[Politics] The 2024 US Election - *MATCH DAY*

[Gwylan]

Mainstream news organisations have to be able to stand behind their stories, they get successfully sued if they can’t. Find a professional journalist and talk to them about what has to have happened before a newspaper editor will allow your story to run at a reputable organisation. It doesn’t go straight from laptop to print I assure you.

The value of the media lies in its accountability. They have to publish corrections if they mislead. 4chan man just deletes his account and starts again with a new username.

Absolutely. Every journalist is well schooled in media law and anything slightly dodgy is pulled apart by an editor. I've been sued twice for libel: once when we had no grounds to print the story (the plaintiff dropped the case though) and the second when we did have grounds (and were subsequently proved correct but the publisher settled). I've also had to interrupt a holiday to attend a meeting with a city law firm that wanted my arse (that one was soothed over).

But those are three examples when we didn't quite get it right ... think of the many hundreds of stories where we (and other journalists) got things right: think of the phone calls made, the checks and cross checks to stand up a story. The idea that dozens of news outlet manufacture untruthful stories is a ludicrous but what's even more ludicrous is the idea that news organisations will ignore a compelling story.

I feel sorry for the Dingo view of the world, when someone's that far gone, there's no sense in trying to reason with him

 

[peterward]

Question - Is the Murdoch media part of the MSM cult?

Is Tucker Carson or Steve Bannons Breitbart? Or are those more authorative and more trustworthy than the BBC?

Crawley Dingo is a conspiracy theorist stuck down his own little rabbit hole, rabbiting nonsense straight from his hole.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

A tale in 4 tweets

Trump has a tremendous innate talent for infighting and backstabbing. Emmer voted to certify the 2020 election results. If he'd opposed Emmer from the start, Emmer wouldn't have gotten in. By opposing Emmer now, he's humiliating and ruining him publicly in front of his colleagues. Trump is vicious to his intraparty rivals and has a Stalin-level talent for infighting, which makes him the most terrifying kind of leader of all: he relishes and delights in destroying his internal rivals and holds grudges across years and even decades. Just when you think he's forgiven you he stabs you in the back. Really incredible stuff.

Trump baited Emmer into publicly begging for support, appeased everyone by saying he was staying neutral...and just when Emmer seemed on the cusp of victory Trump pounced and destroyed him because he never actually forgave the grudge and was just looking for the opportunity to utterly destroy and humiliate Emmer in front of everyone to assert his total dominance over the party yet again, over Emmer's broken, crumpled body of a leadership bid. It's just a power play for the ages.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Trump has a tremendous innate talent for infighting and backstabbing. Emmer voted to certify the 2020 election results. If he'd opposed Emmer from the start, Emmer wouldn't have gotten in. By opposing Emmer now, he's humiliating and ruining him publicly in front of his colleagues. Trump is vicious to his intraparty rivals and has a Stalin-level talent for infighting, which makes him the most terrifying kind of leader of all: he relishes and delights in destroying his internal rivals and holds grudges across years and even decades. Just when you think he's forgiven you he stabs you in the back. Really incredible stuff.

Trump baited Emmer into publicly begging for support, appeased everyone by saying he was staying neutral...and just when Emmer seemed on the cusp of victory Trump pounced and destroyed him because he never actually forgave the grudge and was just looking for the opportunity to utterly destroy and humiliate Emmer in front of everyone to assert his total dominance over the party yet again, over Emmer's broken, crumpled body of a leadership bid. It's just a power play for the ages.

He's such a weird guy.

 

[peterward]

He's such a weird guy.

That's not the weirdest part though. History is full of narcissists and wannabe dictators.

The weirdest bit is he has one of US 2 largest parties eating out of his hand, and a whole caucus of brain dead thickos who hang on his every lie.

 

[Badger Boy]

That's not the weirdest part though. History is full of narcissists and wannabe dictators.

The weirdest bit is he has one of US 2 largest parties eating out of his hand, and a whole caucus of brain dead thickos who hang on his every lie.

I find it so incredibly hard to understand why so many are so duped by a fat old man who is inarticulate, rambly and with a hideously ugly personality and vision of the country. What's to like? His businesses chronically fail so he's not particularly successful. He should be national laughing stock but for some reason he's got a huge pack of people following his every move.

 

[A1X]

I find it so incredibly hard to understand why so many are so duped by a fat old man who is inarticulate, rambly and with a hideously ugly personality and vision of the country. What's to like? His businesses chronically fail so he's not particularly successful. He should be national laughing stock but for some reason he's got a huge pack of people following his every move.

A large part of it is because he tells them he hates the same people they've been trained to by their chosen news sources / online echo chambers (Muslims, gay people, "libtards", communists, the Mexicans, black people etc.). He's the one who "says it like it is" and it fighting "the corrupt establishment" who are all conniving to make their lives worse by descending en masse to take their jobs and their guns, and to vaccinate their kids. Because all this is so vague and ultimately bollocks it explains why you get so many of the videos previously posted where they tie themselves up in knots when challenged.

 

[US Seagull]

A large part of it is because he tells them he hates the same people they've been trained to by their chosen news sources / online echo chambers (Muslims, gay people, "libtards", communists, the Mexicans, black people etc.). He's the one who "says it like it is" and it fighting "the corrupt establishment" who are all conniving to make their lives worse by descending en masse to take their jobs and their guns, and to vaccinate their kids. Because all this is so vague and ultimately bollocks it explains why you get so many of the videos previously posted where they tie themselves up in knots when challenged.

And the risk of invoking Godwin's law, this is an old playbook. See Germany c. 1933.

 

[A1X]

And the risk of invoking Godwin's law, this is an old playbook. See Germany c. 1933.

As someone with a history degree, I’ll happily defend you from any such accusations. The parallels are frightening.

 

[Klaas]

As someone with a history degree, I’ll happily defend you from any such accusations. The parallels are frightening.

Didn't Godwin himself say his own law shouldn't be invoked for the people/tactics we are seeing in recent times?

 

[schmunk]

Didn't Godwin himself say his own law shouldn't be invoked for the people/tactics we are seeing in recent times?

Not exactly: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

"In December 2015, Godwin commented on comparisons to Nazism and fascism being made by several articles between Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump, saying: "If you're thoughtful about it and show some real awareness of history, go ahead and refer to Hitler when you talk about Trump, or any other politician."[13] In August 2017, Godwin made similar remarks on social media with respect to the two previous days' Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, endorsing and encouraging comparisons of its alt-right organizers to Nazis.[14][15]"

"In March 2022, Godwin wrote "you're not going to believe who this guy reminds me of" about Vladimir Putin, actually using his own rule.[17]"

 

[nwgull]

As someone with a history degree, I’ll happily defend you from any such accusations. The parallels are frightening.

It's basically giving a large proportion of the population someone to blame for their life and prospects being a bit mediocre, innit? Same happened with Brexit; lots of leave voters were convinced the EU was to blame for whatever crap stuff was going on in their lives.

 

[marlowe]

Given that there are now four precedents for plea deals in return for relatively very lenient sentences and conditions, I know this would obviously never happen, but I have mused on a scenario where as a means of extricating himself from the situation Trump himself offers to make a plea deal in return for testifying against the other remaining defendants.

He would obviously need to get in quick before there are no other defendants to testify against.

In the unlikely event that he made such an offer and it was accepted and he pleaded guilty i'm sure his "credibility" wouldnt be remotely damaged amongst his supporters. They would just interpret it as him being very clever and getting one over his opponents.

I wonder which of the remaining 15 defendants would not be considered a candidate for a plea deal. There also has to be a cut off point. Theyre not going to keep accepting plea deals until only Trump is remaining as a defendant.

 

[Badger Boy]

Given that there are now four precedents for plea deals in return for relatively very lenient sentences and conditions, I know this would obviously never happen, but I have mused on a scenario where as a means of extricating himself from the situation Trump himself offers to make a plea deal in return for testifying against the other remaining defendants.

He would obviously need to get in quick before there are no other defendants to testify against.

In the unlikely event that he made such an offer and it was accepted and he pleaded guilty i'm sure his "credibility" wouldnt be remotely damaged amongst his supporters. They would just interpret it as him being very clever and getting one over his opponents.

I wonder which of the remaining 15 defendants would not be considered a candidate for a plea deal. There also has to be a cut off point. Theyre not going to keep accepting plea deals until only Trump is remaining as a defendant.

Personally, I don't think they'd let him. I think they want to hang him out to dry and hold him responsible for his crimes. He orchestrated it, he demanded it happen and he intended to benefit from the whole scheme. He's the one they want and rightly so, everyone else was following his orders and they are liable to face the consequences of their actions and have their day in court but it's imperative to the rule of law that Trump himself be held accountable.

 

[schmunk]

Personally, I don't think they'd let him. I think they want to hang him out to dry and hold him responsible for his crimes. He orchestrated it, he demanded it happen and he intended to benefit from the whole scheme. He's the one they want and rightly so, everyone else was following his orders and they are liable to face the consequences of their actions and have their day in court but it's imperative to the rule of law that Trump himself be held accountable.

This.

Even in the very unlikely situation where Trump apologises, admits guilt and agrees to go along with the "liberal elite" public justice system, there's no way the judge would give up the opportunity for a proper trial and punishment of the main offender, which seems increasingly likely as the others line up for the prosecution.

 

[Seagull58]

Given that there are now four precedents for plea deals in return for relatively very lenient sentences and conditions, I know this would obviously never happen, but I have mused on a scenario where as a means of extricating himself from the situation Trump himself offers to make a plea deal in return for testifying against the other remaining defendants.

He would obviously need to get in quick before there are no other defendants to testify against.

In the unlikely event that he made such an offer and it was accepted and he pleaded guilty i'm sure his "credibility" wouldnt be remotely damaged amongst his supporters. They would just interpret it as him being very clever and getting one over his opponents.

I wonder which of the remaining 15 defendants would not be considered a candidate for a plea deal. There also has to be a cut off point. Theyre not going to keep accepting plea deals until only Trump is remaining as a defendant.

I'm sure they will allow any or all of the defendants, including Trump, to make a plea deal. I think 80% of American cases are resolved this way. However, the terms of each subsequent plea deal are likely to be far more onerous for each defendant. For example, some murder cases are resolved by the defendant pleading guilty and accepting life in prison, often without parole, to avoid the possibly of going to trial and getting the death penalty. If Trump ultimately gets charged with treason in the stolen documents case the death penalty is on the table. That may concentrate his decrepit mind somewhat.

 

[Seagull58]

This.

Even in the very unlikely situation where Trump apologises, admits guilt and agrees to go along with the "liberal elite" public justice system, there's no way the judge would give up the opportunity for a proper trial and punishment of the main offender, which seems increasingly likely as the others line up for the prosecution.

Do you think so? I believe that the DoJ would be happy to negotiate a plea deal with Trump, especially in the documents case, but I doubt that the offered terms would be very palatable to him. If a new treason indictment is added, which is certainly a possibility, it will get very interesting, as the death sentence comes into play.

 

[knocky1]

Turkish President happy with his twat cap from the 45th US President. Fu*ked world if the 47 on the hat occurs.

 

[Seagull58]

DId he send it to Hungary or Turkey?

 

[Greg Bobkin]

That's not the weirdest part though. History is full of narcissists and wannabe dictators.

The weirdest bit is he has one of US 2 largest parties eating out of his hand, and a whole caucus of brain dead thickos who hang on his every lie.

I mean, everything about him is weird!