They are bent, greedy, hapless....& running the country

[Twizzle]

Who can trust politicians in the least, these days?

MPs' expenses cover-up: Former defence minister 'rents London flat from footballer Frank Lampard while letting out his own home' | Mail Online

This stuff is nothing new - but when will it end with these crooks?

 

[Triggaaar]

Who can trust politicians in the least, these days?

Well unfortunately, the public are as thick as shit. We'd rather vote for someone that we know is lying, than someone that admits their mistakes. That's how politics works. It's easier for a party to convince us not to vote for the other party if they've admitted making mistakes. It's like when if the public don't like an idea and the government do what the public want, we're not happy, we're too busy shouting U turn.

This stuff is nothing new - but when will it end with these crooks?

It's up to us to make more of a big deal about it. It's so easy to get our views across these days with the internet, we could have sites where people put their wish list together. Things like expenses would be easy, as none of us like it and it's not party specific. It could be law for all MPs expenses to be public, and we can have a running tab on them all.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Well unfortunately, the public are as thick as shit. We'd rather vote for someone that we know is lying, than someone that admits there mistakes. That's how politics works. It's easier for a party to convince us not to vote for the other party if they've admitted making mistakes. It's like when if the public don't like an idea and the government do what the public want, we're not happy, we're too busy shouting U turn.

It's up to us to make more of a big deal about it. It's so easy to get our views across these days with the internet, we could have sites where people put their wish list together. Things like expenses would be easy, as none of us like it and it's not party specific. It could be law for all MPs expenses to be public, and we can have a running tab on them all.

Your right it is up to us to make a big deal of it, but we wont. Just wait, give it a few days and MP's expenses will be forgotten about again and the focus will shift to something else. The party leaders will be on our TV's and people will get start getting sucked in again.

The problem with politics is we only hear about what they are going to do, we never hear about what they have accomplished, so we get the impression nothing has changed. MP's seem to have a different law to the rest of us. It's no wonder people don't trust them anymore.

Please find me an MP that has actually achieved anything of value. I think the system is so inefficient by the time something is proposed, then talked about a million times it never ever gets sorted out.

We do have the rights as tax payers to find out where our money is going. Even if we all moaned about MP's expenses nothing will get sorted until the people in question have left government, by then its too late to catch them because MP's will look after their own interests before ours.

 

[glasfryn]

Its taken me a long time ......but now I have realised that all politicians are bloody crooks and that if and thats a big IF there are any out there that are straight ........they do not last long

 

[Triggaaar]

Your right it is up to us to make a big deal of it, but we wont. Just wait, give it a few days and MP's expenses will be forgotten about again and the focus will shift to something else.

Indeed. Papers don't get sold by repeating the same existing bad problem, they get sold by coming up with something new and irrelevant. Some party neutral members of the public need to set-up a site for keeping the key things at the top of the public's agenda. If the public cared that much about an issue, the parties would have to focus on it.

 

[Icy Gull]

Well unfortunately, the public are as thick as shit. .

Or maybe they just don't give a shit because nothing's gonna change and they can't be arsed to look into it too deeply?

Although that argument falls down if you bother to vote

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Indeed. Papers don't get sold by repeating the same existing bad problem, they get sold by coming up with something new and irrelevant. Some party neutral members of the public need to set-up a site for keeping the key things at the top of the public's agenda. If the public cared that much about an issue, the parties would have to focus on it.

Your right we do need a site to keep up with every single issue so it never leaves peoples minds. We can then all collectively ask as Tax Payers, what is the next step, and when is this issue going to get sorted out. We can then actually see how well they perform and whether the current system is delivering us value for money.

 

[withdeanwombat]

Remember all those clever dicks at school? You know,always got their hands up to answer questions,and being smarmy. Always in the chess club and the debating society. Starting school newspapers,and being smarmy. Never in the football/rugby/cricket etc teams,though possibly house captain and head boy.(Same in girls schools I imagine,though sadly I have no experience in that quarter).

You couldn't bloody stand them,could you,to be honest.

A few short years pass,and BINGO, these same somewhat "undesirables" have "Labour" "Conservative" and even (whisper it )
"Lib-Dem" after their names ,and we're off down the polling station to elect one or other of them to represent us in Parliament.

Talk about bread and circuses !

 

[Triggaaar]

Your right we do need a site to keep up with every single issue so it never leaves peoples minds. We can then all collectively ask as Tax Payers, what is the next step, and when is this issue going to get sorted out. We can then actually see how well they perform and whether the current system is delivering us value for money.

Although it can't be easy, I can see it happening one day. Perhaps a Politics and Policy forum, run by people who care about politics, but are not party biased. Different sections of the forum, and every now and then a vote about the most important issues that the public want to be dealt with. Although I'm dreaming, this is hardly rocket science.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Remember all those clever dicks at school? You know,always got their hands up to answer questions,and being smarmy. Always in the chess club and the debating society. Starting school newspapers,and being smarmy. Never in the football/rugby/cricket etc teams,though possibly house captain and head boy.(Same in girls schools I imagine,though sadly I have no experience in that quarter).

You couldn't bloody stand them,could you,to be honest.

A few short years pass,and BINGO, these same somewhat "undesirables" have "Labour" "Conservative" and even (whisper it )
"Lib-Dem" after their names ,and we're off down the polling station to elect one or other of them to represent us in Parliament.

Talk about bread and circuses !

Your right, the trouble with politics is that its a closed arena for people like us. We will never know what actually goes on and what they do day to day, which I generally think is sod all. If think they just talk a lot, and nothing ever gets sorted out. It's like a Blue Chip company with lots of departments with a chain of command. Something that should really take 5 mins to complete, takes years once it's passes through all the slime and BS on the way through. Then the original idea gets completely lost and nobody takes responsibility for it when there is a mistake.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Although it can't be easy, I can see it happening one day. Perhaps a Politics and Policy forum, run by people who care about politics, but are not party biased. Different sections of the forum, and every now and then a vote about the most important issues that the public want to be dealt with. Although I'm dreaming, this is hardly rocket science.

It's not rocket science like you say. Over the last 3 years there are certain issues in this country that really bug me. It's frustrating that these MP's seem to have their own agenda when deciding what happens to this country. Nobody listens to us. They only do things that are best for their political party, best for their own pockets. Politics is a bloody publicity show these days.

 

[Dub-67]

Sadly its not just politicians who are on the make... they all are... bankers, politicians, corporations... No one seems to work for the benefit of the country anymore.. its all about how much you can fiddle..
and sadly that seems to be the case all the way down these days.. petty corruption and pilfering seems to be the rule at the bottom of the pile as well as the top. I've heard about dodgy dealings a lot closer to home.. the Council doesnt seem to be immune to giving contracts to mates of mates, instead of looing for the best deal.. bribes and attempted bribes are common... its all rather depressing really. What happened to civic and national pride ? and working for the good of us all ?

Bob Marley;

Guiltiness (talkin' 'bout guiltiness)
Rests on their conscience. Oh yeah.
And they live their lives (they live their lives)
On false pretence everyday -
Each and everyday. Yeah.

These are the big fish
Who always try to eat down the small fish,
Just the small fish.
I tell you what: they would do anything
To materialize their every wish. Oh yeah-eah-eah-eah.

Say: Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sorrow!
Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sad tomorrow!
Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sorrow!

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Sadly its not just politicians who are on the make... they all are... bankers, politicians, corporations... No one seems to work for the benefit of the country anymore.. its all about how much you can fiddle..
and sadly that seems to be the case all the way down these days.. petty corruption and pilfering seems to be the rule at the bottom of the pile as well as the top. I've heard about dodgy dealings a lot closer to home.. the Council doesnt seem to be immune to giving contracts to mates of mates, instead of looing for the best deal.. bribes and attempted bribes are common... its all rather depressing really. What happened to civic and national pride ? and working for the good of us all ?

Bob Marley;

Guiltiness (talkin' 'bout guiltiness)
Rests on their conscience. Oh yeah.
And they live their lives (they live their lives)
On false pretence everyday -
Each and everyday. Yeah.

These are the big fish
Who always try to eat down the small fish,
Just the small fish.
I tell you what: they would do anything
To materialize their every wish. Oh yeah-eah-eah-eah.

Say: Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sorrow!
Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sad tomorrow!
Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sorrow!

I would fing stop it all. Your right how many hundreds of millions of pounds are wasted handing out contracts that are way over priced. If the government left it us we could bring jobs in at half the price guaranteed and we make sure the tax payer is not being diddled. Look at the cost of supplying security for the Olympics, how much was that company being paid.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Sadly its not just politicians who are on the make... they all are... bankers, politicians, corporations... No one seems to work for the benefit of the country anymore.. its all about how much you can fiddle..
and sadly that seems to be the case all the way down these days.. petty corruption and pilfering seems to be the rule at the bottom of the pile as well as the top. I've heard about dodgy dealings a lot closer to home.. the Council doesnt seem to be immune to giving contracts to mates of mates, instead of looing for the best deal.. bribes and attempted bribes are common... its all rather depressing really. What happened to civic and national pride ? and working for the good of us all ?

Bob Marley;

Guiltiness (talkin' 'bout guiltiness)
Rests on their conscience. Oh yeah.
And they live their lives (they live their lives)
On false pretence everyday -
Each and everyday. Yeah.

These are the big fish
Who always try to eat down the small fish,
Just the small fish.
I tell you what: they would do anything
To materialize their every wish. Oh yeah-eah-eah-eah.

Say: Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sorrow!
Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sad tomorrow!
Woe to the downpressors:
They'll eat the bread of sorrow!

I would fing stop it all. Your right how many hundreds of millions of pounds are wasted handing out contracts that are way over priced. If the government left it us we could bring jobs in at half the price guaranteed.

Just thought I would add this Government wastes £31bn on 'rip off' contracts - Telegraph

 

[Triggaaar]

For me personally, MPs expenses is annoying, but not a big drain on our country. What annoys me the most is this news that companies like Starbucks, Amazon etc can write off their profit and pay no tax (same thing for Jimmy car etc). It's costing our country so much that it's going to effect our lives, and it should simply be stopped.

Don't Starbucks basically sell themselves coffee from Switzerland, and they sell it as such a price that Starbucks UK makes no profit? We could all do that - we just sell ourselves stationary at a made up rate that wipes out our profits. It's f'ing mental.

 

[withdeanwombat]

Watch Parliament on the telly.Obviously the country is run by about 73 MP's,those you see in the House.The others,of course,are paired with chums from other parties so they can go about "other business",reportedly listening to their constituents etc,or drawing down second incomes as company directors,advisors and whatever.Overseas fact finding missions are also good,especially if the facts are hiding in warm countries in winter.Then there's PM's questions,which gets a bit better audience.Turn your sound off.Watch the performing seals jump up and sit down at the end of each answer.Imagine the shock and dismay should the Speaker accidently call Hector Hardon-Smythe for his two pennorth when he was only meant to be a bobbing member.

Then,when the electorate gets the chance to oust these fools,any defeated Chums get a pension most could only dream of.

Quick,get your kids in the debating society!Refuse to buy them sports kit.Rather teach them to stick the hand up in class and endear themselves to "Sir" or "Miss".TRAIN them to be MP's.Make them sit down,then stand up and sit down quickly.Get them into the Young (political party most likely to win )of your choice.You absolutely KNOW that your offspring has inherited your genious,and soon you will be father of the Prime Minister.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

For me personally, MPs expenses is annoying, but not a big drain on our country. What annoys me the most is this news that companies like Starbucks, Amazon etc can write off their profit and pay no tax (same thing for Jimmy car etc). It's costing our country so much that it's going to effect our lives, and it should simply be stopped.

Don't Starbucks basically sell themselves coffee from Switzerland, and they sell it as such a price that Starbucks UK makes no profit? We could all do that - we just sell ourselves stationary at a made up rate that wipes out our profits. It's f'ing mental.

It is fing mental. I bet you they will get away with it too. Lets make a note on this issue and do some investigation and see what happens. Their argument will be that they provide jobs. It's a piss poor excuse for not paying taxes in my opinion. This is the failure of not having a decent manufacturing base in this country anymore. We now really on the service industry and we allow companies from overseas to set up shop.

 

[Triggaaar]

Lets make a note on this issue and do some investigation and see what happens.

I'm not really into politics, so I won't, but I'd have thought this was a big enough issue for the whole country to be united against it.

Their argument will be that they provide jobs.

That argument doesn't stack up in any way. The companies that provide jobs and do have some bargaining power are those that could base themselves elsewhere (eg, manufacturing). A coffee shop can't simply go elsewhere, as the whole point is they are selling over here, so they have to be here to make their money. We don't need them, they need us. If they go, another coffee chain can take their place. My very limited understanding is that the loophole they've found would work for any company. Simply buy your goods at an inflated price from your own sister company, and make no money here. If it's not against the rules, surely a simple and quick law change is required to stop it.

This is the failure of not having a decent manufacturing base in this country anymore. We now really on the service industry and we allow companies from overseas to set up shop.

I don't agree there, I think our manufacturing problems are a separate issue. We should improve our manufacturing industry, but it's a separate point.

 

[mwrpoole]

For me personally, MPs expenses is annoying, but not a big drain on our country. What annoys me the most is this news that companies like Starbucks, Amazon etc can write off their profit and pay no tax (same thing for Jimmy car etc). It's costing our country so much that it's going to effect our lives, and it should simply be stopped.

Don't Starbucks basically sell themselves coffee from Switzerland, and they sell it as such a price that Starbucks UK makes no profit? We could all do that - we just sell ourselves stationary at a made up rate that wipes out our profits. It's f'ing mental.

The ironic thing here is that Margaret Hodge MP who chairs the 'Public Accounts Committee', she was the one asking all the 'difficult' questions last week to Starbucks, Google & Amazon. Well it transpires that her family company called 'Stemcor' are doing exactly the same thing. Last year they had £6.1bn turnover with about 1/3rd of that generated in the UK with £65.2m profit, but only paid £157k in tax to HMRC. How on earth can she sit there for days questioning their tax planning and moral obligations when her family business do the exact same thing. Full article here if anyone interested:

Labour MP Margaret Hodge challenged over family firm's tax - Telegraph

 

[Tricky Dicky]

It is fing mental. I bet you they will get away with it too. Lets make a note on this issue and do some investigation and see what happens. Their argument will be that they provide jobs. It's a piss poor excuse for not paying taxes in my opinion. This is the failure of not having a decent manufacturing base in this country anymore. We now really on the service industry and we allow companies from overseas to set up shop.

They'll "get away with it" because they've done nothing illegal. Their priority is to maximise the money they make and every company and every individual would do the same if they could (if you say you wouldn't, I don't believe you). The rules should be changed to stop it though, certainly.

I watched the parliamentary select committee last week and all 3 companies performed appallingly, but they're laughing all the way to the bank.