[Albion] This summer’s squad rebuild

[B-right-on]

Well, I said already in the beginning of the transfer window that at least £100m would be spent.




I know I was tempted to write "a £100m transfer deficit" but chickened out to "spend at least £100m".

I understand its completely surreal to most, but to a newer pair of eyes everything pointed to a shopping spree.

Things were already strongly leaning in that direction, and when Everton got their point deduction in November, it was clear the market would change completely (for a while... things will be back to normal). The general assumption that the financial fairness-systems were going to result in fines, transfer bans or - worst case - not competing in European competitions was one thing. When it turned out they're actually going to take points away if you don't keep your finances in check, well that was not really expected and a real game changer.

Fair play, good call HS.

 

[Triggaaar]

last season - particularly having sold Cucurella/Caicedo/MacAllister the media (and us) talked about how he sustainability of our “buy cheap to sell dear” model, citing the likes of Southampton who had followed the same path and slowly (or not so slowly) declined. There was an expectation that we had peaked and would slide down the leagues as others before us. In pre-season we were many pundits favourites to be in the mix for relegation.

I've never felt that Bloom was going to follow in the footsteps of previous clubs. He was never going to just sell our top players and watch us sink.

 

[Whoislloydy]

Hopefully get O’Riley and Kadioglu wrapped up in the next 24-48 hours and focus on loans/sales with the remainder of the window.

If we sign Kadioglu, unfortunately it’s time for Lamptey to move on to pastures new, with Veltman/Hinshelwood as RB options he just won’t get the minutes.

Yalcouye (loan)
Cozier-Duberry (loan)
O’Mahony (loan)
Dalhoud (sold)
Moder (sold)
Sima (sold)
Lamptey (sold)

Potential loans for Ayari and Sarmiento too

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Maybe it's just a case that some of our targets have become available and others haven't.

It's probably good to sub pacey ball carriers during a game, whereas we don't need to with central defenders. Taking off Minteh/Adingra and bringing on a fresh replacement is hard for the opposition. Doing that all over the pitch could be really hard. But yes, we could do with backup in more defensive rolls.

Against Everton, I thought the pace and movement of the front 4 was world class at times. Defensive midfield - Well, let's just say it wasn't anywhere near that level.Since that game (alright, we'd technically signed Gruda by then) we seem to have signed 2 more attacking players but will probably have Grandad in midfield against United.

Its very exciting. It's also very WTAF. As I say, I have absolute trust in the people making the decisions but I've totally lost the plot on where everyone fits in.

 

[Mike Small]

We are building a squad for next season in Europe too, striking at exactly the right time.

I am absolutely loving how the top 8 and West Ham are all expected to finish above us as per the stupid pundits. I'm currently convinced we will finish above some of them particularly if we get O'Rielly, Ferdi and a CB in (preferably one with pace).

 

[Whoislloydy]

Against Everton, I thought the pace and movement of the front 4 was world class at times. Defensive midfield - Well, let's just say it wasn't anywhere near that level.Since that game (alright, we'd technically signed Gruda by then) we seem to have signed 2 more attacking players but will probably have Grandad in midfield against United.

It’s very exciting. It's also very WTAF. As I say, I have absolute trust in the people making the decisions but I've totally lost the plot on where everyone fits in.

Assume you’re referring to O’Riley when you said we seemed to have signed 2 more attacking players. O’Riley is a midfielder, not a forward. Literally played one game as CAM last season. He’s a box to box midfielder with the defensive stats to back it up.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Assume you’re referring to O’Riley when you said we seemed to have signed 2 more attacking players. O’Riley is a midfielder, not a forward. Literally played one game as CAM last season. He’s a box to box midfielder with the defensive stats to back it up.

I meant Gruda and Rutter.

For a minute I thought we'd got the O'Riley deal over the line as well.

 

[Change at Barnham]

Against Everton, I thought the pace and movement of the front 4 was world class at times. Defensive midfield - Well, let's just say it wasn't anywhere near that level.Since that game (alright, we'd technically signed Gruda by then) we seem to have signed 2 more attacking players but will probably have Grandad in midfield against United.

Its very exciting. It's also very WTAF. As I say, I have absolute trust in the people making the decisions but I've totally lost the plot on where everyone fits in.

But because we always had two wide players plus Pedro and Welbeck playing more centrally, it meant that Wieffer and Milner were left with a very large and spacious midfield to defend.

But the risk and reward of playing in such an attacking formation on this occasion paid off.
Any criticism of Wieffer and Milner has to take their workload into account.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

But because we always had two wide players plus Pedro and Welbeck playing more centrally, it meant that Wieffer and Milner were left with a very large and spacious midfield to defend.

But the risk and reward of playing in such an attacking formation on this occasion paid off.
Any criticism of Wieffer and Milner has to take their workload into account.

I agree that the full backs and the Centre mid are a bit exposed in the current set up. I'm not sure how much the pre season and Everton have taught us. The next 2 games, however, are the real acid tests for where we really are. My fear - hopefully unfounded - is those gaps you mentioned will get exposed by more ruthless teams than Everton.

I'll stop being a pessimist for now and enjoy being top of the league and the plethora of signings we are currently making.

 

[jackanada]

The thinking seems to be to park and hopefully improve a load of very decent mainly young players ready to be used should we make Europe and need a bigger squad.
I recall noticing a similar strategy with parking a few top championship level players should we need them after the carrion birds had picked over our first PL squads but obviously it didn't feel as exciting.

 

[Machiavelli]

I think our buying what looks like a top heavy squad of attacking players is heavily influenced by the introduction of the 5 substitute rule, plus the development of live in match player tracking, by systems such as Catapult GPS vests.


Defenders aren't as likely to be substituted tactically, and Goalkeepers tend to only be swapped out in game when injured.


So that leaves, between 6 and 7 outfield players, playing in the midfield and attacking areas, who are the focus of those 5 available substitutions.


Hurzeler wants us to play a very high intensity press out of possession and a very quick transition from back to front in possession.


That will put huge strain on our attacking players, so the capacity to switch most of them for fresh players of equal ability mid game, in every match, makes perfect sense.


Consistent intensity for 90 minutes and hopefully fewer injuries will theoretically give us more than just a marginal gain.

This needs to be more widely recognised. We'll be playing 15 or 16 every game. The front seven (ie, not the GK, 2xCBs and DCM -- or DCM/CB hybrid) will probably play a maximum of 60 minutes. We'll start with intensity and finish with intensity. This is the (new) way.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

This needs to be more widely recognised. We'll be playing 15 or 16 every game. The front seven (ie, not the GK, 2xCBs and DCM -- or DCM/CB hybrid) will probably play a maximum of 60 minutes. We'll start with intensity and finish with intensity. This is the (new) way.

Whilst all that makes perfect logical sense, I was amazed Welbeck did the full 90 on Saturday. When was the last time he did that?

 

[Machiavelli]

I agree that the full backs and the Centre mid are a bit exposed in the current set up. I'm not sure how much the pre season and Everton have taught us. The next 2 games, however, are the real acid tests for where we really are. My fear - hopefully unfounded - is those gaps you mentioned will get exposed by more ruthless teams than Everton.

I'll stop being a pessimist for now and enjoy being top of the league and the plethora of signings we are currently making.

I fully agree that Wieffer gave the ball away too much in the first 20 mins plus for the 'penalty', but you're way too down on him. Can I suggest that you just give him a chance over the next few games? He's just come back from a long-term injury (and would have got in the Dutch Euros squad without it) and has moved from the Eredivisie to the PL, which will require an adjustment (note though he's also played for the national team and in European football).

If he's as bad as you're making out, I'd suggest that we'll struggle big time this season. This is because that FH, etc seem to be placing an awful lot of trust in him (who his direct replacement in the squad is is beyond me), and that he's the most crucial player in the whole squad. He provides the structure -- @Han Solo in his youtube vid (which isn't as good as his football-related posts) noted that we had three players back to provide the defensive structure, one of which was Wieffer.

He wasn't that good against QPR, but was really good against Villareal and, beyond those first 20 mins and the 'penalty' (which a better team would have punished us for), he was great against Everton. Allow him to adjust, which he showed clear signs of doing during the Everton game.

He's brilliant at finding a pass. He plays the normal sideways/return to CB passes that a DCM should. Beyond that, he knows how the approaching oppo player is closing down and moves into a position in order to find the better pass. Look at the ball he played to Mitoma for our first and, even more clearly, look at the ball (assist) he played to Welbeck for the second.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

I fully agree that Wieffer gave the ball away too much in the first 20 mins plus for the 'penalty', but you're way too down on him. Can I suggest that you just give him a chance over the next few games? He's just come back from a long-term injury (and would have got in the Dutch Euros squad without it) and has moved from the Eredivisie to the PL, which will require an adjustment (note though he's also played for the national team and in European football).

If he's as bad as you're making out, I'd suggest that we'll struggle big time this season. This is because that FH, etc seem to be placing an awful lot of trust in him (who his direct replacement in the squad is is beyond me), and that he's the most crucial player in the whole squad. He provides the structure -- @Han Solo in his youtube vid (which isn't as good as his football-related posts) noted that we had three players back to provide the defensive structure, one of which was Wieffer.

He wasn't that good against QPR, but was really good against Villareal and, beyond those first 20 mins and the 'penalty' (which a better team would have punished us for), he was great against Everton. Allow him to adjust, which he showed clear signs of doing during the Everton game.

He's brilliant at finding a pass. He plays the normal sideways/return to CB passes that a DCM should. Beyond that, he knows how the approaching oppo player is closing down and moves into a position in order to find the better pass. Look at the ball he played to Mitoma for our first and, even more clearly, look at the ball (assist) he played to Welbeck for the second.

I will undoubtedly give him a chance. There are loads who have had less than Stellar Albion debuts. Duffy, Matty Ryan (might have been his 2nd game where he was truly dreadful at Leicester) and I was extremely underwhelmed with a certain Ali Mac back in the day. They all turned out alright. Also, Wieffer does have bite which we really missed last year where we were well and truly bullied against the likes of Villa and there is enough from Dutch sources to say we have a gem. As you say, he also vastly improved as the game went on. The only point I'd make on him dropping back into the defensive structure was I saw Milner physically push him up the pitch twice. We will see how deliberate or otherwise that is in future games

Also, It's not just the players but how we are set up. It just looks too open at times in the middle. I'm not sure FH needs a a manager of an U13's team that avoided relegation by a point in Div 3 to tell him how to play but to my untrained eye there does seem a lot of space to play in.

The exciting thing is that I have absolutely no idea where we will finish this year. The good stuff is that good we could well be challenging for Europe. I'm sure FH knows what he is doing and we have players to integrate / come back from injury that will only make things better. After Wolves away last year, I thought we could beat anyone. After Saturday, I had as many questions as answers.

 

[Van Cleef]

I fully agree that Wieffer gave the ball away too much in the first 20 mins plus for the 'penalty', but you're way too down on him. Can I suggest that you just give him a chance over the next few games? He's just come back from a long-term injury (and would have got in the Dutch Euros squad without it) and has moved from the Eredivisie to the PL, which will require an adjustment (note though he's also played for the national team and in European football).

If he's as bad as you're making out, I'd suggest that we'll struggle big time this season. This is because that FH, etc seem to be placing an awful lot of trust in him (who his direct replacement in the squad is is beyond me), and that he's the most crucial player in the whole squad. He provides the structure -- @Han Solo in his youtube vid (which isn't as good as his football-related posts) noted that we had three players back to provide the defensive structure, one of which was Wieffer.

He wasn't that good against QPR, but was really good against Villareal and, beyond those first 20 mins and the 'penalty' (which a better team would have punished us for), he was great against Everton. Allow him to adjust, which he showed clear signs of doing during the Everton game.

He's brilliant at finding a pass. He plays the normal sideways/return to CB passes that a DCM should. Beyond that, he knows how the approaching oppo player is closing down and moves into a position in order to find the better pass. Look at the ball he played to Mitoma for our first and, even more clearly, look at the ball (assist) he played to Welbeck for the second.

I thought Wieffer was excellent after a shaky start.
re the midfield in general, I am fully expecting Baleba to have real breakout season this year. He showed real promise last season and theres no reason he can't become the new bissouma.
Hopefully the old timer won't be starting too many games.

 

[b.w.2.]

Against Everton, I thought the pace and movement of the front 4 was world class at times. Defensive midfield - Well, let's just say it wasn't anywhere near that level.Since that game (alright, we'd technically signed Gruda by then) we seem to have signed 2 more attacking players but will probably have Grandad in midfield against United.

Its very exciting. It's also very WTAF. As I say, I have absolute trust in the people making the decisions but I've totally lost the plot on where everyone fits in.

'Lost the plot'... nonsense, there is clearly a plan...

 

[Iggle Piggle]

'Lost the plot'... nonsense, there is clearly a plan...

I've lost the plot was the wording.

Not the ones making the decisions.

 

[b.w.2.]

I've lost the plot was the wording.

Not the ones making the decisions.

Fair enough, but not sure why you have as, to repeat, there is a clear plan... unfinished unless and until Ferdi and MOR signed...

 

[BBassic]

Thought about doing a new thread for this but it fits in here I think.

The amount of changes we've had in the last few months had me looking at what our transfer activity looked like ten seasons ago and...

My my my, how time bloody well flies.

Our INs for the 2014/15 season were:

David Stockdale
Beram Kayal
Sam Baldock
Paddy McCourt
Danny Holla
Chris O'Grady
Aaron Hughes
Nzuzi Toko
Adrian Colunga
George Cole (who?)
Daniel Pappoe (WHO!?)

And then this season:

Yankuba Minteh
Mats Wieffer
Brajan Gruda
Georginio Rutter
Malick Yalcouye
Amario Cozier-Duberry
Ibrahim Osman

and potentially:

Matt O'Riley
Ferdi Kadioglu
Olivier Boscagli

It really is quite incredible to look at that as a measure of just how far we've come. And that's absolutely no disrespect to Stockers, Kayal or Baldock who all played their part in the promotion push.

I mean, it's obvious, I know. Being a fair-to-middling Championship team back then to being a decent-to-good-to-occasionally-fantastic Premier League team now, of course means we're attracting a higher calibre of player. It's just incredible to look at. Even more incredible looking at players like Buonanotte, who could be the next big Argentinian superstar, not being able to nail down a place here.

 

[Skuller]

My concern, just from my point of view, is that we're bringing in so many players that I don't recognise the team as 'my team' at the moment; I know that in the wilderness years we'd be getting an influx of loanees and journeymen every season, but this feels different. OK, hopefully in time I'll get used to the new team - guess they'll probably be a departure or two of players I don't want to see going though. C'est la vie, I suppose.
My second concern is the players we're bringing in - are we now buying them at their peak value? Up to now, our main recruitment has been players for about £10M or less and selling them on for upwards of £25M - sometimes a lot above £25M! But now, say £25M for O'Riley - Celtic bought him cheap as chips from MK Dons and will make a huge profit - but will his value increase, or is £25M about his peak? £40M for Rutter (!) - here it was Hoffenheim who 'did a Brighton' and made a huge profit - his value didn't increase much in his time at Leeds. Will we be able to sell him in a couple of years for £80M? I'm not sure - maybe with the new rules the days of ever-increasing transfer fees may be coming to an end.
Am I wrong? - well, I know I'm a born worrier, so maybe! No need for a lecture - I won't stop worrying or change my mind!

I’m just worried about identifying them on the pitch. Not only do I have to learn new haircuts, gaits, heights, and positioning, but I’ve also to cope with old players with fancy new haircuts (see Salah).