[Football] To all the Southgate haters / wrong again and again and again **SOUTHGATE NOW RESIGNED**

[BadFish]

The most negativity I’ve seen on NSC this past 24 hours is from you lot, and with posts like these.

I’ve not seen anyone be “disappointed” at the prospect of winning, “hated” these moments “as much as they could”, or be entirely negative about GS.

You’d find most people have at some level or another been on his back, and have also given him credit where and when due.

I think it’s more likely that you lot are a bunch of drama queens.

Which is exactly what I was saying.

 

[Perfidious Albion]

I did not watch the game , learned the result this morning. Having seen the video clip of Kane’s penalty incident….. that was never a penalty. The Dutch have every right to feel grieved

 

[Hotchilidog]

Why didn't the golden generation get to finals in spite of Sven then?

Because they were not as good as this group of players. This is the platinum generation

 

[Han Solo]

We were retarded peasants over here when you went through 600 years of feudalism and as such I'll never really understand the culture of "this one person in management is responsible for all the good and all the bad things that happen to us", but I firmly believe the main reason for the English success is through having a better set of footballers compared to everyone but France & Spain.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Why so aggressive?

Just because Sven was a bit of a gadfly doesn't mean Southgate is great. False equivalence.

I was going to say hate is a strong word. How about “don’t rate”, or “uninspired by”, or “with the players we’ve got, we should be better than this.”
and before anyone says “but he only has them for a short time!” That doesn’t seem to be a problem for Spain, or a number of other teams who have been adventurous and entertained.
and how about at the last Euros when Saka, Rashford and Sancho all missed penalties, two of them (?) having been substituted very very late and thus being very “cold”, just to take penalties. I thought that was very stupid BEFORE they missed. Not always so clever.

 

[GrizzlingGammon]

No. His tactics were spot on, all the criticism was way over the top and in the end he proved the critics wrong

We're in the final how can any England fan still be critical ? Just admit you were wrong

The previous games in this tournament, England have been dog sh*t. Really, really, poor. But they turned up yesterday.

 

[Hotchilidog]

The previous games in this tournament, England have been dog sh*t. Really, really, poor. But they turned up yesterday.

This…

 

[Randy McNob]

You can thank the critics, not Southgate @Randy McNob

Criticism of this flaccid manager and his jaded looking team has created a unity that has dragged us through the kindest half of a draw in history to the point where we beat a side that came third in their group in the semi finals.

With few goals, a bang average defence and a sense of indignation within the squad we have somehow fluked our way to a final. I hope we win, but I fear a humbling defeat against the first genuine football powerhouse we will have faced.

consider this: in 2010 Crapello had the easiest group of all time:

England
Algeria
Slovenia
Yanks

Labelled "EASY", he managed one win and finished 2nd which meant we had to play Germany, who humiliated us

Southgate won his group, arguably harder, so we avoided Germany and took the easier route.

That's not luck it's the difference between good management and poor mangement

 

[stewart12]

I think he's an utterly repulsive human being but fair play he's done a good job

 

[Randy McNob]

The previous games in this tournament, England have been dog sh*t. Really, really, poor. But they turned up yesterday.

disagree, almost every team we played put every man behind the ball and played non football, the Netherlands came to win and was an open game

 

[Couldn't Be Hyypia]

consider this: in 2010 Crapello had the easiest group of all time:

England
Algeria
Slovenia
Yanks

Labelled "EASY", he managed one win and finished 2nd which meant we had to play Germany, who humiliated us

Southgate won his group, arguably harder, so we avoided Germany and took the easier route.

That's not luck it's the difference between good management and poor mangement

Hmm. We are going to have to disagree. He got a huge chunk of luck to win that group.

 

[Half Time Pies]

Good post

Not so sure about that bit, I wonder if we feel like that as we see Foden et al more regularly. Based on what I’ve seen Williams looks better than Foden (in this tournament).

The first half is how England should play, but they won’t dominate the ball vs Spain, and it’s whether Southgate can counter a better opponent.

I hope I’m wrong, but would think it’s unlikely based on previous history….

I would argue that the reason Williams has looked better in this tournament is because the Spanish manager has set them up to play free flowing attacking football and has utilised his players in their best positions and playing to their strengths. Foden on the other hand was shunted out to the left for much the tournament and playing a style of football that would have been completely alien to him based on what he's used to at Man City.

 

[Nitram]

He’s a dithering idiot who insisted on defensive football with a back four and two defensive midfielders for almost his entire tenure despite the riches on offer in his squad.

He kept natural progressive midfielders out of the side preferring workhorses like Gallagher and continually picked players out of position like Foden.

He had years to find a system suited to the obscene number of talented players in his squad, and to get them to play like they do for their clubs, but due to his innate caution and lack of imagination ploughed on, until even he had to stumble over the obvious changes everyone else saw but him.

However he’s a lucky general, in tournaments he manages to get in groups that avoid all the better teams.

The man’s a bloody genius! Well done Southgate. Now piss off after you win the Euros. All my love.

 

[Binney on acid]

I don't think anyone can deny that his tactical ineptitude won the last Euros for Italy. I've been unable to forgive him for that. Chess isn't a spectator sport, and I'd never pay to watch a match. The negativity, and stifling of our most creative players has alienated a large percentage of England supporters. Our passage so far has been comparable to the parting of the Red Sea. We've just beaten a good side, but have not yet come up against a great one.
The technique displayed in abundance by the Spanish players has made them the outstanding side in the competition. However, the best team doesn't necessarily always win. Let's hope that the best team wins, and that the best team is England. I just want to be entertained, marvel at the creativity and artistry on display, and still be awake when the match finishes.

 

[Randy McNob]

Hmm. We are going to have to disagree. He got a huge chunk of luck to win that group.

oh i see, Southgate is really lucky, all other England bosses unlucky?

We won 1 game and scored 2 goals v USA, Algeria and Slovenia cos we were really unlucky?

 

[Nicks]

We have been decent for 45 minutes out of a whole tournament so far.
Once Holland changed formation we reverted to normal one pass forward three passes back.
Yes we got out of jail with the penalty decision.
Spain will love attacking through our midfield and against our full backs.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

You can thank the critics, not Southgate @Randy McNob

Criticism of this flaccid manager and his jaded looking team has created a unity that has dragged us through the kindest half of a draw in history to the point where we beat a side that came third in their group in the semi finals.

With few goals, a bang average defence and a sense of indignation within the squad we have somehow fluked our way to a final. I hope we win, but I fear a humbling defeat against the first genuine football powerhouse we will have faced.

We are the true patriots

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

I do think the guy is a tournaments manager. And a bloody good one at that. However, he's largely a rubbish tactician which is where we'll probably get butchered by the Spanish midfield on Sunday. England don't have many real tacticians which is why I can't get angry about him, I think he's done well despite his limitations.

I'm pleased for him though, great guy, hope he can bow out a winner at the weekend.

 

[Brovion]

While this is such a cringey “olive branch” thread, there’s absolutely no doubt Southgate knows how to play tournament football. Only Alf Ramsey has a better individual tournament record and no one touches Southgate’s overall record or his transformation of our penalties.

Exactly. He's still not a very good football manager (although those substitutions last night show that perhaps you can teach an old dog new tricks), but he is streets ahead of all his predecessors when it comes to managing all the peripheral elements. Penalties are a good example. As England manager he's only lost one penalty shoot-out - and of course it was the one we all remember. There's all the mental health work he's done, and umpteen other things, behind the scenes.

This is international football, it's not the same as club football and being so good at managing the external elements has more than compensated for his tactical shortcomings and has made him our most successful manager. Yes I know Ramsey actually won something, but Southgate's overall record of always qualifying (which Ramsey didn't do) and then going deep in the tournaments is second to none. Yes he's had some luck, but luck does not explain all his success.

Like we say if Pascal Gross had pace he'd be the best player in the world, imagine how good Southgate would be if he was just a bit better at the football side of things. (Although as I say his uber fans are entitled to point to last night as an example of how he is tactically astute).

 

[JetsetJimbo]

which team, Spain aside, have blown you away with great football?

I don't think you've grasped the point I'm making