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Time of fear?



e77

e77

Well-known member
May 23, 2004
7,270
Worthing
BeHereNow said:
I don’t give a shit about Icke and Chico. Have you not been reading this thread? You make assumptions up your head every single time.

MSM doesn’t represent the mainstream, this is where you are found out as a dinosaur. You believe it’s mainstream because they tell you it is.

Again, you have made assumptions regarding ‘throwing people under the bus’. I didn’t want that, I believe in shielding vulnerable people, just like every flu season, although it appears you don’t, because you seem to think the flu isn’t as bad, but the evidence doesn’t back that up.

You saw the graph about Sweden, yes? No lockdown, yet have the same death rate as us, this suggests (probably proves really) that a certain amount of people were always going to die with the lockdown or not, unfortunately. This happens every year, some years are worse than others, maybe this is hard for you to take?

The deaths seem to correlate to how many old people a country has and if they, stupidly, put them all in care homes where viruses can run rife.

Sweden had 6 times the amount of deaths that Ireland had (they have 6 times the amount of old people)
UK had 20 times the amount of deaths that Ireland had (we have 20 times the amount of old people)

It has become very obvious that Covid was used as a blanket term for death. That’s why cold, flu and pneumonia deaths have been recorded as less than average. So, when they say 40,000 it actually isn’t.

When flu killed 28,000 in one month a few years ago, did you want a lockdown then? I’m pretty sure you didn’t because the MSM didn’t tell you too.

There were no protests in March because, like myself, we believed it was going to be extremely bad. After a month or so of ‘flattening the curve’ it became pretty obvious that it wasn’t needed.

You have to remember that the lockdown was based on a faulty model by someone who has a track record of getting things wrong. This has previously been mentioned on here. Maybe, like the other facts, you wilfully ignored it.

You seem to think you have a monopoly on ‘the science’. I have seen scientists, doctors and nurses who don’t agree with your science. I can sit here and send you different videos of different scientists and doctors, but you, or someone else, will come out with the ‘well, that doctor doesn’t count’ rubbish.

So, I’ll go back to my original point that I think the lockdown is doing more harm than good. It’s a totally legitimate stance to take. I want what’s best for the country, as I’m sure you do too. I also happen to think that the MSM really don’t give a **** about us and their market is fear porn.

I saw a study about a month ago, can’t remember where it is now, but it said that for every 1% of GDP lost, tens of thousands would die as a result. We’ve lost more than 20%. I want as less deaths as possible. You don’t seem to see that, you’ve made a bogeyman in your head. I’m not the bad guy, I’m not saying you are either.

I understand your position, you think more people would’ve died without a lockdown. I don’t agree, pretty simple really, it’s nothing to do with ‘throwing people under the bus’.

People like you and the mud slingers need to stop being so toxic on here just because someone doesn’t agree with you.
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Historically I have been more than happy to let socially inadequate emotionally stunted conspiracy theorists get on with it because frankly they made idiots of themselves without my help but as the likes of Trump got partially elected by plugging into them and we are about to have a life saving vaccine come out which, by the look of it, too many people won't have because their minds have been poisoned means I am not going to give them a free pass anymore.

Sweden did much worse than any of it's Scandinavian neighbours and has a lower obesity rate than the UK. They also don't have a London to contend with where the infection rate was ahead of the rest of the country when we locked down and (I believe) about a million people a day commenting to and from it who would have spread it to most of England (at least the commutable bits). Could lockdown had been a bit more focussed? Possibly. However the minute the instruction moved on from Stay at Home people got confused and the line broke to an extent. In that uncertain time - and I don't care what anyone said no one really knew what was about to happen - it needed simple dramatic action.

I am between contracts at the moment so fully understand the economic fallout but it is being eased gradually as infection rates hopefully stabilise and confidence returns.

I don't have a problem with people criticising the detail of lockdown or emerging from it. What I do have a problem with is people appearing mod handed in Central London with a cast of cranks, reality show losers and fascists linking it into every conspiracy theory going trying to intimidate society.
 






e77

e77

Well-known member
May 23, 2004
7,270
Worthing
Apologies if I contributed to this but I think this belongs in the Bear Pit. I will certainly not be debating any further with crank racists.
 


J

Jolly Red Giant

Well-known member
Jul 11, 2015
2,615
Albion Dan said:
Barely anyone is ill and the death rate of those who are has reduced to minuscule numbers.
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While some people are asymptomatic - many are not - and many of those who do get ill will suffer ongoing health problems, possible for the rest of their lives. In the UK there are currently over 1,200 cases a day being confirmed and 10 people dying per day - there are currently 600 people hospitalised with covid19 - some of whom will die. You may think this equates to 'Barely anyone is ill' and the 'death rate... has reduced to minuscule numbers' - for those impacted it is not. The danger is that a second wave will strike that will lead to a major spike in infections and deaths (just as has happened in the USA) - dismiss the pandemic at your peril.

I seriously hope neither you or anyone you care about gets infected with covid 19 - I would not wish the consequences on anyone.
 










BeHereNow

BeHereNow

New member
Mar 2, 2016
1,759
Southwick
e77 said:
Historically I have been more than happy to let socially inadequate emotionally stunted conspiracy theorists get on with it because frankly they made idiots of themselves without my help but as the likes of Trump got partially elected by plugging into them and we are about to have a life saving vaccine come out which, by the look of it, too many people won't have because their minds have been poisoned means I am not going to give them a free pass anymore.

Sweden did much worse than any of it's Scandinavian neighbours and has a lower obesity rate than the UK. They also don't have a London to contend with where the infection rate was ahead of the rest of the country when we locked down and (I believe) about a million people a day commenting to and from it who would have spread it to most of England (at least the commutable bits). Could lockdown had been a bit more focussed? Possibly. However the minute the instruction moved on from Stay at Home people got confused and the line broke to an extent. In that uncertain time - and I don't care what anyone said no one really knew what was about to happen - it needed simple dramatic action.

I am between contracts at the moment so fully understand the economic fallout but it is being eased gradually as infection rates hopefully stabilise and confidence returns.

I don't have a problem with people criticising the detail of lockdown or emerging from it. What I do have a problem with is people appearing mod handed in Central London with a cast of cranks, reality show losers and fascists linking it into every conspiracy theory going trying to intimidate society.
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:ffsparr:

You still don’t get it.

Keep making those bogeymen up your head mate.

You make out as if no one has or ever will catch this virus. The lockdown won’t stop the virus, in fact, I don’t think it’s in circulation now.

Get this into your head: I don’t believe Covid has a worse mortality rate than flu, therefor, the correct way to get rid of it is herd-immunity - something we use for flu every single year. It’s not a ‘chucking under the bus’ strategy. We should shield the vulnerable, I’ve always said that. As Harry Wilson’s Tackle said (a scientist, I believe) it is extremely rare for young or middled aged people to die with it (just like flu), therefor I am quite happy to catch the virus in order for herd-immunity to happen, again, this is what happens with flu, and also, you don’t have any evidence Covid has a worse mortality rate than flu and that is because we don’t really know how many people have actually had it. Like I said before, 40,000 haven’t died of it.

As for the racist thing, you got proof of that? What I said was in no way racist. Perhaps you would like to explain why you thought it was?

Your insults are painfully embarrassing and they make you look like the emotionally stunted one. Shame.
 




K

Kinky Gerbil

Im The Scatman
NSC Patron
Jul 16, 2003
58,792
hassocks
Jolly Red Giant said:
While some people are asymptomatic - many are not - and many of those who do get ill will suffer ongoing health problems, possible for the rest of their lives. In the UK there are currently over 1,200 cases a day being confirmed and 10 people dying per day - there are currently 600 people hospitalised with covid19 - some of whom will die. You may think this equates to 'Barely anyone is ill' and the 'death rate... has reduced to minuscule numbers' - for those impacted it is not. The danger is that a second wave will strike that will lead to a major spike in infections and deaths (just as has happened in the USA) - dismiss the pandemic at your peril.

I seriously hope neither you or anyone you care about gets infected with covid 19 - I would not wish the consequences on anyone.
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USA are clearly still in a first wave.
 








BeHereNow

BeHereNow

New member
Mar 2, 2016
1,759
Southwick
Harry Wilson's tackle said:
For example:

"My point is that viruses in the coronavirus family have a season and kill thousands every year. I don't think there'll be a second wave this year. January to April will be flu season and so people will die by the thousands again. For those, the focus should be building immunity and getting HCQ + zinc.

But cancelling social gatherings, telling people to stay indoors or mask up outdoors is ridiculous. In fact, it's tyrannical."

The gun totin' conspiracy theorists we see in America, and those kindred sprits who are becoming more empowered here, would read something like that and say 'exactly'.

Your position is a classic example of deciding what you want (back to normal) and then fitting the 'facts' to your narrative.

Like you, I also have suggested we should go back to normal - but I said the vulnerable should be protected. You can't just throw people under a bus to die, and people will die, the old and compromised, if they are exposed again. Not putting the vulnerable at the forefront of any discussion is devilry in my view.

Meanwhile, notions like "I don't think there'll be a second wave this year" are uninformed wishful thinking. You may be right. I don't know. Neither do you.

Your second message, that doing anything about Covid-19 now (I don't see anything from you about protecting the vulnerable) is 'tyrannical' just feeds the dick heads, some of whom are still claiming Covid is a hoax. We may not be doing the right thing or the targeted thing but chucking it all away with no contingency for the vulnerable is what would be tyrannical. You are sounding like 1970s the anti seat belt and anti breathylser brigade with such talk.

The reseason this thread is shit is because it is full of utter bollox from people who have started out with a wish (which is basically to pursue their own interest, sod the rest) then bent the 'facts' to suit their narrative. You may not be doing this yourself but you are playing along with them. I am sure this is not your objective but by your stance you're aligning youself with the 'I'm alright' Jacks.

I will remind you that of the more than 40,000 who have died, half were in residential homes where they might have hoped to live out a sheltered and protected life. Instead they ware locked in and died alone.

If you think that this is just like ordinary flu (the implication of what I quote above) you need to give your head a wobble.

I wouldn't bother replying to the dick heads on this thread and, as I said, this thread stinks to high heaven. But you're a sensible bloke with a good heart so I'm frankly appalled you can't see you're aligning yourself with, yes, devilry.

Any and every stance plan or strategy to get the nation back to normal MUST be prefaced with the clear and effective mechanism to protect the vulnerable. I did a calculation recently and showed the numbers that prove that those age 14-55 have a vanishingly low risk of death from Covid and should be back at work. But half of those over 75 who have died since the outbreak have died of Covid. Half. You can't just throw the old and vulnerable under a bus. There has to be a plan. Without one we are in danger of repeating the care home scandal (and it was a scandal).

I'll not be back on this thread so if you wish to turn this into a discussion (no real need - I meant no offence and should not really have dug you out) it will have to be done elsewhere.
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You’ve actually agreed with a lot of the stuff we were saying months ago, although you failed to admit that we were right.

Not sure what your angle is of this now. Strange.

Anyway, I await the next lockdown.
 




Eeyore

Eeyore

Colonel Hee-Haw of Queen's Park
NSC Patron
Apr 5, 2014
25,943
Swansman said:
Of course they would. Questioning things is something with positive connotations but in reality people dont want it. They want things to be as they are told that they are.
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I'd quite like a world where folk don't go looking for extremes that aren't there and don't automatically assume, on the basis of hope and intent, that things that aren't there are. Especially on the basis of a few carefully crafted YouTube Videos. It's noticeable how if a person believes one theory they seem to run with them all.

COVID has been an absurd example. If conspiracies are to be believed. I'm not sure the 'deep state' are trying to collapse every economy in order to assert their power. I do believe, however, that there may be some covering up and a few porkies about its origins. That is very plausible.
 






Baldseagull

Baldseagull

Well-known member
Jan 26, 2012
11,839
Crawley
Albion Dan said:
Yes because the idiot changed his mind. Can you actually not see and hear what he says on film? The guys a massive fraud. You’re all being conned.

I went for a meal last night. Two tables of 8 young people obviously all from different households no masks no distancing all hugging and getting drunk, Ive seen similar in many other establishments for several weeks But you have to wear a mask to go to the newsagent or supermarket? Wake up we are getting totally played.

Barely anyone is ill and the death rate of those who are has reduced to minuscule numbers.
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We went from 1 or 2 deaths a day at the beginning of March, to more than 1000 a day at the beginning of April, without lockdown until 23rd March. My Local pub re opened for a week and then had to shut down again when 4 staff and 16 customers got Covid. You can hug dozens of people and no problem if none are shedding virus, or you can stand too close to one infectious person and you have it. Stop being daft.
 












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