[Albion] The injustice against Liverpool

[Billy the Fish]

Surprised they haven't had a 2 minute silence and candle lit vigil on Merseyside yet.

Maybe they'll do it tonight.

 

[Billy the Fish]

I’ve said it before, and I will say it again.

There is nothing wrong with VAR. The problem is with the idiots who are manning it. And the way the Premier League uses it.

We could automate offsides very easily, like was used to absolutely no issue in the last World Cup, but we don’t because the Premier League thinks it’s important enough to be different.

Yeah, in this scenario offside is a perfect use for AI.

 

[JBizzle]

I’ve said it before, and I will say it again.

There is nothing wrong with VAR. The problem is with the idiots who are manning it. And the way the Premier League uses it.

We could automate offsides very easily, like was used to absolutely no issue in the last World Cup, but we don’t because the Premier League thinks it’s important enough to be different.

It's arrogance. The Premier League is "the best league in the world" ™ so why on Earth would they look to anywhere else?

What you think other leagues do it better? You think the World Cup went better? Really? Have you seen how amazing the Premier League is? It's the biggliest and richest league and learning from somewhere else implies that someone else is doing it better than The Best League in the World™

Put simply, the World Cup had it right. It simplified the translation of the rules to more basic tenets and allowed the tech to help referees and the PL (in it's wisdom) just went, "nah, we're good bud".

It's arrogance that let "Deano" decide to not put his mate in a tough position.
It's arrogance that let's them assume that an apology is enough.
It's arrogance that enables a ref to fly to Saudi to ref 48 hours before a Premier League match to collect some more bunce.
It's arrogance that the PL refuses to learn from others.

Anyway, rant over. Have a lovely day everyone

 

[Clive Walker]

when was the last time you truly celebrated a goal without at least a nagging doubt in your mind that it might be chalked off seconds/minutes later?

 

[Triggaaar]

’It’ happened five times to us, in one season. Five written apologies.

We should have had more.

 

[JBizzle]

when was the last time you truly celebrated a goal without at least a nagging doubt in your mind that it might be chalked off seconds/minutes later?

Weirdly, the OG and 2x Mitoma goals vs Bournemouth. Didn't even occur to me that they may be ruled out. That said, your point is valid. I regularly check the ref, the lino and the oppo players straight after most goals to see if there's anything going on

 

[raymondo]

It's arrogance. The Premier League is "the best league in the world" ™ so why on Earth would they look to anywhere else?

What you think other leagues do it better? You think the World Cup went better? Really? Have you seen how amazing the Premier League is? It's the biggliest and richest league and learning from somewhere else implies that someone else is doing it better than The Best League in the World™

Put simply, the World Cup had it right. It simplified the translation of the rules to more basic tenets and allowed the tech to help referees and the PL (in it's wisdom) just went, "nah, we're good bud".

It's arrogance that let "Deano" decide to not put his mate in a tough position.
It's arrogance that let's them assume that an apology is enough.
It's arrogance that enables a ref to fly to Saudi to ref 48 hours before a Premier League match to collect some more bunce.
It's arrogance that the PL refuses to learn from others.

Anyway, rant over. Have a lovely day everyone

Spot on. Thank you .

 

[Weststander]

It was Darren England who reffed our game at home against Fulham last season which I think was a fairly universally criticised performance from him. RDZ got sent off for saying to his face what the majority of the crowd and pundits and commentators were saying too.

Over the last 13 months Darren England has gained notoriety, his name on repeat involved in shite one way or another.

Are these jobs for life, no matter the incompetence?

 

[Weststander]

This. It’s ruining the game. I’d rather have the spontaneity and the odd ‘in good faith’ bad decision from the man in the middle than the breathtaking incompetence and inconsistency we’re seeing over and over again from VAR officials.

Before … we had errors.
Now … we have very long delays, then sheer incompetence or judgement calls on pens most disagree with.

VAR can work [internationals and CL officials]. The decisive factor here must be the lack of ability and skill under pressure, VAR has inadvertently found them out.

 

[dazzer6666]

Before … we had errors.
Now … we have very long delays, then sheer incompetence or judgement calls on pens most disagree with.

VAR can work [internationals and CL officials]. The decisive factor here must be the lack of ability and skill under pressure, VAR has inadvertently found them out.

It’s just shifted crap decisions from the field to Stockley Park, with the latter having far less excuse and subject to more scrutiny. I genuinely don’t understand how they can get some things so obviously wrong.

 

[GoingUp]

I don't know why we don't use the automated or semi automated version of VAR that some countries and major competitions use.

Surely it takes out a huge chunk of potential human error.

 

[beorhthelm]

I’ve said it before, and I will say it again.

There is nothing wrong with VAR. The problem is with the idiots who are manning it. And the way the Premier League uses it.

We could automate offsides very easily, like was used to absolutely no issue in the last World Cup, but we don’t because the Premier League thinks it’s important enough to be different.

the people running VAR are VAR, Video Assisted Referee. not Video Automated Referee as some seem to expect, no AI system there making better decisions.

the core problem is that it's used for margin decisions too much, when it was supposed to be used to catch obvious errors the ref on the pitch couldn't see. thats why there should be a time limit, if they cant decide withing 10 sec, then the on pitch decision should hold. also remove lines for offside, if you have to measure (with lines inches wide at scale, body parts obscured) then its not obvious error.

 

[GT49er]

Surprised they haven't had a 2 minute silence and candle lit vigil on Merseyside yet.

Maybe they'll do it tonight.

I very much doubt they'll do anything so silly.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I take no pleasure in it at all. VAR should go until the people using it are vaguely competent. At the moment it’s ruining the fan experience, yet there are still patently incorrect decisions.

And, yes, I know VAR gave us two pens, correctly, against AEK but take the safety blanket away and the on field refs have to start concentrating again.

Like the good old days?

I can accept that if you consider immediacy as the most important part of your football experience then VAR needs to go, even if it worked perfectly.

However to imply the decisions were better when Referees had no safety net is incorrect. Watch a bit of Championship football now to see what its like without VAR. It is exciting and amateurish. I can barely watch it, but that's because I put accuracy before immediacy.

If we accept VAR is here to stay (it may not be, but let's pretend) then the solution MUST be that the VAR ref's decision must be final, restricted to referee errors that result in a goal being scored or denied (this includes balls going in/out that are crossed for a goal) or a player injured. All this bollocks about VAR not piping up unless VAR thinks the on-field ref has made an egregious error must go.

And the VAR officials need to be alert and know the rules of the game, not a pair of wankers. chatting. with one eye on the game and the other on porn hub.

 

[keaton]

Like the good old days?

I can accept that if you consider immediacy as the most important part of your football experience then VAR needs to go, even if it worked perfectly.

However to imply the decisions were better when Referees had no safety net is incorrect. Watch a bit of Championship football now to see what its like without VAR. It is exciting and amateurish. I can barely watch it, but that's because I put accuracy before immediacy.

If we accept VAR is here to stay (it may not be, but let's pretend) then the solution MUST be that the VAR ref's decision must be final, restricted to referee errors that result in a goal being scored or denied (this includes balls going in/out that are crossed for a goal) or a player injured. All this bollocks about VAR not piping up unless VAR thinks the on-field ref has made an egregious error must go.

And the VAR officials need to be alert and know the rules of the game, not a pair of wankers. chatting. with one eye on the game and the other on porn hub.

If you value accuracy this much I'm not sure football or sport in general is for you

 

[nicko31]

Amazing the press they get. Its nothing compared to our injustice at Spurs last season

 

[Baldseagull]

But that will NEVER happen; there will always be human error. Unless there is change those who say "VAR is fine, it's just the people operating it" will still be saying the same thing in ten, twenty, thirty years' time.

Among the many, many threads we've had on this the best one was a discussion about a Guardian article where a top ref said that people think that refereeing is an exact science done badly, and that every decision is either 'right' or 'wrong', whereas it is way more nuanced than that. All VAR is is another layer of fallible decision-making imposed over the top of the existing fallible decision-making. The belief that just because the VAR officials have computers and stuff that they could and should get everything right is quite naive.

But in this case VAR made the right decision, but didn't realise what the on field decision was that he was checking, it should not happen.

 

[fly high]

Weirdly, the OG and 2x Mitoma goals vs Bournemouth. Didn't even occur to me that they may be ruled out. That said, your point is valid. I regularly check the ref, the lino and the oppo players straight after most goals to see if there's anything going on

After all those checks you also have to watch the ref to see if he puts his finger to his ear, usually means VAR is doing a more in depth check.

 

[METALMICKY]

This. It’s ruining the game. I’d rather have the spontaneity and the odd ‘in good faith’ bad decision from the man in the middle than the breathtaking incompetence and inconsistency we’re seeing over and over again from VAR officials.

Is the correct and simple answer. Why was it ever brought in? Was the game being totally ruined by a swath of poor decisions? We tried to create the cure for which there was actually no disease.

Annoying as it was I got over David Ellerray's assertion that it was a corner for Notts County's first goal in the 91 play off final. Not sure Charlie Chivers has!

 

[raymondo]

Over the last 13 months Darren England has gained notoriety, his name on repeat involved in shite one way or another.

Are these jobs for life, no matter the incompetence?

It seems that way...or maybe a huge payoff if they resign