The Jeremy Corbyn thread

[Stato]

You are getting much colder, after clause 4 I would never have voted for the new Tory Party.

So am I to presume those enemies of capitalism the UK Independence Party?

 

[Ernest]

Repeat the LIE enough times and MUGS will believe it

https://corbynnews.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/angela-eagle-team-caught-lying-about.html

 

[Uncle Buck]

Oh dear;

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/1462...arty_suspended_and_election_results_annulled/

 

[beorhthelm]

Repeat the LIE enough times and MUGS will believe it

https://corbynnews.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/angela-eagle-team-caught-lying-about.html

so because the alleged threats werent made to the hotel, they didn't happen?
i cant work out which is worse, the intimidation and threats, or the defense and denial of them occuring

 

[Ernest]

so because the alleged threats werent made to the hotel, they didn't happen?
i cant work out which is worse, the intimidation and threats, or the defense and denial of them occuring

Can you provide ACTUAL proof rather than RUMOURS and the VOICES in your head ?

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

Corbyn

 

[Soulman]

Below is the BBC South East report of the Brighton Momentum meeting held yesterday at the Brighthelme Centre to support Jeremy Corbyn, the room held 300 and I was one of the 200 who was left outside and had to go to the pub instead!

Even more remarkable was that straight afterwards was held the district meeting AGM of Brighton Labour Party (covering the three parliamentary seats of Pavilion, Kemptown and Hove) - in a room for 250 people at City College but 800 turned up!!!!

The meeting had to be held 3 times with 250 people each time entering the hall as 250 left - I was in the third and final sitting. These amazing numbers represented an incredible flowering of democracy and grassroots participation in our town. Happy to say officers were elected to lead Brighton Labour Party all supporting Jeremy Corbyn by big margins. Corbynites are now in charge of the local party here.

https://www.facebook.com/BBCSouthEastToday/videos/10154325192288648/?pnref=story

Well that went well then

"Labour suspends Brighton branch amid accusations of improper ballot

Contest that installed officers supportive of Jeremy Corbyn will have to be rerun"
Labour has suspended its biggest constituency party and annulled the result of a vote that installed officers supportive of Jeremy Corbyn in key posts.

The suspension of Brighton and Hove Labour party happened after accusations of abusive behaviour and an improper ballot at the annual general meeting last week, where leftwingers were elected to a number of offices.

Concerns were also raised with Iain McNicol, the party’s general secretary, about entryism by people who had stood as candidates for the TUSC/Socialist party against Labour.

In response to complaints, the party sent a notice to Brighton, which has 6,000 members, saying it was subject to “administrative suspension” and would have to rerun the contest.

Report from the Guardian so the source should be ok.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics...on-branch-amid-accusations-of-improper-ballot

 

[Machiavelli]

Corbyn View attachment 76560

Nah. That's Sid James.

 

[severnside gull]

so because the alleged threats werent made to the hotel, they didn't happen?
i cant work out which is worse, the intimidation and threats, or the defense and denial of them occuring

The latter.
It's calculated and even trotted (deliberate pun) out before the bullying begins (not by the likes of Earnest obviously) with the aim of creating just enough doubt to let them continue getting away with it.
Corbyn's stunt yesterday of addressing a (banned) meeting of "activists" in a pub via speakerphone leading directly to one of the drunken thugs threatening the local party office staff is a case in point.

 

[Bozza]

Repeat the LIE enough times and MUGS will believe it

https://corbynnews.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/angela-eagle-team-caught-lying-about.html

Oh.

"A man has been arrested on suspicion of making death threats to Labour Party leadership contender Angela Eagle.

The 44-year-old was arrested in Paisley, Renfrewshire after allegedly making threats to kill the Wallasey MP in an email, Merseyside Police said. "

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

Well that went well then

"Labour suspends Brighton branch amid accusations of improper ballot

Contest that installed officers supportive of Jeremy Corbyn will have to be rerun"
Labour has suspended its biggest constituency party and annulled the result of a vote that installed officers supportive of Jeremy Corbyn in key posts.

The suspension of Brighton and Hove Labour party happened after accusations of abusive behaviour and an improper ballot at the annual general meeting last week, where leftwingers were elected to a number of offices.

Concerns were also raised with Iain McNicol, the party’s general secretary, about entryism by people who had stood as candidates for the TUSC/Socialist party against Labour.

In response to complaints, the party sent a notice to Brighton, which has 6,000 members, saying it was subject to “administrative suspension” and would have to rerun the contest.

Report from the Guardian so the source should be ok.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics...on-branch-amid-accusations-of-improper-ballot

As a member of the Anti-Austerity Alliance in Ireland I would like to express my solidarity with the Brighton Labour Party and condemn the actions of the LP HQ in suspending the Brighton branch because they dared to defy the Blairites by election supporters of Jeremy Corbyn.

 

[Titanic]

As a member of the Anti-Austerity Alliance in Ireland I would like to express my solidarity with the Brighton Labour Party and condemn the actions of the LP HQ in suspending the Brighton branch because they dared to defy the Blairites by election supporters of Jeremy Corbyn.

#KeepItComradely

 

[The Antikythera Mechanism]

Nah. That's Sid James.

Sorry

 

[Machiavelli]

Sorry View attachment 76565

We're getting closer.

 

[Eurobound]

Any ABCers fancy meeting up in a pub before going to the next Brghton and Hove Party AGM?

 

[clapham_gull]

The tragedy is democracy. Unfortunately most on here support political parties like football teams. Constantly sniping at the opposition like Palace. Doesn't matter how shit your lot are as long at the opposition is more shit.

The Tories have ended up like Manchester United post Fergie (Thatcher) and Labour like United FC. No idea who their manager is and the the f'@@@ is Corbyn ?

 

[Tarpon]

Report from the Guardian so the source should be ok.

 

[cunning fergus]

I have no guilt. I simply won't vote for Labour whilst they are led by someone who would be out of his depth teaching woodwork and thinks its a good idea to build a nuclear sub without any nuclear weapons. My vote needs earning. The guilt should be with those who are turning Labour into nothing more than a protest group for 1970's ideology.

All this is doing is ensuring the next government is Tory. Your blind loyalty to Jezza is putting you more on the side of Goldman Sachs than you realise because there is more chance of Cameron Diaz knocking on my dooor this evening for a good seeing to than there is of getting BT re-nationalised and making that policy a vote winner.

Just because the Labour Party is in power does not a Labour Party make.

During 3 terms of the last Labour Government the administration turned its back on the working class and traditional support to embrace Tory political ideology. That is why the likes of Fred Goodwin were knighted and the banks were allowed a free run on creating a housing market bubble, in the meantime the Labour Party had opened up the countries labour market to all and sundry which created genuine difficulties for those in this country that were unable to benefit from the flows of money from the banks and were left fighting for ever lower pay and competing with similarly poor low paid migrants for school places, housing etc.

These people may as well been living under a Tory Govt, when they complained they were labelled bigots (see Gillian Duffy).

So they turned away from Labour in Scotland and many started voting UKIP.

UKIP returned 70+ MEPs and won the last Euro election and was pushing Labour hard in working class constituencies in by-elections in their northern constituencies.

Labour ignored the signs..........as far as they were concerned these had never had it so good, and when the referendum came they behave surprised.

Like you.........you just want to rerun the Blairite years and say it's OK. It wasn't then, it won't be again.

You and your centralist neo liberal bullshit is why we are where we are, and let's be clear on Jezza.

He is not my hero, I was gutted he jumped in with the PLP on the referendum, however it is clear why he has such popular support.........he could not be more diametrically opposite to Blair if he tried.

I get that, you are still struggling.
P

 

[cunning fergus]

Is it not a case of moving with the times, accepting that we are now a globalised society and the old arguments of the state vs. private enterprise are, on the most part, redundant. That's what Blair realised at least, and you know, he delivered far more social policy that actually helped people than the great ideologs of the left such as Tony Benn.

No they are not, they are never more relevant.

The cost of trains and quality of service is appalling, the privatisation of the railways has been disastrous for the public, as seen by protests against southern and elsewhere. The trajectory is untenable, and what is worse the Labour Party under Byers cooked the books of Railtrack to deny pensions fair value when it collapsed a truly shameful episode for a supposedly progressive party.

Further, similar arguments can be made about utilities, these have been sold off to global capitalists and the interests of the British people are now subordinate to the demand for shareholder profit, a position embraced by Labour having thrown off their historical commitment to common ownership, thanks to Blair and Mandelson.

We are approaching 20 years from "things will only get better" and I will concede that it looked that way early on, but that progress was built on debt and reckless lending and borrowing, it was an illusion.

It was always going to come to this point...........there can be no turning back, we are reaping what was sown at that time.

 

[cunning fergus]

This from one of our best social and political commentators, in the spirit of Priestley and Orwell:

There’s a fetid cloud of acrimony over Labour – it’s the reek of death
John Harris

Has there ever been a stranger political occasion than Tuesday night’s marathon meeting of Labour’s national executive committee? In an abridged version, the events of those six hours may one day make a good play, awash not just with division and bitterness, but plenty of bathos – from the moment when “the office took a delivery of four crates of sandwiches”, to the aftermath when, in tribute to her leader’s solidarity with the downtrodden, a jubilant member of Jeremy Corbyn’s Westminster team tweeted a picture of two bottles of House of Commons champagne, with the simple caption, “Sweet”. Inside an hour, she had deleted it. Funny, that.


Three decisions taken that night speak volumes about the party’s grim predicament. Whatever the whys and wherefores of that botched “coup”, there is something undeniably odd about a party leader who would apparently struggle to get the support of 51 MPs and MEPs, and the need for a vote to let him on the ballot paper regardless. Stranger still are the new rules on who exactly can vote (which rule out people who have joined in the last six months, while apparently leaving open the possibility than they can resign their memberships, re-register as “supporters”, and then pay £25 to participate). Finally, perhaps the most striking decision of all: the imposition of a kind of internal martial law, whereby “all normal party meetings at CLP and branch level shall be suspended until the completion of the leadership election”.

This is drastic stuff – the party effectively putting its daily operations into suspended animation - and the explanation is obvious enough. There is a fetid cloud of acrimony and spite hanging over Labour, and no end of reports of hateful behaviour dating back to long before this crisis; some of it clearly the preserve of lone inadequates, but other aspects reflective of the old political calculation whereby adversaries are best beaten by making their lives so unpleasant that they simply give up.

Rosie Winterton, the Labour chief whip, has made formal representations to prominent Corbyn allies about the abuse and harassment of MPs. We all know about the brick put through the window of Angela Eagle’s constituency office. Eagle has also had to cancel a forthcoming meeting in Luton after “threatening” phone calls. According to a party member who said she felt “threatened” and ended up in tears, a meeting of the Bristol West constituency party last Thursday saw a hardcore of Corbyn supporters “shouting and screaming” not just at the local MP who had resigned her shadow ministerial post, but “the chair, and anyone with an opposing view, as if they were shouting at Cameron on a protest march”.

In Brighton, the pro-Corbyn group Momentum organised a rally just prior to the local Labour party’s annual meeting last Saturday. There was then a massed walk from one to other, where serving party officers were all summarily replaced by Corbynites. The edges of the meeting were reportedly characterised by what one insider described as “a real nastiness”, manifested in the caretaker of the building being spat at, while two Corbyn supporters later claimed to have been called “scum” and threatened with violence.

Meanwhile, confirming that social media is probably the worst thing that ever happened to the political left, it is full of the hateful discourse in which criticism is tantamount to treachery, and misogyny and antisemitism are never far away. The people responsible are apparently unconcerned about the fact that grinding the Labour party into dust on platforms provided by mega-earning capitalists suggests a certain kind of abject collaboration, but there we are.

Clearly, there are elements from all wings of the party prone to horrible behaviour. But let’s not mess about: right now, the lion’s share of the noise is coming from people who evidently see what they’re doing as part of the defence of their embattled leader. Whether particular elements of the party – Momentum, chiefly – have authorised any of this is hardly the point: of course they haven’t, and many of their people are appalled. But there is also a sense that awful stuff is being tacitly tolerated, as the seriousness of what is happening is either underestimated or completely ignored.


If you doubt this, listen to the Radio 4 interview given by Johanna Baxter, an NEC member from Scotland, describing the meeting and the atmosphere surrounding it. She sounded nervous and close to tears, and with good reason: if you’d had your mobile phone number posted online, and if women colleagues had described rape and death threats, you would be too. For these reasons she urged that the decision on Corbyn be put to a secret ballot – a proposal the leader opposed. “I acknowledge Jeremy has consistently spoken against bullying behaviour and I applaud him for that,” she said. “But when it came to the vote to prevent colleagues taking an extremely difficult decision that would determine the future of our party, he voted against the single thing that he could have done to protect those colleagues.”


Underneath all this, it pains me to say, is a politics that lays claim to high humanitarian ideals, while either practising or tolerating the opposite. It is far too macho, privileging the kind of gobby men who accuse their colleagues of being “****ing useless”, and worse, and neglecting the ways in which less privileged voices might be brought into the conversation. It also represents the outer edge of one of the strands of support for Corbyn that may yet prove to be its downfall: the politics of puritanism, whereby no compromise can ever be brooked, and to even question the leader’s bona fides is to ally oneself with “Blairites”, “warmongers”, and worse.

Just to be clear: the Labour party’s collective ethics have hardly taken this terrible turn after a long spell of loveliness. Down the years, most elements of the left have fallen for the idea that so long as the ends embody this or that lofty principle, the means can be as unpleasant as need be. In that sense, driving people away from meetings and traducing them on Twitter is surely on the same moral spectrum as things that happened in the Blair and Brown years: the fixing of selections, pressuring conference delegates into reading out pre-written speeches, the attempted destruction of people’s careers via “briefing”.


So, though it hardly excuses any of the awfulness, the party is perhaps reaping its own whirlwind: when an organisation’s moral centre implodes (and here, it’s worth the obligatory mention of Iraq), anything goes.

All of which adds to the reek of death, and the sense that this collapse into acrimony is of a piece with Labour’s estrangement from its traditional working-class base, the increasing dominance of a metropolitan hardcore, and the clear impression of unstoppable decline. Corbyn might be bereft of responses to all this, but neither Eagle nor Owen Smith have so far come up with any convincing answers, beyond either the former’s appeal to a hackneyed Labour identity which no longer chimes with the real world (“I’m a strong Labour woman”), or the latter’s reheated version of tax-and-spend social democracy.

At this rate one or both of them will lose, and God only knows what Labour will turn into: a dystopia of intolerance, in all likelihood, from which anyone with any self-respect will walk away.

John Harris did a couple of videos for the Guardian pre Brexit having travelled around the country and he essentially called the result out based on those travels.

Worth watching particularly when he was in Stoke with local working class kippers campaigning next to Tristram Hunt and his supporters. Watching that the only surprise was that Stoke only voted 70% out. Even the other Stoke MP that was local knew the game was up and she was in factories where staff relied on exporting to the EU.

They just didn't realise how angry the people were..........they knew trying to argue positively for what the EU stood for were the very things the people were pissed off with, so debate was pointless.

It was the first time I though "leave" we're in with a squeak.