The great Vicente saga - 2012 edition [All quite exciting in the end]

[Bold Seagull]

This needs to shut down asap. The bloke was given his word from our manager that he would let go if he wanted. He doesnt speak English, has few friends here, no family, has just had a baby, the weather is awful, and has a chance to play his last two years near home.

Just let the bloke go for a hundred grand or so to save face and put his wages in the transfer pot.

Yep. Some slanderous stuff being said about him on this thread. We should have been graceful, said thanks and let him join a nice little club up the road from him. It's not like he's engineered a move to a rival or a big club for a big pay day.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

FWIW I reckon he'll stay. No sources, no insider knowledge, I just think he will. And he will be even more AMAZING this season than he was last.

 

[Triggaaar]

I'm pretty sure that not turning up for work breaches most contracts of employment, no?

No, most people working in this country get paternity leave. Do you know what he's asked for and what the club have agreed to?

 

[B.W.]

I wonder if his contract was/is basically a pay per play deal? In which case maybe it won't cost us anything, or very little, to have him sitting on the stands until next summer and Elche can go and spin!!

For the final time, he is NOT on pay as you play!

 

[B.W.]

Yep. Some slanderous stuff being said about him on this thread. We should have been graceful, said thanks and let him join a nice little club up the road from him. It's not like he's engineered a move to a rival or a big club for a big pay day.

No, he is the one in breach of contract... not slanderous, but fact...

 

[B.W.]

No, most people working in this country get paternity leave. Do you know what he's asked for and what the club have agreed to?

No, he is in breach... a fact you'll just have to accept... paternity is an interesting point but the club said he could stay home an extra week... I suspect nobody on here knows what he has asked for / what we have offered...

 

[Triggaaar]

For the final time, he is NOT on pay as you play!

Sure, but do we only pay him when he's playing?

No, he is the one in breach of contract... not slanderous, but fact...

How is that fact - what is your unquestionable source of information that he hasn't got permission to stay with his family a little longer? Or that Brighton haven't said Elche can have him for £500k, and it's been agreed that Vicente can wait in Spain for a few weeks while they decide?

 

[Bold Seagull]

For the final time, he is NOT on pay as you play!

No, he is the one in breach of contract... not slanderous, but fact...

I suspect nobody on here knows what he has asked for / what we have offered...

Correct with one post, then you state absolute facts in others for which you can't possibly know for sure. You don't know if he's in breach, or what the hell is going on. The only thing I know for sure is that Gus stated the club wouldn't hold him to the second year. That is a fact.

 

[B.W.]

Sure, but do we only pay him when he's playing?
How is that fact - what is your unquestionable source of information that he hasn't got permission to stay with his family a little longer? Or that Brighton haven't said Elche can have him for £500k, and it's been agreed that Vicente can wait in Spain for a few weeks while they decide?

No, we pay him in the normal way...

He was expected to turn up for training... to quote Gus "When a player is under contract you expect him to be here."

 

[the wanderbus]

I'm pretty sure that not turning up for work breaches most contracts of employment, no?

Everybody has the right to withdraw their labour, the employer will then either sack the person or negotiate a return to work.

 

[B.W.]

Correct with one post, then you state absolute facts in others for which you can't possibly know for sure. You don't know if he's in breach, or what the hell is going on. The only thing I know for sure is that Gus stated the club wouldn't hold him to the second year. That is a fact.

I do know (club contact at high-level)... TBH, I don't care whether you believe me or not... another fact that you are choosing to ignore is the most obvious one... Vicente signed a contract with an option for the club (not Poyet) to extend to 2 years... the club have exercised the option... he is therefore under contract, and in breach... in other words, you are spouting bollox...

 

[somerset]

Everybody has the right to withdraw their labour, the employer will then either sack the person or negotiate a return to work.

Ability or freedom to withdraw their labour yes, RIGHT to withdraw it no.

 

[B.W.]

Everybody has the right to withdraw their labour, the employer will then either sack the person or negotiate a return to work.

Anyone can withdraw their labour, but there are consequences of doing so... for example, not getting paid... back to the world of football, our club are entitled to protect their assets and, believe it or not, Vicente is one of them... this is why transfer fees exists, and we can value him at what other transfer fee we like... it is up to the prospective buying club to match the fee we want, whether that is 10p or £10M... if the agreement of the required fee isn't forthcoming, then the player should not be even talking to the other club...

 

[Bold Seagull]

I do know (club contact at high-level)... TBH, I don't care whether you believe me or not... another fact that you are choosing to ignore is the most obvious one... Vicente signed a contract with an option for the club (not Poyet) to extend to 2 years... the club have exercised the option... he is therefore under contract, and in breach... in other words, you are spouting bollox...

Not at all. I've not stated whether he is in breach or not. Time to get off the high horse I think!

 

[dingodan]

I move that this thread be closed.

All those in favor say "Aye"...

 

[sparkie]

Aye. We can have a new thread when anything new comes out into the open.

 

[Triggaaar]

No, we pay him in the normal way...

Woosh.

He was expected to turn up for training... to quote Gus "When a player is under contract you expect him to be here."

Could you post a link to that quote please. Did he say it this week?

 

[narly101]

Vicente who?

 

[gazingdown]

This is stupid, no-one here has the actual contract in their hands do they? No-one here will KNOW the exact contents of the contract. Few people (certainly not any attention seekers on here ) will know what has been agreed between the player and the club.

Anyway, I expect there's plenty of provisions for not turning up to work/play/training, such as:
sickness
standard paternity leave
agreed extension of paternity leave
agreed holiday (or extension of)
exceptional circumstances
etc. etc.

In other words, the contract may require him to turn up to training BUT in agreement with player/club/manager the player may not turn up for whatever reason.

"Hi club, I would like another week or two off (new baby and all that), is that OK?"
Club either says "Yes, that's OK" or "No, you must turn up".
He'd be in breach if the club said "No" and he didn't turn up. He'd NOT be in breach if the club said "Yes" and he didn't turn up.

Anyway, as I say, I doubt (well, am pretty sure) no-one here actually has the contract nor knows exactly what communication has been made between the club and the player.

 

[Nathan]

Fact.