Johnny RoastBeef
These aren't the players you're looking for.
- Jan 11, 2016
- 3,472
Not sure about run stats, but I do know he had 13 touches last night and gave the ball away 6 times.
Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊
[Football] The Harry Kane Problem
- Thread starter Guinness Boy
- Start date
Not sure about run stats, but I do know he had 13 touches last night and gave the ball away 6 times.
...covering for Rice who thinks he needs to play CB most of the time
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,829
I’m not sure if he ever mentioned it. He was not used to using subs at all and many people blamed him for subbing off Bobby Charlton in the world cup against Germany. Beckenbaur had been man marking Bobby, we were winning at the time. When Bobby went off Beckenbaur tore us a new one and they won. That’s my memory of it anyway.
So, there is no evidence that had there been subs Greaves would have played.
Yet again HWT makes me reach for the dictionary......You won't. It is a hypothetical estimation of what might have been the consequence of something different happening. I'm speculating based on Kane's lack of abreaction (or even surprise) when he was subbed off. Ordinarily, as striker talisman and captain, one would not expect to be subbed off unless you and the manager know you are 'not right'. In which case I can't see Kane being shocked and petulant had he been benched.
Anyway, who cares?
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,829
No evidence as such but various autobiographies mention it. It was just accepted that, when asked, Jimmy couldn't guarantee he could finish the 90 minutes. The rest is history and Geoff Hurst is probably still the only player to score a hat-trick in the final.
Not my understanding. This from wiki:
Greaves was fit to play in the final, but manager Alf Ramsey opted against changing a winning team.[102] Only the 11 players on the pitch at the end of the 4–2 win over West Germany received medals. Following a Football Association-led campaign to persuade FIFA to award medals to all the winners' squad members, Greaves was presented with his medal by Gordon Brown at a ceremony at 10 Downing Street on 10 June 2009.[103] In November 2014, Greaves's medal was sold at auction for £44,000.[104]
Greaves played only three more times for England after the 1966 World Cup, scoring a single goal. His final cap came in a 1–0 win over Austria on 27 May 1967.[89] At the time, he was England's all-time top goalscorer but was succeeded the following year by Bobby Charlton. Although Greaves was called up for UEFA Euro 1968, he remained an unused substitute throughout the tournament, as the team finished in third place. He retired from international football early the following year after telling Ramsey that he had no intention of becoming a bit-part player in the England squad.[105]
Mbappe scored 3 in the final in 2022.
Edit: Not including his penalty in the shoot out. I wouldn't normally bother clarifying that, but two of the three goals he scored during the match were penalties as well.
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,829
Accept what you are saying. For years I have thought Geoff Hurst was the only player to score a hat-trick in the final. Seems I must stop using that!
Do you remember watching the game? I was 8 at the time. It seemed to go on for hoursAccept what you are saying. For years I have thought Geoff Hurst was the only player to score a hat-trick in the final. Seems I must stop using that!
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,829
Do you remember watching the game? I was 8 at the time. It seemed to go on for hours
Yes although it is a bit hazy, drink had been taken. We arrived back in Plymouth on HMS Ark Royal after 12 months in the Far East. Didn’t see any of the previous games having arrived on the Wednesday before the final. 58 years ago! Bloody hell! I would have been 18.
macbeth
Dismembered
it’s a management problem, always has been and always will be until southgate goes. played him despite being obviously injured this tournament. stuck him in a system that hasn’t even come close to getting the best out of him. insisted shoehorning foden in despite the two of them not being able to coexist in the same attack.
why was kane so good at spurs? because he had the likes of son making runs beyond him. there are two players in england who can do that, one was used interchangeably with kane, and the other, better one, rashford, is sat at home. are we seriously that surprised kane’s build up play was not good when the whole team was sat inside their own half for the majority of the tournament and the wingers were totally isolated? maybe if he had someone actually making runs on the shoulder of the defence there would be someone for him to create for?
i do think we need to have a conversation about why he’s lost so many finals and make very little impact in each one, but if it’s between keeping kane and keeping the manager there is only one answer
why was kane so good at spurs? because he had the likes of son making runs beyond him. there are two players in england who can do that, one was used interchangeably with kane, and the other, better one, rashford, is sat at home. are we seriously that surprised kane’s build up play was not good when the whole team was sat inside their own half for the majority of the tournament and the wingers were totally isolated? maybe if he had someone actually making runs on the shoulder of the defence there would be someone for him to create for?
i do think we need to have a conversation about why he’s lost so many finals and make very little impact in each one, but if it’s between keeping kane and keeping the manager there is only one answer
Motogull
Todd Warrior
- Sep 16, 2005
- 10,489
I would go further than that. Retire him from international football. The new person will really put a marker own.
He just needs to be dropped from the team if not fit, I don't understand how Southgate couldn't see it. A fit Kane is invaluable and would be an asset at the next world up but he was clearly so far off the pace at the Euros, yet the supposedly excellent coach we had with a simply incredible team spirit couldn't find it within himself to leave him out.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
Beckenbauer pulled 1 back on 68mins when Charlton was still on the pitch. He kept Charlton on longer than he had against the Czechs. Some would argue England played their best football of the tournament between Beckenbauer scoring on 68, and Seeler's bizarre equaliser on 86mins. (remembering Bonnetti was in goal, not Banks). Lost the game in ET, but the narrative that substituting Charlton cost England that game is probably more mythology than fact.
- Feb 22, 2014
- 2,829
I didn't know that. Memory can let you down on occassions and bias probably comes into it.
They also make underpants.( sorry my mistake just looked on the tag on mine it says Skidders ).
Agreed. Plus as captain it is a shame that Kane didn't adopt more of a leadership role for the good of the team role and recognise that his repeated inclusion in the starting 11 was massively detrimental. Especially as Kane is to winning trophies what Uncle Albert is to sailing.
Well, as somebody who was there (there, as in glued to the TV!) at t time, I can assure you that calling out the substitution of Bobby Charlton as losing us the game is in no way after-timing, or hindsight!
Bonetti in goal instead of Banks was a contributory factor, but it was pulling off Charlton that did the real damage - and we knew it at the time!