitewash.

Frankly I don't trust either of them. There will be no way to prove these messages are genuine. If she wants to spill the beans publish it for all media to do their analysis

As things stand I'd still trust a slow independent enquiry more than a Murdoch hack. Accuracy over haste

 

[beorhthelm]

Silly people. You don't go to Eton for an education or to learn useless things like maths, you go there so you can say you went to Eton and daddy can then get you a nice job at his Hedge Fund Management company / Newspaper etc

If you're lucky, a career in politics will follow if you're really struggling to demonstrate any talent. People like it when you speak good

wouldnt last in hedge funds without maths. unlike journalism where you get it wrong, interchange terms and no one notices. except then people quote it as fact.

funny thing is, knocking the maths overlooks the logic fail: if death rate should be 33k and we've had 41k, should be done right? should work as a journalist with that train of thought.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

She damaged herself as a journalist by doing it like this especially in the eyes of her peers.

It's a very very odd thing to do. Her future sources are going to be very wary of handing over anything now.

She must have also pissed off her paymasters (she is a presenter on Murdoch's TalkTV) by passing over the messages to a rival newspaper.

Not sure she's really much of a journalist in the first place!

 

[Machiavelli]

I'd rather have this all on the public and Hancocks feelings hurt, I'm don't think I'm in the minority.

He's been caught out lying and here is the proof, he was on a power trip.

The enquiry will be a whitewash.

Of course he lied. They all lied. The whole Johnson government was just ONE MASSIVE LIE

 

[rippleman]

Just heard Oakshite on the Today programme, its clear she passed info to the Telegraph for financial gain.

What was Hancock doing employing a clear lockdown sceptic, doesn't he remember her form in the past? Must be off his brain.

Can't stand the bloke, but he should sue her. You can't just deliberately go round breaching NDAs as it suits your agenda and the greedy mouths of the non dom press.

But isn't the sole reason for a NDA to try to hide shit that both parties know is there but one party wants to keep hidden?

If there is a NDA then there is something wrong/immoral/illegal going on.

 

[Bodian]

There will be no way to prove these messages are genuine.

But there is a very easy way to prove that they have been manipulated - which is for Hancock et al to release the originals. If they don't correct the record, we can assume they are genuine?