[Other Sport] The real ticket issue?

[Return of the Rev]

With a potential of 4k to 7k not renewing how will the club tempt them along next season,having not renewed this season i have not paid for one ticket on a match by match basis. At £34 for my old seat i wont be rushing up on a match by match,i understand once you drop the one off tickets it will affect overall season ticket sales,what about a mini season ticket or a Saturdays only s/t might help those who travel along way and those with kids?

 

[Gazwag]

With a potential of 4k to 7k not renewing how will the club tempt them along next season,having not renewed this season i have not paid for one ticket on a match by match basis. At £34 for my old seat i wont be rushing up on a match by match,i understand once you drop the one off tickets it will affect overall season ticket sales,what about a mini season ticket or a Saturdays only s/t might help those who travel along way and those with kids?

I cant see how a Saturday only ticket would work, fans would want a refund when games are moved in Jan/Feb/Mar/Apr due to cup matches for us or our opponents and those moved for TV

 

[8ace]

It's a shame they never rolled out smart cards for non STHs, if they had then maybe they could sell a customisable ST.
On the website you could tick all the games you wanted to see, then choose a seat from those available for every game.
Usual price categories would apply, but a sliding scale of discounting would occur depending on the number of tickets purchased (min 5 games).
One booking fee for the whole transaction.

 

[redoubtable seagull]

It will be interesting to see the clubs match day pricing for next season. They will be attempting to attract sales from a much bigger pool people who will pick and choose their games and probably base their decision on how well the team is doing too. A starting adult price of £32 rising to £42 for Cat. A matches (ie for Leeds, Norwich, etc) is going to be difficult sell I think.

 

[Moshe Gariani]

It will be interesting to see the clubs match day pricing for next season. They will be attempting to attract sales from a much bigger pool people who will pick and choose their games and probably base their decision on how well the team is doing too. A starting adult price of £32 rising to £42 for Cat. A matches (ie for Leeds, Norwich, etc) is going to be difficult sell I think.

Ipswich had stupidly high prices and saw their traditionally decent gates dwindle as a result. Anything is possible.

 

[surrey jim]

As someone who did not renew their season ticket last season (due to childcare comitments) I was suprised the club never contacted me to ask why I was not renewing / to try and talk me into another year. Given the above if the club try to contact all 6000 and 5% decide to renew then thats another £150K in the bank (300 @ £500 per season ticket)

What has suprised me the most is that I dont get any emails advising of when tickets are for sale / what matches are coming up and how I can buy them, yet I am on the clubs mailing list as I get random emails / texts, usally marketing items/ products that I dont want or need.

 

[redoubtable seagull]

Ipswich had stupidly high prices and saw their traditionally decent gates dwindle as a result. Anything is possible.

Leeds too. Away fan numbers have dropped dramatically at elland rd - as has their home support, which is remarkable considering they are a massive club and also champions of Europe.

 

[8ace]

It will be interesting to see the clubs match day pricing for next season. They will be attempting to attract sales from a much bigger pool people who will pick and choose their games and probably base their decision on how well the team is doing too. A starting adult price of £32 rising to £42 for Cat. A matches (ie for Leeds, Norwich, etc) is going to be difficult sell I think.

I reckon they decide these categories depending on how many the away team will bring e.g Leeds always travel in numbers so might as well charge them full whack. I doubt the opposition (apart from one or two teams) /price difference affect which games home supporters choose to see that much.

 

[redoubtable seagull]

I reckon they decide these categories depending on how many the away team will bring e.g Leeds always travel in numbers so might as well charge them full whack. I doubt the opposition (apart from one or two teams) /price difference affect which games home supporters choose to see that much.

Agree, the price and performance of the team will be the decider. Forty two quid for a good seat for Championship or L1 is very steep though. If we are not doing well I can't see home supporter match by match sales being all that healthy next season - assuming as the OP is suggesting that between 4 and 7k STHs do not renew.

 

[Return of the Rev]

It's a shame they never rolled out smart cards for non STHs, if they had then maybe they could sell a customisable ST.
On the website you could tick all the games you wanted to see, then choose a seat from those available for every game.
Usual price categories would apply, but a sliding scale of discounting would occur depending on the number of tickets purchased (min 5 games).
One booking fee for the whole transaction.

This is probably the best way forward and would definitely encourage me to start going to selected games again

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

As someone who did not renew their season ticket last season (due to childcare comitments) I was suprised the club never contacted me to ask why I was not renewing / to try and talk me into another year. Given the above if the club try to contact all 6000 and 5% decide to renew then thats another £150K in the bank (300 @ £500 per season ticket)

What has suprised me the most is that I dont get any emails advising of when tickets are for sale / what matches are coming up and how I can buy them, yet I am on the clubs mailing list as I get random emails / texts, usally marketing items/ products that I dont want or need.

They contacted me twice with short term season ticket offers with an upgrade to full for the following season , I put them in the bin
regards
DR

 

[8ace]

This is probably the best way forward and would definitely encourage me to start going to selected games again

Be interesting to know how popular it would be, the only outlay from the club would be the website changes and the cost of issuing the smart cards .

 

[Worried Man Blues]

The only way to get people back in numbers is to attack! Refund for 0-0 draws! CH will then have his work cut out.........

 

[RexCathedra]

What are the odds there's an off-the-shelf software package that calculates maximum revenue from all possible combinations of walk-ups and STH's, at all possible price points?

Universities' business schools are giving degrees in sports management these days.

 

[chaileyjem]

Leeds too. Away fan numbers have dropped dramatically at elland rd - as has their home support, which is remarkable considering they are a massive club and also champions of Europe.

Leeds attendances have had falls and increases but not true to say they've "dropped dramatically". There's no pattern i can detect. The biggest drop was 14% between 2011 - 12 but its also increased by 10%+ in recent seasons and Leeds form has been erratic to say the least. No doubt if they started pushing for the top 6 again it would be pushing the recent 27K peak reached in 10/11 (when they were 7th).

09/10 24,768
10/11 27,296
11/12 23,283
12/13 21,572
13/14 25,089
14/15 23,534 (so far)

 

[chaileyjem]

With a potential of 4k to 7k not renewing

I've seen lots of this speculation and its obviously going to be tough with renewals next season. Some have even predicted a drop off of nearly 50% in ST sales and even 4-7K drops (of average attendance) is a whopping up to 30% fall.

But if you actually look at the data then er...
Wolves were relegated from the Championship in 2012/13 . Their average attendance went down the following season (in L1) by 4%.
Sheffield United - relegated to L1 in 2011/12. Their average attendance went down the following season by less than 1%.

Some clubs (eg: Preston saw attendances drop by about 18% but even they bounced back after a season to previous levels.
Where is the basis for assuming that average attendances will (and thus ST sales) will drop off by these 30/40% amounts in a single season.
Can someone in last ten years point me to a club where this has actually happened before...?

Football is stubbornly inelastic. Fans continue to purchase the product even if prices go up, form goes into freefall and even if clubs get relegated. I expect, without a creative package of prices/cash back perhaps/offers that ST sales will suffer next season but looking for actual data that backs this up. (PS: A NSC poll whilst useful insight doesn't help here).

 

[halbpro]

I've seen lots of this speculation and its obviously going to be tough with renewals next season. Some have even predicted a drop off of nearly 50% in ST sales and even 4-7K drops (of average attendance) is a whopping up to 30% fall.

But if you actually look at the data then er...
Wolves were relegated from the Championship in 2012/13 . Their average attendance went down the following season (in L1) by 4%.
Sheffield United - relegated to L1 in 2011/12. Their average attendance went down the following season by less than 1%.

Some clubs (eg: Preston saw attendances drop by about 18% but even they bounced back after a season to previous levels.
Where is the basis for assuming that average attendances will (and thus ST sales) will drop off by these 30/40% amounts in a single season.
Can someone in last ten years point me to a club where this has actually happened before...?

Football is stubbornly inelastic. Fans continue to purchase the product even if prices go up, form goes into freefall and even if clubs get relegated. I expect, without a creative package of prices/cash back perhaps/offers that ST sales will suffer next season but looking for actual data that backs this up. (PS: A NSC poll whilst useful insight doesn't help here).

On the flip side is there any club that has seen the number of season tickets grow so dramatically over one season, as we did when we moved to the Amex? I feel that may have an effect on the drop, but I can't really back that up.

 

[redoubtable seagull]

QUOTE=chaileyjem;6822676]Leeds attendances have had falls and increases but not true to say they've "dropped dramatically". There's no pattern i can detect. The biggest drop was 14% between 2011 - 12 but its also increased by 10%+ in recent seasons and Leeds form has been erratic to say the least. No doubt if they started pushing for the top 6 again it would be pushing the recent 27K peak reached in 10/11 (when they were 7th).

09/10 24,768
10/11 27,296
11/12 23,283
12/13 21,572
13/14 25,089
14/15 23,534 (so far)[/QUOTE]

My main point regarded away followings at Elland Rd. This season, the average away attendance at Elland Rd is the 5th worst average of the league at just over 1000. Teams that on average attract less are at the the end of the train line, so to speak, ie Cardiff, Middlesbrough, and the two in East Anglia - quite a distance therefore for most clubs. Given Leeds has a large number of well supported clubs within a two to three hour drive time, not to mention 2 of three Yorkshire sides have visited this season and taken less than 2000 without police restrictions in place, I'd say they were a club whose pricing policy is dissuading fans from attending. Other teams' message boards complain about Leeds' ticket pricing - as they do ours as well.

Although my comment about their home support was tongue in cheek it is worth noting that when Bates took over their gates plummeted but then again so has their status. They were getting around 35k in the PL and averaged 28k in the first season of the championship following relegation. They take very good numbers away yet now average mid to low 20k but will pull in 30k when they offer ticket initiatives as they did against us a couple of seasons ago

I do think the club will have to rethink its match day pricing strategy to attract the 'casual' non ST renewer of which many of the Amex STHs I know and listen to on the train would be classified as. £42 for a good seat is a lot to fork out for championship or L1 football and will put off many of the casual fans unless the team is successful.

 

[chaileyjem]

I do think the club will have to rethink its match day pricing strategy to attract the 'casual' non ST renewer of which many of the Amex STHs I know and listen to on the train would be classified as. £42 for a good seat is a lot to fork out for championship or L1 football and will put off many of the casual fans unless the team is successful.

Agreed. And £42 are the best seats in the ground for a few of the matches per season. Ticket prices go as low as £25 for many matches.
The club have already introduced either last year or this; half season tickets, evening season tickets, CAT A,B,C pricing so some matches are cheaper (and others more expensive !!) certain club "season" tickets, kids for a quid, free scarves even that all help reduce pricing substantially if you purchase multiple tickets. In fact the club work quite hard to fill the ground , although they get little credit on here, and they've managed to hold up match day attendances (tickets sold not those turning up which is beyond their control pretty well this season with a 25K+ average.
I also think the club doesn't get enough credit for the free direct debits (no interest) for ST and free travel which fans mostly take for granted these days for those buying one off tickets knocks another few quid off the price.
I'd offer discounts for early renewal of tickets or cashback even and i think a freeze on prices for 2015/16 is almost inevitable especially as increases last year were negligible (and frozen for kids).

 

[chaileyjem]

I do think the club will have to rethink its match day pricing strategy to attract the 'casual' non ST renewer of which many of the Amex STHs I know and listen to on the train would be classified as. £42 for a good seat is a lot to fork out for championship or L1 football and will put off many of the casual fans unless the team is successful.

eek. double posting so edited for relief.