The club letter to the Bournemouth Harvesters...

[Bwian]

... and if more tickets had been available for the Bournemouth cup tie, how many in the lower loyalty tiers would have actually gone ? Do you think - given the chance - they would have 'harvested' too ?

I think it is quite likely a lot wouldn't have (gone-that is)-it wasn't as if it was going to be the first team in a glamour tie was it? Still, that is all water under the bridge...

 

[Dave the OAP]

Could I ask what actions are being taken for season ticket holders that do not go to a game? they have purchased a ticket for every game for which they receive 150 loyalty points over the year. Do they get told off as well?

I will have missed the Man City game and Everton......bad fan. BUT my daughter is having my Everton ticket. And she had the city one.

 

[ac gull]

I am the opposite made Man City and be at Everton game - missed the other two

No one had the seat as ticket exchange never opened and its illegal to sell tickets on etc etc

 

[Bozza]

We're both guessing

Sorry - I forgot about this. From the horse's mouth. Seems fair enough to me...

"The second and subsequent windows we have started to make narrower to try to ensure the scheme is as fair as possible. We were particularly conscious of this for Man Utd and the likely popularity of the game and we will continue to review this based on anticipated popularity. It’s always a balance though as the narrower you make the windows the more friends and family groups have issues with applying for tickets together and sitting together. I’m afraid though that we wont be issuing the details of how many people are in each window."

 

[dazzer6666]

Sorry - I forgot about this. From the horse's mouth. Seems fair enough to me...

"The second and subsequent windows we have started to make narrower to try to ensure the scheme is as fair as possible. We were particularly conscious of this for Man Utd and the likely popularity of the game and we will continue to review this based on anticipated popularity. It’s always a balance though as the narrower you make the windows the more friends and family groups have issues with applying for tickets together and sitting together. I’m afraid though that we wont be issuing the details of how many people are in each window."

Thanks for asking.

Agree, seems ok. So basically T2 is pretty much the number they expect to be left after all those guaranteed in T1 have had the chance to but didn’t.......

Old Trafford is pretty crap, but will sell out in T2.

 

[Mackenzie]

The club are missing a trick, what about selling loyalty points?

Our richest (and therefore most important) supporters could buy points ensuring prime tickets at any game they choose. The bought loyalty points are only valid for one match. The new scheme will mean that our club will benefit from sales of away tickets as only bought loyalty will get the best seats.

It's an untapped market which will allow us to pay more wages out to our players (and their agents).which will make them better. See the England team as an example.

Yes, I'm being facetious.

 

[darkwolf666]

Without a doubt the loyalty points were abused at Bournemouth but surely weren't the fans that abused the system
Fans with enough points to abuse the system I.e. Fans that had earned enough points by watching the Albion previously.probably in less successful times to allow them the ability to abuse the system.The points needed per game is calculated so that the most loyal fans get first dibs
& then it is reduced as seems necessary.How many of the fans that complained about the so called abuse would have complained if (a) we were not in EPL or (b) no loyalty points available.


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You are clearly missing the point, as it is the very act of harvesting the points to keep their own points tally up which has denied others the chance to get some points and gain ground on the elite...

 

[Steve in Japan]

Could I ask what actions are being taken for season ticket holders that do not go to a game? they have purchased a ticket for every game for which they receive 150 loyalty points over the year. Do they get told off as well?

As usual, there is a fair bit of fundamentalism creeping into this thread. Football is not a matter of life or death, nor is it more serious than that. As a STH, If I don't want to attend a home game, or I can't, then so what?

I missed the Newcastle game. I was at a funeral. I'm pretty sure I did the right thing.

 

[drew]

You are clearly missing the point, as it is the very act of harvesting the points to keep their own points tally up which has denied others the chance to get some points and gain ground on the elite...

That comment seems to reaffirm the notion that had some of those in tier 1 and 2 not 'harvested' points then maybe those in 3 and 4 would have done exactly the same thing!

 

[Jack Daniels]

No. If you’re in Tier 3 then you will see the points gap to Tier 2 increase over this season as there will only be a few games you can buy tickets for, while those in Tiers 1 and 2 move further ahead. But your position in the queue is the only thing that matters and this remains exactly the same. It doesn’t matter if you’re 10 points or 100 points off Tier 2, if you’re 5,000th in line then you still will be the next time a game doesnt sell out to the 4,999 people above you.

So anybody in Tier 3 and 4 isn’t going to get much of a look in this season as demand is so high. But do you think all the same 3,000 people want to go back to Leicester next season? Or Watford? Or Swansea? No chance. So those in Tier 3 will be first in the queue to capitalise when demand falls next season. Plus they will get tickets for Huddersfield, Burnley, Stoke etc this season as they almost got a sniff of Swansea where there are only 2,000 seats, so other unattractive games with 3,000 will certainly go to Tier 3.

Unless their is swansea loop hole that can be unfairly exploited by some and not others. No doubt including some of the most vocal critics of Bournemouthgate.

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[kjgood]

Exactly the point I was trying to make in the two posts I posted on the subject, absolutely you did the right thing in taking care of your personal priorities rather than going to a game of football. If you buy a theatre ticket and dont attend for whatever reason the theatre wouldnt write to you and tell you off for being naughty.

For clarity I was not one of the people who purchased a ticket for Bournemouth and didnt attend, I was someone who wanted to go but couldnt get a ticket just like for the Arsenal and West Ham games. Like others I am frustrated that now we are in the big time, my access to attend matches is greatly reduced, its hard to get to see the team that you have trogged up to watch in god forsaken holes when we were not famous. For me Its difficult now to get to home games as i'm getting older, i struggle with a 440 mile 8 or 9hours drive plus the game and hassle of getting to and from the AMEX from where I park my car in one go and thats why I gave my ST up (At the wrong time) but two hours on a train to London for an away game is great, but now i cant because I am excluded as a fan from buying a ticket and the gap will get bigger and bigger.

My point is that if the club are going to tell those off who like you had a legitimate reason not to attend the Bournemouth game then the same standard should be applied accross the board. When I was a ST holder in the list of tickets purchased in my account they listed every home game ticket as a ticket purchased seperately as the games ticked off. So whats different?

As usual, there is a fair bit of fundamentalism creeping into this thread. Football is not a matter of life or death, nor is it more serious than that. As a STH, If I don't want to attend a home game, or I can't, then so what?

I missed the Newcastle game. I was at a funeral. I'm pretty sure I did the right thing.

 

[Steve in Japan]

My point is that if the club are going to tell those off who like you had a legitimate reason not to attend the Bournemouth game then the same standard should be applied accross the board. When I was a ST holder in the list of tickets purchased in my account they listed every home game ticket as a ticket purchased seperately as the games ticked off. So whats different?

To be clear, I didn't want to go to Bournemouth and didn't buy a ticket. I missed the home game vs Newcastle.

And for what it's worth, I don't generally go to Away games so the current furore over Loyalty Points doesn't really bother me. And it won't unless Barber starts keeping an attendance register on home games.

I do think the Club made a mistake re the Bournemouth game, and then compounded it by overreacting.

 

[Biscuit]

8 pages in.. I'm guessing nobody has uploaded a copy of the letter yet?

 

[dazzer6666]

Exactly the point I was trying to make in the two posts I posted on the subject, absolutely you did the right thing in taking care of your personal priorities rather than going to a game of football. If you buy a theatre ticket and dont attend for whatever reason the theatre wouldnt write to you and tell you off for being naughty.

For clarity I was not one of the people who purchased a ticket for Bournemouth and didnt attend, I was someone who wanted to go but couldnt get a ticket just like for the Arsenal and West Ham games. Like others I am frustrated that now we are in the big time, my access to attend matches is greatly reduced, its hard to get to see the team that you have trogged up to watch in god forsaken holes when we were not famous. For me Its difficult now to get to home games as i'm getting older, i struggle with a 440 mile 8 or 9hours drive plus the game and hassle of getting to and from the AMEX from where I park my car in one go and thats why I gave my ST up (At the wrong time) but two hours on a train to London for an away game is great, but now i cant because I am excluded as a fan from buying a ticket and the gap will get bigger and bigger.

My point is that if the club are going to tell those off who like you had a legitimate reason not to attend the Bournemouth game then the same standard should be applied accross the board. When I was a ST holder in the list of tickets purchased in my account they listed every home game ticket as a ticket purchased seperately as the games ticked off. So whats different?

They still do to a point.....my son couldn’t make the Man City game so I upgraded his ticket to full adult and took a mate, this particular game shows on his account/profile as ‘cancelled’ now (although doesn’t affect the ST points - but bearing in mind it’s only 20 points per season anyway it shouldn’t). It does imply they are tracking how STs are used though (or at least have the capability to do so - presumably unused STs for any game are logged)

 

[Lush]

8 pages in.. I'm guessing nobody has uploaded a copy of the letter yet?

Club still checking the legal implications of what they're going to say/do?

I would still add the points for those who didn't turn up, but at the end of the season.

 

[darkwolf666]

That comment seems to reaffirm the notion that had some of those in tier 1 and 2 not 'harvested' points then maybe those in 3 and 4 would have done exactly the same thing!

No it doesn't, I was saying those in tier 1 & 2 that cheated - as that's what it was, so let's stop saying "harvested" - have denied others the possibility of accruing some points themselves by buying tickets AND going to the game!

 

[matski_98]

Club still checking the legal implications of what they're going to say/do?

I would still add the points for those who didn't turn up, but at the end of the season.

They've already said that they're doing nothing about it this time (apart from sending out some stroppy letters) but *may* do something in the future

 

[matski_98]

They still do to a point.....my son couldn’t make the Man City game so I upgraded his ticket to full adult and took a mate, this particular game shows on his account/profile as ‘cancelled’ now (although doesn’t affect the ST points - but bearing in mind it’s only 20 points per season anyway it shouldn’t). It does imply they are tracking how STs are used though (or at least have the capability to do so - presumably unused STs for any game are logged)

They've tracked ST usage and shown it on the website for a few seasons now. They need to do this to keep track on the number of child seat upgrades etc.

 

[papa_stew]

Thanks to all for clarifying to some degree.
TCB - I get what you say but those who it appears cannot get out of tier 3 are then in a bun fight with presumably a few more thousand supporters rather than ever able to compete in the "elite" top 2 tiers.

No. If you’re in Tier 3 then you will see the points gap to Tier 2 increase over this season as there will only be a few games you can buy tickets for, while those in Tiers 1 and 2 move further ahead. But your position in the queue is the only thing that matters and this remains exactly the same. It doesn’t matter if you’re 10 points or 100 points off Tier 2, if you’re 5,000th in line then you still will be the next time a game doesnt sell out to the 4,999 people above you.

So anybody in Tier 3 and 4 isn’t going to get much of a look in this season as demand is so high. But do you think all the same 3,000 people want to go back to Leicester next season? Or Watford? Or Swansea? No chance. So those in Tier 3 will be first in the queue to capitalise when demand falls next season. Plus they will get tickets for Huddersfield, Burnley, Stoke etc this season as they almost got a sniff of Swansea where there are only 2,000 seats, so other unattractive games with 3,000 will certainly go to Tier 3.