[Politics] The Tories hit new LOWS with the Windrush situation

[Ernest]

Anyone got a clue how it's got this far?
Surely as soon as this started it should have been identified as manifestly, fundamentally wrong.
The very first case should have alerted the constituent's MP, local and national press, community groups.
What an utter clusterF.

If it wasn't for a Guardian journalist it would still be going on

 

[pastafarian]

Do you know how stupid you sound writing that She is Home Secretary, she should know if anyone has been deported and be able to state without fear of contradiction whether anyone has been deported from this country whatever the case

I guess the proof of the pudding, after she has said she wasnt aware of anyone being deported, will be all the cases suddenly coming to light from those claiming there have been.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

BBC needs to keep up, it was explained earlier in the house that they dont need documentation for every single year they have been here but The Home Office just need to build up an overall picture, which they are now going to try and do via this new special unit,Rudd also said the NTL status fee will be waived for the windrush group

They don't need it, but this is what the Home Office has been insisting on prior to today, and the reason people have been denied cancer treatment and been deported.

 

[Audax]

Sorry, does anyone really think that [MENTION=1416]Ernest[/MENTION] cares more about the Windrush people than sticking it to the Tories?

You're more stupid than he is, if so.

Sorry, but this issue goes well beyond whether or not the motives of the OP are the right motives. Let's stick to the issue and not try to derail it by deconstructing the motives of individuals. What his motive may or may not have been is irrelevant here: the point is that this government has overseen the stripping away of the rights of people who should have been protected under law (and, actually, *had* been until Theresa May's 2014 legislation and subsequent directives to the Home Office to use the new legislation to enforce a "Hostile Environment").

Wrong on two counts:

1. He arrived in the 1960's, but has lived in London since 1973: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...cancer-care-left-die-home-office-commonwealth

2. "Windrush" runs all the way to 1971, with 1973 being the key legal cut-off date for "Windrush" and other immigrants receiving permanent right to remain.

Please read the above.

Also my post #75 contains a direct quote which mentions 1973 being the cut off date.

Unfortunately I may be wrong on the specifics of how long the actual "Windrush generation" lasted - but only because Windrush has in some reporting become synonymous with "Commonwealth" immigration policies that *did* run all the way up to 1971 (or, rather, 1973 by the time the laws that matter came into force). Unfortunately this story is much broader than just the actual Windrush generation. Windrush itself looks to be up to 1962 (when law was passed specific to them), but similar policies remained in place through 1971. Here's an example of the conflation of WIndrush vs wider Commonwealth immigration: https://www.newstatesman.com/politi...n-windrush-government-theresa-may-immigration (and note the interesting snippet there that even the Daily Mail has turned on the government over this...)

Imagine for a moment how outraged the British government would be if one of the Commonwealth nations was treating former British nationals the same way we've been treating the Windrush etc people. People like my dad, whose parents left the UK when he was 10 years old and settled in Australia. In my dad's case, his parents were smart cookies and made sure the family were 'naturalised' and became dual-national citizens - which is the step that most of these Windrush etc folks haven't taken. But we can't blame them for that, given they've always believed (and, until recently, actually had) that they didn't need to in order to retain their right to stay here.

 

[Live by the sea]

First time I am in agreement with the Idiot, it could have been handled much better. However please remember Ernest Idiot that however imperfect Theresa May is, Jeremy Corbyn is at least 10 x worse.

So no most sensible people with even a few brain cells don’t want a Communist as our Prime Minister. Get the message ...

 

[AmexRuislip]

It's the Home Office who have lost the records over the years so they're punishing people for their own inadequacies.

As this is a disgraceful act, by our government, you'd think that there'd be records, held at the National Archives in Kew.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/pathways/citizenship/brave_new_world/immigration.htm
I work with a guy, who is from Grenada, and who's family came over during the initial influx of migrants, to the so called 'motherland'
He doesn't ever really get upset, but this has hit a nerve.
He served in the British Army for several years, and was proud to do so.

 

[pastafarian]

They don't need it, but this is what the Home Office has been insisting on prior to today, and the reason people have been denied cancer treatment and been deported.

I find that odd as there was a lady on the radio earlier explaining how she had confirmed her status by showing only one document which was a statement from HM Revenue & Customs confirming the years of payments of national insurance contributions, something which i did myself a few months ago with great ease.

 

[The Large One]

I guess the proof of the pudding, after she has said she wasnt aware of anyone being deported, will be all the cases suddenly coming to light from those claiming there have been.

Her recent track record is dazzling, for example flatly contradicting a report from her own department which she had had for six weeks - while claiming not to have seen it - stating the the rise in violent crime was not because of the fall in police numbers.

If she doesn't know the numbers, she should have. The story was brewing over the weekend, and basic common sense states that she would have to make a statement to the House on the back of it.

So what happens? She goes into the House without the figures - as if she didn't know she would be asked 'how many?'.

That takes a special kind of incompetence.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I find that odd as there was a lady on the radio earlier explaining how she had confirmed her status by showing only one document which was a statement from HM Revenue & Customs confirming the years of payments of national insurance contributions, something which i did myself a few months ago with great ease.

Why do you find it odd? She might well have found an obliging civil servant.

I have posted several links to MPs, newspaper articles, tweets and lawyers in this thread, and it seems that some of the people affected have been asked for four documents of proof for every year, and £229 to take out British citizenship that they already have.
Amber Rudd has, this afternoon, said the payment is not necessary.

This has been very poor legislation on immigrants, for biometric documents, which has backfired dramatically, and then been exercised on a generation that didn't deserve it or warrant it.

 

[ManOfSussex]

This is an epic **** up even by Home Office standards.

[tweet]985893425038979072[/tweet]

 

[The Large One]

First time I am in agreement with the Idiot, it could have been handled much better. However please remember Ernest Idiot that however imperfect Theresa May is, Jeremy Corbyn is at least 10 x worse.

So no most sensible people with even a few brain cells don’t want a Communist as our Prime Minister. Get the message ...

One - bearing in mind he has never held a government post, you have no evidence to show Corbyn is '10x worse'. He might be - but you're not in a position to state it as fact. Put it this way, your post makes out that whatever Theresa May is doing to the Windrush generation, Corbyn would make a 10x worse hash of it. It's pretty astounding to think that Corbyn would have introduced such a spiteful piece of legislation in the first place. Principally because he wouldn't have.

Two - he's not a Communist, so that point has no meaning.

Three - you're another person using transference and irrelevance here. This story isn't about Jeremy Corbyn - it's about this current government, and up to 50,000 people who may be affected by this policy - yet there's a few of you obsessed with dragging him into it.

Textbook meaningless 'whataboutery'.

 

[WATFORD zero]

I find that odd as there was a lady on the radio earlier explaining how she had confirmed her status by showing only one document which was a statement from HM Revenue & Customs confirming the years of payments of national insurance contributions, something which i did myself a few months ago with great ease.

Yes that will definitely be the answer and the whole thing has obviously been blown out of all proportion

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

No, no, no ERNs you two faced axxe, you have slagged off Osbourne for years, yet now you seem to want to use his words as a beacon for you twisted communist agenda. Do one.

I can't read the OP's posts as I have blocked him. He is, in my view, a tory troll. His trick is to write seemingly supportive threads in favour of labour, but containg flaws that are soon identified, with a view to undermining the cause he appears to be supporting.

Either that or he's a thick hypocrite.

Shame on you [MENTION=1416]Ernest[/MENTION] for starting a poll that can so easily be unravelled. If my views were (and they are not) that these people are just guestworkers and neither they nor their kids have any rights, you will have simply added to my prejudice.

If you really are a labour supporter, do try not to be such a tit with your silly posts. You're beginning to make the Prancing Ninny (also blocked) appear balanced, and that's one hell of a coup.

 

[pastafarian]

Why do you find it odd? She might well have found an obliging civil servant.

I have posted several links to MPs, newspaper articles, tweets and lawyers in this thread, and it seems that some of the people affected have been asked for four documents of proof for every year, and £229 to take out British citizenship that they already have.
Amber Rudd has, this afternoon, said the payment is not necessary.

This has been very poor legislation on immigrants, for biometric documents, which has backfired dramatically, and then been exercised on a generation that didn't deserve it or warrant it.

Legal migrants have been caught up in good legislation on illegal immigrants, its very unfortunate but the problem and situation is being addressed.Doubt she was alone in finding a civil servant saying that single document is sufficient and i find twitter is for idiots in these kind of circumstances.

 

[Wrong-Direction]

Ahh fighting amongst ourselves, just what any good govenment wants.

Sent from my SM-A310F using Tapatalk

 

[pastafarian]

Yes that will definitely be the answer and the whole thing has obviously been blown out of all proportion

I certainly think David Lammy saying earlier in the House that this was "far-right rhetoric" from the home office was certainly blowing it all out of proportion. Far-right? What a bed wetting cock.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I certainly think David Lammy saying earlier in the House that this was "far-right rhetoric" from the home office was certainly blowing it all out of proportion. Far-right? What a bed wetting cock.

David Lammy's parents were part of the Windrush generation. Of course, he has a vested interest in being an opposition MP.

 

[Bozza]

Put it this way, your post makes out that whatever Theresa May is doing to the Windrush generation, Corbyn would make a 10x worse hash of it. It's pretty astounding to think that Corbyn would have introduced such a spiteful piece of legislation in the first place. Principally because he wouldn't have.

Where is the proof that this has been implemented, as you say, out of spite?

My son has a friend at his school from an Indian family. The father of that family as good as told me that once a year some of his relatives from India fly in to the UK, go through some sort of process that means they can continue to claim UK benefits, before flying home again.

I'm fortunate that I've never had the need, yet, to seek any sort of state support so I don't know how feasible this is, but it certainly sounded pretty easy for them to do.

As such, I do have support for legislation that seeks to reduce the ability of those to take from this country without giving back. The Windrush group are clearly not part of that. Maybe it's because I approach things with a positive mindset, believing that most people are fundamentally decent and seek to do the right thing, that I believe this could be more a case of ill-thought out and/or badly administered than a genuine attempt to deport people who deserve to live here.

I'm well aware that your political leanings may make such an approach difficult for you take however.

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

Absolute disgrace.

I really, really want to vote May out.


Sadly comrade Corbynski is far, far worse.

Life under the Tories: NHS in crisis due to chronic underfunding, the rise in food banks, a huge rise in child poverty, a huge rise in homelessness, rip off landlords, welfare cuts, cuts to cooperation tax meaning cooperations pay less tax than their employees, spectacularly missed economic targets, the longest fall in value of wages since records began, the austerity con, the most unaffordable homes ever, massive cuts to police, fire service and education.

Pray tell, how is Corbyn “far, far worse”?

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I certainly think David Lammy saying earlier in the House that this was "far-right rhetoric" from the home office was certainly blowing it all out of proportion. Far-right? What a bed wetting cock.

Certainly not the first 'bed wetting cock' to suggest our current government is far-right